Really starting to reflect on things and need advice? Forum

[Progress01]

Would it make any sense to place my deposit at my top pick when the day rolls around in April, begin studying for the LSAT again now (as best I can), retake in June, and if I see even a 6-10 point improvement, chuck the deposit and sit out and wait?

That way, I've got a safety net if I don't improve at all, and if there's even minimal progress, it means there's hope for a larger improvement.

[Nova]

You seem really busy right now. October would probably be better for you.

[Nova]

The lsat is more important than 4 years of undergrad, so attending law school with a 15x without really studying would be a huge mistake.

[hopeful 0L]

That being said, I feel staying here an extra year is a bad idea. Also I feel moving hours from my parents, to work a minimum wage or close to it job with two truly worthless degrees, isn't really the greatest financial move either. So it's lose-lose.
I do have trust issues, that part of your post I'll agree with. There are things that have happened to me, that I don't wish to put on the internet.
But the schools I have been accepted at shouldn't be one of them:
Maine
Vermont
U. of D.C. (No thanks)
University of Dayton
Cleveland Marshall (No thank you)
Toledo (No thanks)
Akron (you don't have to tell me, I'm running from this scholarship because I know how this works)
South Dakota (No)
Willamette
Cal Western
Pace

I applied to Pace and Vermont for their environmental programs.
Dayton holds close proximity to the grandparents.
And Maine the area just really, really appeals to me.

I'm also waitlisted at Syracuse. I was told I was waitlisted instead of flat out rejected because of the science major. Syracuse is still Tier II, and that definitely appeals to me.

I have been rejected from every other Tier II school (and okay, I only applied to 6 Tier IIs--three of which I haven't heard back from yet.)
Still waiting to hear back from Oregon, University of San Diego, and Case Western.

And no, for anyone wondering, I didn't even apply at Cooley.

There's no nice way to say this, so I should apologize now for any offense...do you really want a third worthless degree? "Worthless" probably isn't the right word, but do you really want another degree that will leave you--in all likelihood--with a set of undesirable outcomes vs. a set of even less desirable outcomes?

It might not seem like it, but I'm not saying this to be judgmental or condescending, but rather to help. I can empathize with your situation--I had a pretty shitty gpa too. Because of that, I told myself that law school wouldn't be worth it unless I hit a certain number on the LSAT. I hit that number and I'm still not sure that law school is the best move.

Now obviously it's up to you to make (or not make) a similar determination, but my advice is that you should. No one is saying that you shouldn't go to law school at all. What most on this thread are saying is that with your current numbers/choices, law school is a very dangerous proposition. Please don't perpetuate these (insert mean word here) schools that take advantage of kids by taking large sums of their (in this case your) money in exchange for a 1/4 or optimistically 1/2 change of landing a job practicing law.

Sorry if that was in any way rude, and good luck.

[Gooner91]

What is your big rush to go this cycle? Is it just pressure from your mom? You seem like you are very young? It will not hurt you in your application to sit out this cycle and maybe next if your LSAT is not where you want it. If anything that added experience will help. Your safety net in my opinion should be sit out, not attending one of these schools.

Maybe you have a good reason to need to attend and I missed it.

[d cooper]

Attending any of those schools with whatever scholarship they are offering you would be a monumental mistake for the mere fact that you sold yourself way short. A 154 is a bad LSAT score, and the test deserves more than one month of study. Try six as a starting point. You can do better.

Sit out a year, get some work experience, raise your LSAT, and you will be so very glad you didn't screw yourself with these toilet tier offers. Take it from someone who sat out an additional year and took the test three times.

Have a target score, not a target time frame.

[Legacy Rabbit]

I am reading these replies and no one is mentioning that OP was accepted into T3 and T4 schools with as much as 3/4 in money. Therefore his only "issue" will be graduating from a lower ranked school, but not from a lower ranked school with debt.

I will play devil's advocate because I work, and as oppose to going straight law school from undergrad I continued working, which makes it even more stressful to return to school and miss out on practicing law earlier.

The TLS mantra is retake, which is correct and the most justified; this is the best advice that is given on this site. However, finishing school and getting started in your career as soon as possible, especially when the opportunity is given, is something you really need to think long and hard about. You have already stated that you have been accepted to schools with money, decent money, you can continue your education, stay focused and study for the bar, and be ready without delay to being practicing as an attorney.

Uhh, no. Even 3/4 scholarship means graduating with around 75k in debt after you factor in COL.
75k debt and a JD from Cooley is an objectively horrible situation to be in.

Going back and forth is useless because a) OP never gave any instance of numbers. You are assuming $75k from your own background. b) going into a Cooley debate never ends. I personally know Cooley graduates who are doing very well, albeit making money in business and not practicing. But, the TLS move is why go to law school if you are not going to practice.

OP needs to consider all options. Studying for a higher score is ideal, but OP needs to really plan and decide if he is going to invest what is needed to increase his score an additional 15-20 points. Or, OP can move forward to school now, and take the money.

This is bad advice. There are almost no circumstances where graduating with any debt (including COL debt) from a TTT is a good idea.

First, how exactly is telling someone to consider all options bad advice?? Just because you have a hard time selling yourself during interviews, if you are even able to reach the interview point, because your resume is weak, does not predict the OP will not practice if he chooses a TTT or TTTT.

I will reiterate, The OP must be willing to grind hard....really hard to raise his score which statistically few do, per LSAC. Yes, the LSAT is a learnable test, but those who learn the test, treat the test like a full time job with mandatory OT. To even raise his score 6-10 point by June 2014 necessitates a high level of dedication to this test. OP is at a 154. He has not yet broken 160, he fundamentally lacks key understanding of the test, which of course he can learn, but is OP willing / able to put in the time?

Any person who is going to give up scholarship money, at any ranked school, needs to seriously take this into consideration.

Your advice is fundamentally immature.

[malleus discentium]

ETA: Just realized who this cat is. Consider me not feeding him.

[Progress01]

I just looked up the stats on LSAC's website--someone with my number in 2010-2011 on their spreadsheets increased their score by about 2 points on a retake. That was it. No 154s even broke into the 170's on a retake, and I have according to those numbers about a 23-24% chance of pushing into the 160s on a retake. Is it worth those odds?
All I remember from test day, was I ran out of time on my LG section--the one that turned out being the REAL one and not the experimental. So guessed on the whole last game and a half as he yelled to put our pencils down. You guys..,I just broke my score down by section for the first time ever (I've refused to look at it)....I missed 13 questions on the real LG section. 13 out of 23. That's scary.
I'm looking at a conversion chart...Say I'd even gotten 7--about half--of those correct (maybe if I'd made it through the last game and picked out the couple super easy ones, and had a couple lucky guesses)..63+7=70 correct, which would have put me according to this chart thing at a 160.

I think 7 questions more correct is do able. What do you think?

EDIT: I did some scrounging in all my preptest books...It looks like I was PT'ing anywhere between 152-162. The 162 was about 2 weeks before the test. My LGs were running 15-20 correct at the end. I still have literally all my preptests (I wish I'd put dates on them, but most lack dates taken, and I did take many out of order). They currently serve the purpose of keeping my cat from removing the aquarium lid and going for a swim I could at least crack one open tonight on a cold run and see what a diagnostic looks like at this point.

[Nova]

Dont let the lsac stat get you down. Its pretty much meaningless in your situation. Your 154 is basically just a pt because of how unprepared you were.

I personally took plenty of pts in the 150s before consistently scoring much higher.

[star fox]

I just looked up the stats on LSAC's website--someone with my number in 2010-2011 on their spreadsheets increased their score by about 2 points on a retake. That was it. No 154s even broke into the 170's on a retake, and I have according to those numbers about a 23-24% chance of pushing into the 160s on a retake. Is it worth those odds?
All I remember from test day, was I ran out of time on my LG section--the one that turned out being the REAL one and not the experimental. So guessed on the whole last game and a half as he yelled to put our pencils down. You guys..,I just broke my score down by section for the first time ever (I've refused to look at it)....I missed 13 questions on the real LG section. 13 out of 23. That's scary.
I'm looking at a conversion chart...Say I'd even gotten 7--about half--of those correct (maybe if I'd made it through the last game and picked out the couple super easy ones, and had a couple lucky guesses)..63+7=70 correct, which would have put me according to this chart thing at a 160.

I think 7 questions more correct is do able. What do you think?

EDIT: I did some scrounging in all my preptest books...It looks like I was PT'ing anywhere between 152-162. The 162 was about 2 weeks before the test. My LGs were running 15-20 correct at the end. I still have literally all my preptests (I wish I'd put dates on them, but most lack dates taken, and I did take many out of order). They currently serve the purpose of keeping my cat from removing the aquarium lid and going for a swim I could at least crack one open tonight on a cold run and see what a diagnostic looks like at this point.

Stop worrying about the endgame right now. Hit the study books and focus on learning all the materials and getting steadily better. Come back in June after you take the test again and re-assess from there.

[Progress01]

Stop worrying about the endgame right now. Hit the study books and focus on learning all the materials and getting steadily better. Come back in June after you take the test again and re-assess from there.

Thanks for the advice. I cracked open a preptest Thursday night and made it through a timed LR and LG section before my brain couldn't apparently stand it anymore. It really was like my brain was yelling at me-- "Don't do this! We already went through this once! Not again! Please!" It's going to take some serious motivation to start studying solidly for the LSAT while also doing physics homework and preparing for biochemistry exams. Does anyone have a prepcourse they especially recommend?

Also, just wanted to clarify something, not that it matters: OP is a she, not a he. I'm the first female in my female to pursue anything more than a bachelors degree. I'm also the first person--of either gender--in my family, to ever attempt to go to law school. All of this is part of why this is a complicated choice.