T14 grad, former splitter, taking questions. Forum

[Dark Horse]

Did you do anything during your summers that would be applicable to AUSA or DA's? What factors kept you from getting an offer from the DA's office? Were you geographically restricting yourself?

And thanks for your great information.

I worked for a DA's office during my 1L summer, took a criminal defense clinic my 3L year, and took a bunch of crim classes. But yes, I did limit myself geographically, and I guess having the comfort of a big firm offer snuffed out my ambition to do whatever it takes to get a DA job offer. I didn't do a whole lot of networking or following up, and I really interviewed with just one DA office. I think I did OK, but unfortunately, it was the Manhattan DA, and I was rejected. I suspect you had to do better than just "OK" to get an offer there; in any case, I'm thinking about re-applying some time in the future.

[tkaninenberg]

Thanks for your reply. I have not received the my Dec score back yet, patiently waiting. I am applying mainly to schools that have a part time program, however my #1 choice is Cincy. The reason for PT is that I am married w/ two children. Other than my work experience I do not have anything that will STAND out. Other that getting a few tryout offers for professional soccer teams and dealing with tourettes, there isn't anything that makes me wow the admissions committee.

[swampthang]

What do you think made the difference in your app to get you accepted at a school you didn't expect (and, if you don't mind my asking, which school)?

It was one of MVPBCGDN. It was a long shot, but not completely impossible, since my grades were below the 25% and my LSAT was just at the median. The main differences, I think, were that I (1) applied early decision, (2) tailored my application to the school, (3) sent letters of continued interest, and (4) generally expressed my sincere interest in attending. It's really hard to pinpoint what exactly I did right since nobody ever told me what it was that pushed my application into the accept pile. I'm fairly certain it's one of those four points.

I think most applicants forget that there is more to the process than just numbers. The numbers will put you in the running, but most people don't make it because they don't really communicate how badly they want to get in.

Did you get WLed? I don't think I've heard of anyone sending an LOCI before a decision was made on their app, but I'd be interested to hear more.

[albanach]

What's your work day like? Hours? Are you expected to be in the office on weekends? Are you often interrupted by urgent requests when you're our of work?

[Dark Horse]

What's your work day like? Hours? Are you expected to be in the office on weekends? Are you often interrupted by urgent requests when you're our of work?

It's hard to generalize, but ten to twelve hour days are the norm. When there's an urgent deadline, it can get rough. I've had a few nights where I stayed past midnight; my colleagues have stories of staying until 3, 4 or even 5 AM. How long you are in the office also depends on who you are working with -- some folks at the firm have no problem with staying late, so that means as a first year, you'll be staying too. As for the weekends, that usually happens once or twice a month, but it all really depends. I'd say on average, 60 hours a week sounds about right, although that's usually something like 45 hours one week and 75 the next. There's quite a bit of variation.

[glitched]

How varied is your work? Are you essentially doing the same cases just for different people everytime you're given an assignment? Or is it a unique situation each time?

[johnnyutah]

Law school was different for me, because it was filled with so many smart and ambitious people. My entire life prior to this, I tended to hang out with people who were slackers, enjoyed life, or simply didn't care about things like "status." It was a bit of an adjustment at first, because law students can be abrasive, self-important, and callous. During my first semester, I thought I'd never make any good friends in law school. After graduation, I was pleasantly surprised at how many strong friendships I'd made -- which made me think that sometimes it's less about the differences among people and more about who you're willing to give a chance to.

WORD

[Dark Horse]

How varied is your work? Are you essentially doing the same cases just for different people everytime you're given an assignment? Or is it a unique situation each time?

Since I am in a large office in a large litigation department, I work with different people. At any given time, associates are any number of separate matters. You might be on one case if it's large, or you might be on three or four different medium to smaller sized cases. Generally, the same people work on the same types of matters though, so you'll run into the same people again and again.

That's why it's so important that you do good work -- so you can develop a reputation. You always read about this in advice-for-young-lawyers columns. They talk about how you treat your adversaries, how strong your advocacy is, etc, but it's a little different in a large law firm. Here, your clients are the mid-levels and partners. People talk about how good or how bad you are, and after a few years, you develop a reputation that follows you around. This is true even in a large litigation department.

[Dark Horse]

Did you get WLed? I don't think I've heard of anyone sending an LOCI before a decision was made on their app, but I'd be interested to hear more.

I applied Early Decision, and they deferred me to the general pool in January. Some time in March or April, they moved me to the waitlist, and in May, they moved me to the priority waitlist. I didn't send a LOCI before they responded to my Early Decision application, but after that, I sent in letters pretty regularly.

In retrospect, I'm glad I kept on bothering them with LOCIs, but at the time, I wondered if it would make any difference. It was also a bit depressing, since I saw lots of people slowly start to get admitted off the waitlist on lawschoolnumbers, while I was still in limbo. The entire thing was a very drawn out process -- I received my acceptance in early June. Yet it wasn't all that bad; one of my closest law school friends was admitted off the waitlist a few weeks before Orientation.

[Dark Horse]

Thanks for your reply. I have not received the my Dec score back yet, patiently waiting. I am applying mainly to schools that have a part time program, however my #1 choice is Cincy. The reason for PT is that I am married w/ two children. Other than my work experience I do not have anything that will STAND out. Other that getting a few tryout offers for professional soccer teams and dealing with tourettes, there isn't anything that makes me wow the admissions committee.

Professional soccer and volunteerism might seem normal to you, but if you spin it in the right way, it can sound very unique and impressive. Good luck!

[tkaninenberg]

Received my LSAT score on Thursday, not happy with the score. By the "numbers" I am at a disadvantage, I'm not going to disclose the score,I have read alot of posts to where people just kill you over a score that is not 150 or above.
I'm really hoping that my long work history will prevail. I'm not going to state that I know that I can do it, everybody does, but I do know what it is like in the job market and how competative it is and what is does take to succeed, Law school will not be any different. I have very strong LOR's from AVP's and VP's from the Bank that I worked at.

[Komaliie]

What did you write in your LOCIs specifically & how many did you send/how often did you send them?

I applied ED & got deferred to the regular pool. I'm thinking about sending a LOCI & a LOR.

[Dark Horse]

What did you write in your LOCIs specifically & how many did you send/how often did you send them?

I applied ED & got deferred to the regular pool. I'm thinking about sending a LOCI & a LOR.

I can't remember exactly, but I think I sent three or so, over the course of a few months. The afternoon after I sent the last one, I received an e-mail saying that I was admitted. I don't know if this was coincidence or if I suddenly popped up on their radar. (I'd faxed the letter -- all other LOCIs were sent via snail mail)

The thing with the LOCI, and pretty much everything else you do now, is that it's hard to tell how much it'll help. Each individual thing you do, by itself, won't get you admitted. What does get you in is a combination of factors (they need someone with a high LSAT, a high GPA, or some other demographic, you have expressed your interest in the school for a long time, etc) some of which are in your control. So don't overanalyze the LOCI -- no one thing will make or break your application. Just write something genuine.

Having said that, I dug up my old LOCI and here's what I found:

[After reading this for the first time in years, I can't believe how gunner I was. In any case, this is the letter I sent right after they deferred me to the regular applicant pool.]

Dear Sir or Madam,

My name is Dark Horse and I am a deferred applicant. I would like to reemphasize my specific interest in [LAW SCHOOL]. Even though I am free of the obligation, if offered a spot in the class, I will certainly choose to attend. [I meant this when I wrote it]

Since late October, when I submitted my Early Decision application, I have received [AWARD] from my division manager at [COMPANY] for my stellar performance this past fall. Though I have only been working for a little under a year and a half, I have developed a sophisticated view of the business and of my particular career interests.

[YOUR SCHOOL] is looking for students who are mature and have a well articulated career strategy. Upon further reflection, I realized that I may not have communicated my career goals as well as I should have. Therefore, I have attached a one page statement of purpose describing my current ambitions in the legal profession.

Even though this time is fraught with anxiety for applicants, I understand that the admissions staff has the thankless job of putting together a well rounded first year class in the face of great uncertainty. Therefore, if there is any more information I can provide to make your job easier, please do not hesitate to contact me.

Thank you for your time and consideration

[Perch]

As a fellow (semi) splitter, paying sticker at the highest ranked school possible seems to make sense given I'd have to drop a lot to start seeing significant offers. Did you feel the same way when you committed time and again to your school?

[Dark Horse]

As a fellow (semi) splitter, paying sticker at the highest ranked school possible seems to make sense given I'd have to drop a lot to start seeing significant offers. Did you feel the same way when you committed time and again to your school?

I'm not sure what this means, could you clarify?

[tkaninenberg]

Is it a good sign if your application is being revied by the committee or is that just the procedure.

[Dark Horse]

Is it a good sign if your application is being revied by the committee or is that just the procedure.

I don't think this means all that much.

[mala2]

Want to share your personal statement?

[tkaninenberg]

I wrote about the struggles of having tourrettes

[wildcats2008]

Thanks for taking questions! I plan on applying to law school next year. I am currently a junior. A couple questions:

About what percentage of 1L's got firm jobs from your school? Was it mostly through family connections?

I am in engineering so do you know what the market is like for IP law relative to other areas of law?

How indicative were 1st semester 1L grades of your (and others') overall law school gpa?

What motivated you to apply ED? How many schools did you apply to and how early did you
send out your apps?

Once again, sorry for all the questions, but thanks for taking the time!

[Dark Horse]

Thanks for taking questions! I plan on applying to law school next year. I am currently a junior. A couple questions:

About what percentage of 1L's got firm jobs from your school? Was it mostly through family connections?

I am in engineering so do you know what the market is like for IP law relative to other areas of law?

How indicative were 1st semester 1L grades of your (and others') overall law school gpa?

What motivated you to apply ED? How many schools did you apply to and how early did you
send out your apps?

Once again, sorry for all the questions, but thanks for taking the time!

1. When I was a 1L, about a quarter of my friends got 1L summer jobs with firms, and most had engineering backgrounds. Things these days have changed, obviously, and there are presumably fewer of these positions available. I'm not aware of anyone who got a job through a family connection.

2. My final law school GPA went up two-tenths between first semester 1L and graduation. I slacked off quite a bit; I'd heard of other people whose GPA went up by .5 or so.

3. I knew it was an uphill climb to get into the T14, and I really liked the school I ended up getting into. I wasn't going to get any merit money and it would be a pretty big deal if I could get into any T14. I applied to a total of about twenty schools, and I sent them all out by October or so.