Iowa Law Class of 2011 Forum

[azhawk08]

Hey there- anyone else set to be a Hawkeye this fall?

I know I've spoken with a few people on TLS who are planning to be in Iowa City... so I thought it'd be nice to start connecting with each other. I graduated from Iowa this May and I stuck around for the summer. If anyone is moving in anytime soon, I'd definitely be up for getting a few people together. Along with that, having lived in Iowa City for the past few years I'd be more than willing to answer any questions that anyone new to the area may have.

[CLM]

I'll be moving up to Iowa City on the 15th of August... The beginning of what I am sure will be a wild and challenging three years. Though I am from Texas this will not be my first time in Iowa City, I was a part of their pre-law summer program. Iowa is a progressive, utopian environment, a breath of fresh air compared to what I am used to.

[azhawk08]

I'm already here... feel free to PM me when you get to IC and we'll get a few people together for pre-hell drinks. have you gotten your section assignment yet? I'm in 10, and I've talked to someone else on here who is in 5.

...anyone else out there want to share their section assignment? I guess if I knew any of your real names, I could look it up myself...

[authority11]

.

[azhawk08]

lol hooray for online friendship. thanks for the add! nice detective work on figuring out my real name

okay, I KNOW there are some other Hawkeyes out there... paisley? suite? thespinstartshere? wanna jump in on the convo?

[westside123]

"Iowa is a progressive, utopian environment . . . "

Unbelievable. I can't stop laughing. With a statment like that, you deserve to be at Iowa. That way, you and all the other misguided "students" can pursue your delusions of legal career grandeur together.

[solrac84]

"Iowa is a progressive, utopian environment . . . "

Unbelievable. I can't stop laughing. With a statment like that, you deserve to be at Iowa. That way, you and all the other misguided "students" can pursue your delusions of legal career grandeur together.

You can't stop laughing because someone is proud of their "not as good as your school" school?

The only delusion I see around here is the you thinking your an internet "Bad Ass."

[azhawk08]

westside, everyone is entitled to their opinion. you seem more than happy to give yours: it looks like 7 out of 7 of your posts on TLS are dedicated to bashing Iowa with as much enthusiasm as you can muster. and hey, I'm not complaining. everyone has a soapbox.

just wondering, though: why such intensity? have you had a negative personal experience with Iowa? I'm curious to know where (and if) you went/will go to law school. with all of those opinions, I'd expect you must have plans to go somewhere better.

please don't take this post as an insult. as someone planning to start class at Iowa in a few weeks, I'd really like to know where you're coming from. and don't bother rehashing your anti-arguments... I've already read them in your other posts.

[westside123]

My posts on this site, and the threads about Iowa on JD Underground and Law School Discussion, are quite clear as to what is going on at Iowa. The amalgamation of information from those three sources says all that needs to be said.

There are serious problems at U of Iowa Law. Take a look at Drake, the other law school in Iowa. At Drake, almost everyone is from a very strong, top law school. Now take at look at Iowa's faculty - on a one by one comparison, the credentials just don't stack up.

While there are some very strong professors at Iowa, most of those people are close to retirement age. The younger faculty members of this strong cohort don't make up for the fact that Iowa seems to be doing nothing to attract and retain a strong faculty. Iowa does seem to be able to attract a bumbling diversity tool for a Dean, but I don't think that will make up for the shortcomings in other areas.

There is an overreliance on "adjuncts" at Iowa - a sure sign that something is wrong. One particular adjunct is a total flame out who hasn't done anything of professional or academic significance in almost 40 years. Furthermore, the school no longer seems to be able to attract strong younger faculty - something that would keep the school vital and the academic quality high. As an Iowa grad I see the quality at the law school slipping away and the people in charge unwilling to do anything about it.

I will give you one piece of advice. If you are serious about having a legal career and you do well enough during your first year, transfer to a school higher up the food chain. Ideally this would be one of the T14 schools. The doors to quality opportunities in the profession open far wider to people from those schools than they do to people coming out of Iowa.

[westside123]

Anyone interested in what is happening at Iowa should also see this site and the various comments.

http://obscureminority.blogspot.com/

[azhawk08]

westside, I appreciate your feedback- and the advice, though I don't really agree with it. I guess I'd have assumed that if you're an Iowa grad and you're concerned about our reputation/quality going on a downward slope, you would channel your energy into fixing the problem- not flaunting negative opinions of Iowa (even if they are supported by some facts). further, where's your sense of loyalty? not many Iowa grads I know would be so quick to bash their alma mater. if you're sour about your experience or the career prospects (or lack thereof) that your Iowa degree has presented, that's understood. but please don't insult future Iowa law students (or misguided "students," as you've referred to us) by telling us that we're about to enter into a 3 year pursuit of a worthless degree.

I'm really looking forward to "pursuing delusions of legal career gradeur" with my fellow classmates, as I'm sure you must have done in your time at Iowa. apparently, you were disappointed with your results- and that's unfortunate. but I know many a successful and satisfied Iowa lawyer who would be quick to disagree with you, and they've got the jobs to prove it. and as far as being a progressive and utopian environment... okay, maybe those words were a little strong- but if you've really spent at least 3 years in Iowa City, you know that it's not far enough off to merit your snobby reply.

if your intent in your posts is to help us "misguided students," you'd be taken a lot more seriously if you could do it tactfully and without such arrogance. if helping us isn't your intent, then why are you wasting your time?

[senorsombrero]

I think it's funny when people that go to a non T14 school bitch about their job prospects as if they were entitled to any job they want. I understand some of the frustration that can occur when your prospective of the legal profession does not match up with the realities on the ground. I think this epidemic of whiners on the internet, who seemingly did not do their research before dropping 100-200k, is representative of the type of person who just were never meant to be an attorney. I agree that the debt load is getting ridiculous, but a majority of lawyers that I talked to over the years took on huge amounts of debt for low paying entrance jobs. The fact that this still happens should not be a shock to anyone going to law school. It's sadly the reality of legal education. Though many schools seem to fudge their employment figures, even a cursory glance at a Vault or Princetonreview guide often reveals that Law School employment does not entitle one to a 100k+job out of school for a vast majority of grads. These anti *insert school name* posts are valuable to many applicants because they often take the gloss of the law school perspective, yet I can't help to think the authors would be better off focusing on their reality and how to improve their career instead of trolling on jd underground all day.

No one going to Iowa should think that they are getting a National degree. As a semi region al state school though, it seems like a good deal.
Good luck at Iowa!

[IStillPlayVideoGames]

I'm joining you guys at Iowa!

I was actually down in Iowa City on Friday to pick up keys for my apartment and buy a bed and a futon. I officially move in on Saturday and I'm pretty psyched!

I'm from Chicago, but spent the last year in Boston, fwiw.

[azhawk08]

hey all, I'm getting together with a few other incoming 1Ls next Thursday night. the more the merrier, so if any of you are interested in meeting up, send me a message and I'll give you the details.

[westside123]

I Would Do Anything for Law School
(But I Won't Do That)
Monday, August 11, 2008 10:46 AM - By David Lat

We know, from email correspondence and comments, that a fair number of aspiring law school students read this blog. To them we pose this question: How badly do you want to get into law school?

From Inside Higher Ed:

Arthur H. Miller (pictured), professor of political science at the University of Iowa [Ed. note: not that Arthur Miller], was arrested Friday on bribery charges related to accusations that he told female students he would give them higher grades if they let him fondle their breasts....
In one case, a student who said she was not doing well in class went to meet him and says that he told her she "would have to do something" and then grabbed and sucked on her breast. The student said that the professor sent her an e-mail congratulating her on earning an A+ and offered to meet to help her get into law school.

What would Professor Miller have written in this student's recommendation? That she has "an impressive body of work"? That her breasts "are succulent and delicious"? Not sure any of that would be germane to performance in law school (although some say the same about the LSAT).

UI prof faces bribery charges [Iowa City Press-Citizen via Inside Higher Ed]

_____________________________________________________________________


Go to Iowa, people. Knock yourselves out.

[azhawk08]

oh wow, that's a wonderful thing to base your law school choice on: the conduct of one UNDERGRAD poli sci professor out of the entire faculty at a university. guess what? I graduated from Iowa's poli sci dept this May, and never even met Miller- much less taken a class with him. I'm doubtful that I could even pick him out of a faculty composite.

if you're suggesting that this story is enough to sway one's decision in choosing a law school, then good luck finding a law school out there that will meet your criteria. that's about as logical as a diehard republican turning down Harvard solely because Obama went there.

there have also been very recent sexual harassment cases at universities such as Georgia, Wisconsin, Stanford, Yale... better count those schools out of the running too... they're obviously unfit for preparing anyone for a legal career.

honestly- get a life... or at least some better material.

[westside123]

If you have any aspirations of working outside of Iowa, here's another piece of advice. Learn how to write. At best, your writing skills are at the level of a juvenile. If you think that this isn't the case, then you are very naive and lacking in self awareness. If you think that this lack of skill won't make or break you in the profession, you are, again, very naive.

Further, if you think anyone outside of Iowa thinks that the undergraduate education at University of Iowa is in any way academically rigorous, you are also, again, naive. I've run into some of the so-called "top" undergraduate students at that place, and was suprised that those people made it out through four years of high school, let alone four years of college. The skills, abilities, knowledge, intellectual curiosity and capacity I've seen were more akin to that I've encountered with high school students.

Once you get out into the "real world" and have to compete with people from Yale on down, you'll see that the general quality of the education at the University of Iowa is second rate. Those very same people from Yale on down won't let you forget it, either. If you don't believe this, then you are very naive.

Gee, do you see a pattern emerging here?

[IStillPlayVideoGames]

West, while I'm sure you're only trying to help in some sick way, you know you're not, right?

We get it. You went to Iowa. You regret your decision because now you can't find a job to save your life and you're saddled with a ton of debt. That's sucks, I'm sure. But not everyone from Iowa has your problem. There are plenty of people who graduate from Iowa and work their dream jobs outside of the Iowa market.

Yes, Yale et al are superior schools. But I'm willing to wager that no one on this board turned down Yale to attend Iowa. And no one here is comparing Iowa's placement in the Chicago market with Yale's.

Maybe if you spent less time crafting message board posts that only serve to underline your failure in law school, you'd actually have a job right now. Yeesh, you remind me of the sad sacks on JDUnderground that spend all day, every day bitching about XYZ School of Law. You can only blame a school so much for your sorry performance and shoddy job prospects, and then it's all you buddy.

[westside123]

IStillPlayVideoGames = naive, ignorant, arrogant, inexperienced, pontificating 0L.

[senorsombrero]

I'm not even going to Iowa and I'm sick of you. Why aren't you searching for a job? Can you really find no legal employment at all? If so, you should probably take steps to remedy that. Iowa's law school is what it is. Just because it's over rated in the US news ranking doesn't mean that we need to hear you bitch about it all the time.

[azhawk08]

wow west, quite the assumptions you make. my juvenile writing skills can't possibly come up with anything clever enough to attack your arguments, so I suppose I won't even try. let me just say this: writing eloquently on TLS isn't quite my first priority, as it is yours. I apologize that you've been subjected to my mindless babbling. why don't you save yourself the torture of communicating with "naive, ignorant, arrogant, inexperienced, pontificating" losers and go hang out on JD underground instead? I bet they love you there. we, on the other hand, can do without your 'advice' and opinions. my second-rate undergraduate education got me into a top 30 law school, and I'm naive enough to be satisfied with it. ignorance is bliss.

good luck with the job hunt. I'm guessing it's a bit difficult for you to mask your arrogance during the interview process... but keep working on it, and maybe you'll have better luck.

[azhawk08]

sidenote to anyone actually attending Iowa Law this fall: I'm getting together with some other students Thursday evening. feel free to PM me if you want the details on time/location.

[Dadric]

Stop wasting your time whining and crying on internet message boards and go get a damn job. Seriously, nobody cares that you sucked at law school and just happened to do so at Iowa.

Iowa City ftw. Good luck all!

[westside123]

Dadric:

You don't have a god damned clue about me or anything else for that matter. You're just another one of those inexperienced, snot nosed, petulant twenty-somethings who come here to rant about how superior they are.

Why don't you GFY and then STFU.

[Dadric]

You're seriously letting posts on an internet message boards get you this upset? That's troublesome.

<3