LRAP's Compared Forum

[Skadden Stairs]

Moral of the story: I'm going to be unhappy with my QoL for 10 years whether I go to NYU, clerk, then work for a Senator or go to CLS and end up at Debevoise.

sugar daddy at nyu - networking, lex, networking

is this an offer?

[doyleoil]

Moral of the story: I'm going to be unhappy with my QoL for 10 years whether I go to NYU, clerk, then work for a Senator or go to CLS and end up at Debevoise.

sugar daddy at nyu - networking, lex, networking

is this an offer?

haha...well...only if the depression is over by fall 2010

[Skadden Stairs]

Moral of the story: I'm going to be unhappy with my QoL for 10 years whether I go to NYU, clerk, then work for a Senator or go to CLS and end up at Debevoise.

sugar daddy at nyu - networking, lex, networking

is this an offer?

haha...well...only if the depression is over by fall 2010

hmm... I don't like those odds. But then again, I thought I'd find one in Dubai, but it's either harder than I anticipated or I need to lower my standards a bit (I'm not a fan of the oud).

[doyleoil]

hmm... I don't like those odds. But then again, I thought I'd find one in Dubai, but it's either harder than I anticipated or I need to lower my standards a bit (I'm not a fan of the oud).

got anything against piano?

[Skadden Stairs]

hmm... I don't like those odds. But then again, I thought I'd find one in Dubai, but it's either harder than I anticipated or I need to lower my standards a bit (I'm not a fan of the oud).

got anything against piano?

haha I meant the smelly oud

and pianos are lovely as long as I'm not expected to dust them

[Kronk]

I find it interesting how superior Michigan's program is to Virginia and Penn.

Guess I can cross Penn of my list of applications next year..

[doyleoil]

as promised, federal ibr is now listed as well, for your comparison

[convicted]

.

[dueprocess14]

Mod request: could one of you please, please, please sticky this before it gets lost? This will be infinitely helpful to people in the next two months and I think is valuable even to those trying to narrow down where they want to apply in the future.

Thanks, and props again to Doyle for an exceptional effort to get all of this compiled in one place. You rock!

[missv463]

thanks for this info!

could you also provide more insight on Cornell and Georgetown's LRAPs?

[alleycat3]

Does anyone know if the Federal IBR can be "stacked"? I'm sure there is a rule against this, because it would be just too easy, but could I get $100,000 of my loans forgiven by Berkeley and then the other $20,000 or whatever it is forgiven by IBR? I looked on the IBR website and couldn't find the answer, but it would be interesting to know for sure!

[mabelgs]

Possibly ignorant question:

When they talk about "cost of attendance," does that just mean tuition, or is housing included?

[paratactical]

.

[belligerentfuture]

Anybody in-the-know want to shed some light on the non-T14 LRAPs?

I tried to look into BC and BU but the information they provide publicly is really, well, vague.

+1 !!

[TrampsLikeU$]

Does anyone know if the Federal IBR can be "stacked"? I'm sure there is a rule against this, because it would be just too easy, but could I get $100,000 of my loans forgiven by Berkeley and then the other $20,000 or whatever it is forgiven by IBR? I looked on the IBR website and couldn't find the answer, but it would be interesting to know for sure!

At the GULC ASW in January it seemed like Andy Cornblatt was talking about this as a possibility. I think that some aspects of the Federal IBR are still up in the air or not well understood, even by law schol deans. Cornblatt was saying that GULC was going to restructure their LRAP program so that it would fit in better with the Fed program and save students the most money. I can't imagine why you wouldn't be able to stack them, but then again I'm not really familiar with the details of the IBR

[doyleoil]

chicago will allow you to "stack," but it's not the same kind of program as berkeley - i e-mailed the fin aid people at chicago about this the other day, and what it boiled down to was this: if you're making $60,000 or less, they'll give you up to $10,000/yr for loan repayment - that $10,000 would more than cover whatever payments you'd be making if you set up your repayment under ibr

of course, there's a limit of 7 years on benefits under chicago's lrap - but still, making $60,000 and paying nothing toward your loans for 7 out of 10 years isn't bad at all

with berkeley, you'd probably just have to set up two different loan repayments - but i don't know how that works, or if it is allowed (and using ibr to pay off a small amount like $20,000 doesn't really make sense, imo...you could probably get just as low a payment by doing the normal 10 year repayment, if you're starting from 20k)

[YCrevolution]

..

[aspasia]

Some info on NYU's expected student contribution during law school that they explained during the LRAP info session on Friday:

Based on your assets upon entering law school, the financial aid office determines a figure that they expect you to pay out of pocket each year, instead of taking out loans for the full cost of attendance. For example, if they determine your expected contribution to be $10,000/year, they would expect you to only take out loans for $58,000/year and LRAP will only cover that amount. The important aspect of this system for some of us is that if you have no assets upon entering law school (ie many of us coming straight from undergrad), they create a figure of $1700/year that they expect you to contribute and will penalize you for not contributing.

[This paragraph edited out because of incorrectness! Sorry.]

I don't know about other schools, but I just spoke with the Columbia financial aid office and they say they don't have a similar system for either of the above. Columbia does not come up with an expected contribution for each year of law school. Your assets and financial situation (based on the previous year's taxes only) are assessed when you graduate and join LRAP, and that plus your new income is what determines your expected loan payment.

[Pumpkin]

i actually don't know if this is right. i think it's overall student contribution- like 10 k and then you can subtract that from whatever year you want or a little each year.

b/c say someone has 10k in savings coming in, they'll be broke for years 2 and 3 so it wouldn't make sense to have to contribute that amount each year. i think most LRAPS won't cover the expected student contribution, which means the same thing- you shouldn't take out the full amount in loans. i think?

[aspasia]

Sorry if I wasn't clear, because I think we're talking about the same thing. They'll determine some sort of expected contribution that they expect you to make each year, so maybe you have $30,000 in the bank right now and they expect you to pay $10,000 of that each year for your tuition. If it's overall ($30k distributed over three years however you like), that works too.

The scary part of it, for me anyway, is that even if you have no assets they expect you to contribute something (1700/year = 5100 total; they gave these figures at the presentation) and then penalize you for having to take out the full loans.

I don't know how common it is for law schools to do this expected contribution thing, but I do know for sure that Columbia does not do it. Their LRAP calculation is based on the salary of your new job and your assets as of graduation, and there's no [invented, for those of us without money] figure that you should have contributed for the past three years.

[Pumpkin]

i think most schools will expect some student contribution, even if you shouldn't have one b/c you're broke. so nyu's lrap may not end up being worse by having a bottom limit, if say columbia comes back and say you have an estimated student contribution of 2k per year. all i know in hearing about nyu's is that it's way better than harvard's. dammit

[aspasia]

Wait, I'm a little confused- Columbia definitely does not have an expected student contribution for during law school (according to the finaid woman I just spoke with), so I'm not sure what you mean by that. Sorry for the confusion!

NYU's LRAP is definitely great, but I'm wondering if, for me and people in my exact situation, Columbia's might be a little better.

[el guapo]

Regarding NYU's penalty for private employment in the second summer, I believe they expect you to contribute any amount over 15,000, not simply the total amount. Thus, if you make 30,000, they would expect you to take out 15,000 less in loans for your 3L year. I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I believe these figures are fairly accurate.

[doyleoil]

^^^ i think that's right also - i included that info in (g) under pertinent data

[awesomepossum]

I wonder if some innovative school will ever call their program P.I.M.P.