2014 ATL Rankings Forum

[rahulg91]

I like Vanderbilt at 14. With UT bringing up the rear call it the new T15.

ETA: also do they list the numerical values of each school according to their metric so we can see how close each school comes to the next?

Yeah, totally. Why not, when both of these schools have objectively worse BigFed + BigLaw percentages than Georgetown (without even touching GULC's comparatively very high PI placement/self-selection)?

Hold up a sec. http://www.lstscorereports.com/compare/ ... ilt/texas/

Vandy has a lower underemployment score + a higher employment score + lower school funded rate + higher fedclerk rate + lower COL.
LOL.

vanderbilt isn't necessarily a better school, it's just a peer

Yeah that's what I was implying. Though GULC does have better BL numbers.

[03152016]

if i was paying sticker (not saying anyone should, just hypo) and had to choose gulc, vandy, ut
i'd go with ut and ed for the in-state rate
not saying sticker anywhere is a good outcome, but ut is easier on the wallet than the other two

and if i was going strictly off employment
it would be vandy for me

so unless i had some geographic preference (super interested in dc or something)
it would be very hard for me to envision a scenario in which i end up at gulc
since it's unlikely they beat vandy/ut wrt fin aid

[hashashin]

I like Vanderbilt at 14. With UT bringing up the rear call it the new T15.

ETA: also do they list the numerical values of each school according to their metric so we can see how close each school comes to the next?

Yeah, totally. Why not, when both of these schools have objectively worse BigFed + BigLaw percentages than Georgetown (without even touching GULC's comparatively very high PI placement/self-selection)?

Yea man! Only necro 3-4 more employment threads with inaccurate information about Georgetown to ease your insecurity and you'll finally show 'em!

What was the inaccuracy? Does Georgetown not have higher FedClerk + Biglaw percentages?

[hashashin]

To rahulg:

What exactly are you trying to disprove? That Georgetown has better BigLaw + FedClerk numbers? This is objectively the case.

[hashashin]

Yeah, totally. Why not, when both of these schools have objectively worse BigFed + BigLaw percentages than Georgetown (without even touching GULC's comparatively very high PI placement/self-selection)?

LOL this numerical illiteracy based on relegating GULC to the bottom needs to stop. The school numerically closest to Cornell is Berkeley (the only two schools in the T14 with median LSATs below 168), not Georgetown. Georgetown's medians are slightly higher than Michigan's (equal LSAT, somewhat higher GPA) and slightly lower than NU (equal LSAT, somewhat lower GPA). Cornell, on the other hand, has medians on par with Vandy and Berk, without having Berkeley's quirkiness. In fact, Cornell's TOP 25% LSAT, also 167, is below the median student at every other school in the T-14(excepting Berkeley).

i am 100% positive that you are the same poster, sock puppeting
both bumped months old threads for seemingly no reason
both posted within a couple hours of each other
both are shilling for gulc, using similar language
both have user names relate to islam
perhaps mod can confirm?

eta: both posters use two spaces instead of one after periods
doesn't show in threads, but shows in the reply screen (just tested, apparently forum automatically corrects double space to single in threads)
so more proof of sockpuppeting

Pretty sure I've already admitted this in the past...so nice detective work?

[hashashin]

I like Vanderbilt at 14. With UT bringing up the rear call it the new T15.

ETA: also do they list the numerical values of each school according to their metric so we can see how close each school comes to the next?

Yeah, totally. Why not, when both of these schools have objectively worse BigFed + BigLaw percentages than Georgetown (without even touching GULC's comparatively very high PI placement/self-selection)?

Hold up a sec. http://www.lstscorereports.com/compare/ ... ilt/texas/

Vandy has a lower underemployment score + a higher employment score + lower school funded rate + higher fedclerk rate + lower COL.
LOL.

vanderbilt isn't necessarily a better school, it's just a peer

Really, your attempt to redraw the prestige hierarchy is pretty hilarious. Here's the thing, man; my first semester of 1L, I had a slightly above median GPA at GULC (~3.32); with that GPA, I am summering at a Vault 100 firm in DC without any hooks whatsoever other than somewhat decent work experience. Do you really think that outcome would have been possible at Vandy or UT? And do you really think that GULC's public sector employment doesn't propel it quite substantially far ahead of Vandy and UT in terms of authentically elite outcomes?

[twenty]

Jesus Christ, get over it.

[hashashin]

Jesus Christ, get over it.

No; not until the fucking South is put back in its place.

[brazleton]

.

[jbagelboy]

Hold up a sec. http://www.lstscorereports.com/compare/ ... ilt/texas/

Vandy has a lower underemployment score + a higher employment score + lower school funded rate + higher fedclerk rate + lower COL.
LOL.

vanderbilt isn't necessarily a better school, it's just a peer

Really, your attempt to redraw the prestige hierarchy is pretty hilarious. Here's the thing, man; my first semester of 1L, I had a slightly above median GPA at GULC (~3.32); with that GPA, I am summering at a Vault 100 firm in DC without any hooks whatsoever other than somewhat decent work experience. Do you really think that outcome would have been possible at Vandy or UT? And do you really think that GULC's public sector employment doesn't propel it quite substantially far ahead of Vandy and UT in terms of authentically elite outcomes?

Who said anything about prestige hierarchy? IDGAF about hierarchies, or prestige

and your anecdotal experience doesn't serve to offset the literally hundreds of your classmates who will struggle to find paid full time legal work after they graduate.

(but since you brought it up, vanderbilt as a university is generally more prestigious than georgetown)

[hashashin]

Hold up a sec. http://www.lstscorereports.com/compare/ ... ilt/texas/

Vandy has a lower underemployment score + a higher employment score + lower school funded rate + higher fedclerk rate + lower COL.
LOL.

vanderbilt isn't necessarily a better school, it's just a peer

Really, your attempt to redraw the prestige hierarchy is pretty hilarious. Here's the thing, man; my first semester of 1L, I had a slightly above median GPA at GULC (~3.32); with that GPA, I am summering at a Vault 100 firm in DC without any hooks whatsoever other than somewhat decent work experience. Do you really think that outcome would have been possible at Vandy or UT? And do you really think that GULC's public sector employment doesn't propel it quite substantially far ahead of Vandy and UT in terms of authentically elite outcomes?

Who said anything about prestige hierarchy? IDGAF about hierarchies, or prestige

and your anecdotal experience doesn't serve to offset the literally hundreds of your classmates who will struggle to find paid full time legal work after they graduate.

(but since you brought it up, vanderbilt as a university is generally more prestigious than georgetown)

Hundreds??? Say whaaaaa?

[cron1834]

This bro is shitting on multiple dead threads to white knight for GULC right now. Classic.

[hashashin]

Jesus Christ, get over it.

No; not until the fucking South is put back in its place.

GULC is mediocre. Austin and Nashville > DC. Rep in home market at Vandy and UT > GULC's in DC. Smaller class > letting in every Hill-striver who applies. How mad are you?

Not much, since every one of those hill-strivers also easily gets into UT and Vandy...

[hashashin]

This bro is shitting on multiple dead threads to white knight for GULC right now. Classic.

And this bro feels compelled to respond...

[jbagelboy]

your school awarded over 600 diplomas last year (591 entering plus transfers minus some transfer out/dropout). of those students, nine months after they graduated, at least 28%** of them had not found full time legal work that wasn't paid by the school. So at least 168 students did not have are still "strugg[ling] to find paid full time work after they graduate." Hundreds, bra.

math is cool

[hashashin]

To jbagelboy (sorry, too may quotes to embed):

But I am talking about employment alone. It would appear that, even under the ATL's methodology of comparing "quality jobs" (NLJ250 + FedClerk percentage), GULC comes out ahead of both Vandy and UT. So what is the justification for putting those ahead of GULC? Cost (which you've already said earlier is a bullshit metric)?

[hashashin]

your school awarded over 600 diplomas last year (591 entering plus transfers minus some transfer out/dropout). of those students, nine months after they graduated, at least 28%** of them had not found full time legal work that wasn't paid by the school. So at least 168 students did not have are still "strugg[ling] to find paid full time work after they graduate." Hundreds, bra.

math is cool

That's not even TWO "hundreds"

[ymmv]

God I cannot wait until the day USNWR drops this GULC rankings charade and we can stop having to explain the high-falutin' concept of employment data in every fucking thread.

[hashashin]

your school awarded over 600 diplomas last year (591 entering plus transfers minus some transfer out/dropout). of those students, nine months after they graduated, at least 28%** of them had not found full time legal work that wasn't paid by the school. So at least 168 students did not have are still "strugg[ling] to find paid full time work after they graduate." Hundreds, bra.

math is cool

Also, you're forgetting 6% that were in FTLT JDA jobs that were not funded by the school. Which makes the proportion with real jobs 78%, which really isn't that far off from NU, Cornell or UVA. Obviously, the actual NUMBER will be higher, considering the school's size (as you well know).

[jbagelboy]

To jbagelboy (sorry, too may quotes to embed):

But I am talking about employment alone. It would appear that, even under the ATL's methodology of comparing "quality jobs" (NLJ250 + FedClerk percentage), GULC comes out ahead of both Vandy and UT. So what is the justification for putting those ahead of GULC? Cost (which you've already said earlier is a bullshit metric)?

atl is a shitty ranking

a school should care about the bottom of it's graduating class, not just the top. true, doing well (top third) at Georgetown offers more opportunities than vandy. but the hundreds kids being left straddled with hundreds of thousands of $ in debt and left out to dry? it's frankly inappropriate. the university should take responsibility, and not just by hiring more of it's own students for temp jobs

i don't care enough about this to continue. georgetown and vanderbilt are in the same league to me and a lot of other people, sorry. if gtown cut its class in half or stopped accepting everyone and their cousin who made top third at their local TTT as a transfer then it could regain status as a respectable t14

[jbagelboy]

your school awarded over 600 diplomas last year (591 entering plus transfers minus some transfer out/dropout). of those students, nine months after they graduated, at least 28%** of them had not found full time legal work that wasn't paid by the school. So at least 168 students did not have are still "strugg[ling] to find paid full time work after they graduate." Hundreds, bra.

math is cool

Also, you're forgetting 6% that were in FTLT JDA jobs that were not funded by the school. Which makes the proportion with real jobs 78%, which really isn't that far off from NU, Cornell or UVA. Obviously, the actual NUMBER will be higher, considering the school's size (as you well know).

lol. JDA includes accountants, administrators, glorified paralegals, some high school teachers, journalists, librarians, ect. not everyone JDA is working at bain. georgetown doesn't even have a top b-school so it doesn't get the presumption we might give to northwestern or harvard about their jda

[hashashin]

No, but plenty of fedgov jobs ARE JDA, including jobs that part-time students already have (an easy counter, of course, is that this shouldn't count towards GULC's placement power b/c they are pre-existing; in that case, of course, these students would have to be deducted from GULC's denominator as well, which would be a wash).

[hashashin]

To jbagelboy (sorry, too may quotes to embed):

But I am talking about employment alone. It would appear that, even under the ATL's methodology of comparing "quality jobs" (NLJ250 + FedClerk percentage), GULC comes out ahead of both Vandy and UT. So what is the justification for putting those ahead of GULC? Cost (which you've already said earlier is a bullshit metric)?

atl is a shitty ranking

a school should care about the bottom of it's graduating class, not just the top. true, doing well (top third) at Georgetown offers more opportunities than vandy. but the hundreds kids being left straddled with hundreds of thousands of $ in debt and left out to dry? it's frankly inappropriate. the university should take responsibility, and not just by hiring more of it's own students for temp jobs

i don't care enough about this to continue. georgetown and vanderbilt are in the same league to me and a lot of other people, sorry. if gtown cut its class in half or stopped accepting everyone and their cousin who made top third at their local TTT as a transfer then it could regain status as a respectable t14

Also, the relevant comparison isn't really Top Third, but MEDIAN at Georgetown. As the c/o 2013 stats indicate, BL + FedClerk == about 46.5% of the whole class. Then there is 13% doing PI work that is also FTLTJDR (once you take out the school-funded jobs, as you want to); since these jobs at least qualify for LRAP (in addition to probably being otherwise desirable), I'd classify them as good outcomes. A large chunk of the PI contingent at GULC really is comprised of top third types who are averse to private practice and prefer FedGov/PDA type work (and definitely get it). Almost no one in the 3.3x range is faling at OCI at GULC; is it really the same at Vandy?

[rahulg91]

To rahulg:

What exactly are you trying to disprove? That Georgetown has better BigLaw + FedClerk numbers? This is objectively the case.

Yeah I agree, but all I'm saying is objectively Vandy has better FedClerk numbers, and GULC has better BigLaw numbers. Vandy also has similar employment numbers (for c/o 2013 Vandy actually outdoes GULC). Which is why it would be fair to say that Vandy and GULC are peers. Because they are. Objectively. (Also this might be wrong, but I feel like people that get no money from GULC get $$ from Vandy/UT)

[hashashin]

Lol...definitely not considered peers by Vault firms. Also, you are completely discounting Georgetown's substantial edge in BigFed, something Vandy has nothing whatsoever to substitute for. I don't think it's very controversial at all to suggest that Georgetown's total placement power in elite employment significantly exceeds Vandy's and is much closer to Cornell/NU than to Vandy and UT.