My theoryon URM admissions Forum

[MyNameIsntJames]

I'm a 0L so take every single thing I'm going to say with a grain of salt but:



If you're anywhere north of a 3.0 GPA and 160 LSAT and you're an URM (particularly AA), then just blanket the top-14. No one here can tell you what your legitimate chances are where you'll end up at because URMs are super unpredictable. If you've followed the threads mapping the statistics, the URM acceptance report threads for various years, LSN data (which does NOT map all acceptances), etc., then you'll see that the results are literally all over the place. There's just such a limited number of URM profiles that fit YOURS exactly that you can't use it as an accurate predictor.

Stop letting TLS convince you where you can and can't get into. Stop trying to figure out what magic score you need to get into the school you want. You know what answers you do and don't want to hear. When you ask "Will a ____ with my GPA get me into ______?" you know you want everyone to say "Yeah man/girl it definitely will! Just look at this long ass list of other people just like you who got that score and got into the school you want to get into!" It's not going to happen. Ever. No one knows. Maybe you'll get in. Maybe you won't. If you're looking for a guarantee with this process then you aren't getting one, especially when it comes to HYS. Sure, with some of the lower ranked schools we can predict with relative accuracy who will get into where, but when we're talking the upper echelon? Who the hell knows. The most minute details like the way your PS is written, the timing of your application, that one other URM who happened to score 1 point higher than you that took that very last slot from you this year, the guy in the admissions' office had a shitty/amazing morning before he reviewed your application materials...who the hell knows?

I get it. We come from a world where just about everything is guaranteed. Show up to the job and work X hours and get this much money. Same with undergrad and school before that: You knew if you knew which Roman emperor died which year or how to solve this math problem then you'd get an A. Now all of a sudden you're trying to conquer the beast that is the LSAT and you've figured out that your unique position as a URM might give you that extra little push you need to get into a school like Harvard and you want someone up here to validate that belief for you because it sounds almost too good to be true.

Everyone says "just focus on getting a 180" or "act like you don't have a URM boost". And while that's great advice, I don't think its complete. In addition to those things, you need to evaluate yourself, the way you live, behave, think about things. Does it match up with what you would expect out of someone at HYS? Do you genuinely want to be there? Or do you just want to run around and tell everyone 'I got into Harvard!'. And shit, I'm not saying that's not normal. I mean who wouldn't feel like the man/woman after getting into Harvard? But that can't be the ONLY reason you want to be there. Do you feel like the area, school benefits, curriculum, etc., match what you WANT in this life? If so, then in addition to focusing on the LSAT, focus on YOU. This may be the only period of time in your life that you have before its balls to the walls for years upon years. Read self-development books, build a better spiritual relationship, grow your character and evolve in maturity. The thing about HYS is they aren't there to make you into HYS material, they expect you to be that material before you even show up on their doorstep. And they will scrutinize the hell out of you to make sure you're of that caliber before they open their doors to you. Other schools lower on the list will say "Well Johnny's LSAT and GPA were great. Accepted!" But its a different ball game. We're talking the BEST here. If you think that boils down to an LSAT score, then you've got the game fucked up. Just being blunt here.

These schools get applications from nothing but kids with great LSAT scores, great extracurriculars, softs and all around amazingness. Admissions officers at HYS aren't sitting their with their heads in their hands after every cycle saying "If only we could just find more applicants to meet our qualifications!" Numbers to these schools are like a "Ok you got your foot in the door, now lets see who you really are." These schools got a reputation to uphold.

My recommendation isn't so much to focus on will Harvard, Yale, Stanford accept you... You should build yourself up to the point where you ask the question "Why wouldn't they accept me?" And if you can get to that point then your worries should be put to the side. And if you can't get to that point, then maybe its just not for you. Your end goal of life shouldn't be law school. There's a reason you're studying your ass off just to get the OPPORTUNITY to spend upwards of 6 figures. If its for the prestige of saying "I went to Harvard!" then its probably not for you. If you have a concrete goal in mind and you've said to yourself "I can't get from point A to point B on my chart of goals without getting into ________, so I need to be there because that will help me a whole hell of a lot more than being at ________" then go ham. And if your drive is that strong then you'll still make it regardless. Sure there are lot of successful people that graduated from Harvard, but some people got into Harvard and didn't do shit (not a lot but still there are some). What use is that? Just like some people spend their whole lives perfecting their craft at a certain sport and then make the big leagues and ride the bench forever. Just because you're there doesn't mean you made it. And just because you didn't get there doesn't mean you won't make it. If your attitude, passion and drive are that strong and you still don't get in then fuck Harvard. They missed out on one hell of an individual who's gonna change the world.


You need to look at this law school thing as "Which school is going to accept the opportunity to have ME there?"

Don't approach this process with timidity or that 'oh please just let little old average me into your law school' because it reads all over your application in every single crevice and they smell that shit and say "Naw, he can go to northwestern" (sorry not shitting on northwestern, I'm just keeping it a stack).


I hope this pep talk got through to someone. Don't get so wrapped up in this law school thing that you forget why the hell you're even going. Don't sit in front of that LSAT panicking like you didn't study your ass off for months and drill this shit so well you could probably write an exam yourself. What you nervous for? You ARE great. You ARE smart. And you know that or you wouldn't have even attempted to go so hard studying for the LSAT because you would've said to yourself "I'm too stupid to even try this, let me go watch TV instead of wasting my time studying for this."

Moral of the story: Fuck who says where you can get into. Fuck who rejects you. Bust your ass trying to make your application the best damn application in America, URM or not. Write that PS like you're trying to win a Pulitzer off that damn thing. Take that LSAT like your mom ain't gonna eat tomorrow if you don't get that 180. This is your destiny. You've been on this planet 20+ years and its lead you to this moment. Seize it and conquer it. Don't get scared or back away now. Don't let someone showing you some corny statistics on some half ass website with a goofy scripted calculator that isn't really an accurate predictor discourage you from putting your MIND, HEART AND SOUL INTO THIS PROCESS. Go 180%. Never quit. Put your mind to this and conquer this shit like Sparta.

[BasilHallward]

tl;dr

[Barack O'Drama]

I think the first part of your theory about URM cycles being unpredictable is already widely accepted. However, I do think that for certain URMs, with high GPAs and LSAT scores, it is sort of easier to predict compared to their non-URM counterparts. IDK, just how it seems to me.

The rest of it sort of seems a bit disparate and jumbled up. I get what you're trying to say though and agree with the greater message.

ETA: I read the entire thing instead of just skimming the first parts. Haha. Are you using drugs, James?

[MyNameIsntJames]

I think the first part of your theory about URM cycles being unpredictable is already widely accepted. However, I do think that for certain URMs, with high GPAs and LSAT scores, it is sort of easier to predict compared to their non-URM counterparts. IDK, just how it seems to me.

The rest of it sort of seems a bit disparate and jumbled up. I get what you're trying to say though and agree with the greater message.

ETA: I read the entire thing instead of just skimming the first parts. Haha. Are you using drugs, James?

I just wrote it all spur of the moment from my phone without even attempting to proof read. I think I'm one of the legitimate cases of ADD in this world, so my thoughts just jump from topic to topic all the time. Like I gotta really sit down & outline something before I write or otherwise it'll read like this lmaooo.


My goal though is to just keep people motivated & hungry. I hate when I read posts on this site of someone saying "can I get into this school?" And people say "no" and they just say screw it then. Like cough up the money for the apps if you can't get fee waivers! Lol.

[pancakes3]

came for the hot takes. stayed for the hot takes.

[Barack O'Drama]

I think the first part of your theory about URM cycles being unpredictable is already widely accepted. However, I do think that for certain URMs, with high GPAs and LSAT scores, it is sort of easier to predict compared to their non-URM counterparts. IDK, just how it seems to me.

The rest of it sort of seems a bit disparate and jumbled up. I get what you're trying to say though and agree with the greater message.

ETA: I read the entire thing instead of just skimming the first parts. Haha. Are you using drugs, James?

I just wrote it all spur of the moment from my phone without even attempting to proof read. I think I'm one of the legitimate cases of ADD in this world, so my thoughts just jump from topic to topic all the time. Like I gotta really sit down & outline something before I write or otherwise it'll read like this lmaooo.


My goal though is to just keep people motivated & hungry. I hate when I read posts on this site of someone saying "can I get into this school?" And people say "no" and they just say screw it then. Like cough up the money for the apps if you can't get fee waivers! Lol.

I hear ya... I use my phone to go on here and probably mistype quite a bit. Not to mention all the grammatical problems. So no worries...

I really have to ask though, where on this site do these events occur?

It seems like when people don't get the answers they want in the "What are my chances?" thread, they all consist of generally the same narrative. Below I've written an example of the exchanges I see sometimes.

"Hey guys, I'm a lurker. I'm not retaking so don't tell me to do that. No negative comments please.
I'm aiming for HYS. I'm a URM with a 2.3 gpa and I'm currently PTing at a 190 on the LSAT (180+10pt URM boost) What are my chances for HYS?"

Then people reply:

Come back when you have a real LSAT score.

It is going to be near impossible to get into H with a 2.3, their GPA floor is somewhere around a 3.6.... If you get a 190 you will still have a great cycle good luck!


I think that response often gets interpreted as " You can never live your dreams, just give up, you're never going to make it!"

[Chad_IRL]

Everyone says "just focus on getting a 180" or "act like you don't have a URM boost". And while that's great advice, I don't think its complete. In addition to those things, you need to evaluate yourself, the way you live, behave, think about things. Does it match up with what you would expect out of someone at HYS? Do you genuinely want to be there? Or do you just want to run around and tell everyone 'I got into Harvard!'. And shit, I'm not saying that's not normal. I mean who wouldn't feel like the man/woman after getting into Harvard?

Where you at in life where you have the time to write this much nonsense on your phone? Also, is this like a motivational piece? Is this advice? Is it analysis?

Keep writin doe, I'm entertained.

[lymenheimer]

MNIJ;dr

[Yeezus Wept]

OP, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on these fora is now dumber for having read it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

[magnum_law]

OP, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on these fora is now dumber for having read it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

/Enter Steve Buscemi

[brinicolec]

Maybe since I read this early in the morning, I was also thinking erratically but I understood what you were saying. Not sure if I necessarily agreed with it all.... but I got what you were saying.

[maybeman]

I'm a 0L so take every single thing I'm going to say with a grain of salt but:



If you're anywhere north of a 3.0 GPA and 160 LSAT and you're an URM (particularly AA), then just blanket the top-14. No one here can tell you what your legitimate chances are where you'll end up at because URMs are super unpredictable. If you've followed the threads mapping the statistics, the URM acceptance report threads for various years, LSN data (which does NOT map all acceptances), etc., then you'll see that the results are literally all over the place. There's just such a limited number of URM profiles that fit YOURS exactly that you can't use it as an accurate predictor.

Stop letting TLS convince you where you can and can't get into. Stop trying to figure out what magic score you need to get into the school you want. You know what answers you do and don't want to hear. When you ask "Will a ____ with my GPA get me into ______?" you know you want everyone to say "Yeah man/girl it definitely will! Just look at this long ass list of other people just like you who got that score and got into the school you want to get into!" It's not going to happen. Ever. No one knows. Maybe you'll get in. Maybe you won't. If you're looking for a guarantee with this process then you aren't getting one, especially when it comes to HYS. Sure, with some of the lower ranked schools we can predict with relative accuracy who will get into where, but when we're talking the upper echelon? Who the hell knows. The most minute details like the way your PS is written, the timing of your application, that one other URM who happened to score 1 point higher than you that took that very last slot from you this year, the guy in the admissions' office had a shitty/amazing morning before he reviewed your application materials...who the hell knows?

I get it. We come from a world where just about everything is guaranteed. Show up to the job and work X hours and get this much money. Same with undergrad and school before that: You knew if you knew which Roman emperor died which year or how to solve this math problem then you'd get an A. Now all of a sudden you're trying to conquer the beast that is the LSAT and you've figured out that your unique position as a URM might give you that extra little push you need to get into a school like Harvard and you want someone up here to validate that belief for you because it sounds almost too good to be true.

Everyone says "just focus on getting a 180" or "act like you don't have a URM boost". And while that's great advice, I don't think its complete. In addition to those things, you need to evaluate yourself, the way you live, behave, think about things. Does it match up with what you would expect out of someone at HYS? Do you genuinely want to be there? Or do you just want to run around and tell everyone 'I got into Harvard!'. And shit, I'm not saying that's not normal. I mean who wouldn't feel like the man/woman after getting into Harvard? But that can't be the ONLY reason you want to be there. Do you feel like the area, school benefits, curriculum, etc., match what you WANT in this life? If so, then in addition to focusing on the LSAT, focus on YOU. This may be the only period of time in your life that you have before its balls to the walls for years upon years. Read self-development books, build a better spiritual relationship, grow your character and evolve in maturity. The thing about HYS is they aren't there to make you into HYS material, they expect you to be that material before you even show up on their doorstep. And they will scrutinize the hell out of you to make sure you're of that caliber before they open their doors to you. Other schools lower on the list will say "Well Johnny's LSAT and GPA were great. Accepted!" But its a different ball game. We're talking the BEST here. If you think that boils down to an LSAT score, then you've got the game fucked up. Just being blunt here.

These schools get applications from nothing but kids with great LSAT scores, great extracurriculars, softs and all around amazingness. Admissions officers at HYS aren't sitting their with their heads in their hands after every cycle saying "If only we could just find more applicants to meet our qualifications!" Numbers to these schools are like a "Ok you got your foot in the door, now lets see who you really are." These schools got a reputation to uphold.

My recommendation isn't so much to focus on will Harvard, Yale, Stanford accept you... You should build yourself up to the point where you ask the question "Why wouldn't they accept me?" And if you can get to that point then your worries should be put to the side. And if you can't get to that point, then maybe its just not for you. Your end goal of life shouldn't be law school. There's a reason you're studying your ass off just to get the OPPORTUNITY to spend upwards of 6 figures. If its for the prestige of saying "I went to Harvard!" then its probably not for you. If you have a concrete goal in mind and you've said to yourself "I can't get from point A to point B on my chart of goals without getting into ________, so I need to be there because that will help me a whole hell of a lot more than being at ________" then go ham. And if your drive is that strong then you'll still make it regardless. Sure there are lot of successful people that graduated from Harvard, but some people got into Harvard and didn't do shit (not a lot but still there are some). What use is that? Just like some people spend their whole lives perfecting their craft at a certain sport and then make the big leagues and ride the bench forever. Just because you're there doesn't mean you made it. And just because you didn't get there doesn't mean you won't make it. If your attitude, passion and drive are that strong and you still don't get in then fuck Harvard. They missed out on one hell of an individual who's gonna change the world.


You need to look at this law school thing as "Which school is going to accept the opportunity to have ME there?"

Don't approach this process with timidity or that 'oh please just let little old average me into your law school' because it reads all over your application in every single crevice and they smell that shit and say "Naw, he can go to northwestern" (sorry not shitting on northwestern, I'm just keeping it a stack).


I hope this pep talk got through to someone. Don't get so wrapped up in this law school thing that you forget why the hell you're even going. Don't sit in front of that LSAT panicking like you didn't study your ass off for months and drill this shit so well you could probably write an exam yourself. What you nervous for? You ARE great. You ARE smart. And you know that or you wouldn't have even attempted to go so hard studying for the LSAT because you would've said to yourself "I'm too stupid to even try this, let me go watch TV instead of wasting my time studying for this."

Moral of the story: Fuck who says where you can get into. Fuck who rejects you. Bust your ass trying to make your application the best damn application in America, URM or not. Write that PS like you're trying to win a Pulitzer off that damn thing. Take that LSAT like your mom ain't gonna eat tomorrow if you don't get that 180. This is your destiny. You've been on this planet 20+ years and its lead you to this moment. Seize it and conquer it. Don't get scared or back away now. Don't let someone showing you some corny statistics on some half ass website with a goofy scripted calculator that isn't really an accurate predictor discourage you from putting your MIND, HEART AND SOUL INTO THIS PROCESS. Go 180%. Never quit. Put your mind to this and conquer this shit like Sparta.

Which one of the following best summarizes the main point of the author in this passage?
(A) Despite the TLS consensus, all those wishing to prepare for the LSAT should do so without consideration of their background
(B) Despite the TLS consensus, some of those considering law school should not abide by TCRs and forge ahead, motivating themselves through hard work and self-made echo chambers
(C) Instead of acting like warriors from Greece, URMs should tackle the LSAT like warriors from Sparta
(D) Many of those who believe they do not have the numbers should still apply to HYS with the exception of URMs who have the potential for those numbers
(E) In line with the advice of TLS, URMs should pursue their dream school with fire and motivation, applying despite established data due to the unpredictability of URM cycles

According to the passage, TLS and MyNameIsn'tJames disagree about which one of the following?
(A) The unpredictability of URM cycles
(B) Whether or not URMs should apply to schools traditionally considered outside their range given the unpredictability of URM cycles
(C) The potential of URMs despite low numbers
(D) Whether or not applicants should focus on getting a 180 or a more realistic score
(E) If OP is a good or bad writer

In the second paragraph, the author of the passage discusses traditional TLS advise to applicants probably in order to
(A) Unearth shocking revelations never before considered
(B) Directly criticize users giving such advise
(C) Provide those asking such questions an alternative means of achieving an end
(D) Deny a factual relationship
(E) Troll

Which of the following analogies most closely parallels the author's analogy regarding Sparta?
(A) Workers at a business increasing productivity as compared to honeybees attacking a stranger
(B) A mailroom worker increasing his motivation like a superhero fights crime
(C) A dog digging deep to find the best bone like a warrior elephant going into battle
(D) A community coming together likened to individuals in that community rising to the top
(E) Two friends competing against one another like strawberries growing in a field



I'm realllly bored at work right now

[maybeman]

[+] Spoiler

B B C C

[Barack O'Drama]

[+] Spoiler

B B C C

Hahaha! Good stuff, I got 3/4. Got the last one wrong. But my parallel reasoning skills are a bit lacking.

[HonestAdvice]

You're really over complicating it, and it is simple and predictable.

If a school has a student who is below both medians, they hurt the ranking in two ways. This is why they're generally automatically out. URM's help the school's ranking so still might get in. If a school has a 170 LSAT median, whether a student has a 165 or 160 is irrelevant. Therefore, they can pick the student they like more.

While liking someone can be random, there are general things that stand out. If there was a ranking boost for Teach for America then you'd see the same thing play out there. It's not unpredictable.

[Aristogeiton1]

My recommendation isn't so much to focus on will Harvard, Yale, Stanford accept you... You should build yourself up to the point where you ask the question "Why wouldn't they accept me?" And if you can get to that point then your worries should be put to the side.

Yeah.
Be a URM.
Get a 175+
Get a 3.5+
Take the T-14 that gives you a full ride.
???
Profit.
Or forgo law school altogether and jump into one of the many enjoyable and lucrative careers that don't grind their associates into pseudo-bourgeoise dust.

[PrezRand]

I've always thought that if you have the median LSAT and GPA of the school you are applying to, you basically have a very high chance of getting in. The same applies to undergrad although there are rare cases where AAs with a 2300 don't get into some schools.

[Logicmaiden]

Been scanning this forum for years and this is probably the BEST theory/advice I've seen. The most realistic. It will reach some people but know that most people post and respond to stats/predictions, get out their anxieties through formulae...which is probably why this hasn't been well received. Still the most prescient post about 'not' over obsessing. Good job. And stay motivated, everyone.

[MyNameIsntJames]

I think the first part of your theory about URM cycles being unpredictable is already widely accepted. However, I do think that for certain URMs, with high GPAs and LSAT scores, it is sort of easier to predict compared to their non-URM counterparts. IDK, just how it seems to me.

The rest of it sort of seems a bit disparate and jumbled up. I get what you're trying to say though and agree with the greater message.

ETA: I read the entire thing instead of just skimming the first parts. Haha. Are you using drugs, James?

I just wrote it all spur of the moment from my phone without even attempting to proof read. I think I'm one of the legitimate cases of ADD in this world, so my thoughts just jump from topic to topic all the time. Like I gotta really sit down & outline something before I write or otherwise it'll read like this lmaooo.


My goal though is to just keep people motivated & hungry. I hate when I read posts on this site of someone saying "can I get into this school?" And people say "no" and they just say screw it then. Like cough up the money for the apps if you can't get fee waivers! Lol.

I hear ya... I use my phone to go on here and probably mistype quite a bit. Not to mention all the grammatical problems. So no worries...

I really have to ask though, where on this site do these events occur?

It seems like when people don't get the answers they want in the "What are my chances?" thread, they all consist of generally the same narrative. Below I've written an example of the exchanges I see sometimes.

"Hey guys, I'm a lurker. I'm not retaking so don't tell me to do that. No negative comments please.
I'm aiming for HYS. I'm a URM with a 2.3 gpa and I'm currently PTing at a 190 on the LSAT (180+10pt URM boost) What are my chances for HYS?"

Then people reply:

Come back when you have a real LSAT score.

It is going to be near impossible to get into H with a 2.3, their GPA floor is somewhere around a 3.6.... If you get a 190 you will still have a great cycle good luck!


I think that response often gets interpreted as " You can never live your dreams, just give up, you're never going to make it!"

You aren't all the way wrong in this regard. I've seen a decent amount of people get offended over legitimate and accurate advice. But there are some folks that have some sort of a shot that let their dreams get shot down on here lol and I don't get it. I just feel if someone believes in their heart they can get somewhere then fuck it... Go hard and apply. They can argue with us but not that admissions' decision and that will be it. At the end of the day even if they don't get into their dream school, the extra effort they put in as an attempt will serve them well in some other way (i.e. lower ranked schools that will be more likely to accept/raise schollies because of their diligent efforts), so its a win/win.

[MyNameIsntJames]

Maybe since I read this early in the morning, I was also thinking erratically but I understood what you were saying. Not sure if I necessarily agreed with it all.... but I got what you were saying.

I typed this from my phone one night while drinking , Forgive me I know the OP is incredibly disorganized and incoherent lol.

[MyNameIsntJames]

Been scanning this forum for years and this is probably the BEST theory/advice I've seen. The most realistic. It will reach some people but know that most people post and respond to stats/predictions, get out their anxieties through formulae...which is probably why this hasn't been well received. Still the most prescient post about 'not' over obsessing. Good job. And stay motivated, everyone.

Thank you!

[Justtrying2help]

First time seeing this thread but I gave a similar theory with my personal anecdote in another thread and was trolled relentlessly by some poster who probably won't crack the t-14. Urms with solid stats and strong writing abilities will have a good chance at getting big money at good schools.

[Barack O'Drama]

I think the first part of your theory about URM cycles being unpredictable is already widely accepted. However, I do think that for certain URMs, with high GPAs and LSAT scores, it is sort of easier to predict compared to their non-URM counterparts. IDK, just how it seems to me.

The rest of it sort of seems a bit disparate and jumbled up. I get what you're trying to say though and agree with the greater message.

ETA: I read the entire thing instead of just skimming the first parts. Haha. Are you using drugs, James?

I just wrote it all spur of the moment from my phone without even attempting to proof read. I think I'm one of the legitimate cases of ADD in this world, so my thoughts just jump from topic to topic all the time. Like I gotta really sit down & outline something before I write or otherwise it'll read like this lmaooo.


My goal though is to just keep people motivated & hungry. I hate when I read posts on this site of someone saying "can I get into this school?" And people say "no" and they just say screw it then. Like cough up the money for the apps if you can't get fee waivers! Lol.

I hear ya... I use my phone to go on here and probably mistype quite a bit. Not to mention all the grammatical problems. So no worries...

I really have to ask though, where on this site do these events occur?

It seems like when people don't get the answers they want in the "What are my chances?" thread, they all consist of generally the same narrative. Below I've written an example of the exchanges I see sometimes.

"Hey guys, I'm a lurker. I'm not retaking so don't tell me to do that. No negative comments please.
I'm aiming for HYS. I'm a URM with a 2.3 gpa and I'm currently PTing at a 190 on the LSAT (180+10pt URM boost) What are my chances for HYS?"

Then people reply:

Come back when you have a real LSAT score.

It is going to be near impossible to get into H with a 2.3, their GPA floor is somewhere around a 3.6.... If you get a 190 you will still have a great cycle good luck!


I think that response often gets interpreted as " You can never live your dreams, just give up, you're never going to make it!"

You aren't all the way wrong in this regard. I've seen a decent amount of people get offended over legitimate and accurate advice. But there are some folks that have some sort of a shot that let their dreams get shot down on here lol and I don't get it. I just feel if someone believes in their heart they can get somewhere then fuck it... Go hard and apply. They can argue with us but not that admissions' decision and that will be it. At the end of the day even if they don't get into their dream school, the extra effort they put in as an attempt will serve them well in some other way (i.e. lower ranked schools that will be more likely to accept/raise schollies because of their diligent efforts), so its a win/win.

Yeah, I agree with your post. We shouldn't ever let negative people on a forum get us down or keep us from trying. That said, we have to be realistic, and sometimes what I enjoy most about TLS is the blunt honesty one receives. I guess it is advantageous to see beyond the purely negative shit, evaluate the truthful stuff you might not want to hear, and forge ahead to your dreams.

I'm a URM with a 3.9, average softs, and no LSAT yet. I am hoping that with a 170 I can get Harvard. Everyone on here has more or less been truthful and supportive of that goal. Of course online you're bound to encounter trolls and those that get pleasure from upsetting a complete stranger, but you can't worry about that shit. So I agree with you there, James.

How is your LSAT prep coming anyways? I remember seeing you post on here a bunch back in April and then you sort of disappeared? How have you been ?

[MyNameIsntJames]

I think the first part of your theory about URM cycles being unpredictable is already widely accepted. However, I do think that for certain URMs, with high GPAs and LSAT scores, it is sort of easier to predict compared to their non-URM counterparts. IDK, just how it seems to me.

The rest of it sort of seems a bit disparate and jumbled up. I get what you're trying to say though and agree with the greater message.

ETA: I read the entire thing instead of just skimming the first parts. Haha. Are you using drugs, James?

I just wrote it all spur of the moment from my phone without even attempting to proof read. I think I'm one of the legitimate cases of ADD in this world, so my thoughts just jump from topic to topic all the time. Like I gotta really sit down & outline something before I write or otherwise it'll read like this lmaooo.


My goal though is to just keep people motivated & hungry. I hate when I read posts on this site of someone saying "can I get into this school?" And people say "no" and they just say screw it then. Like cough up the money for the apps if you can't get fee waivers! Lol.

I hear ya... I use my phone to go on here and probably mistype quite a bit. Not to mention all the grammatical problems. So no worries...

I really have to ask though, where on this site do these events occur?

It seems like when people don't get the answers they want in the "What are my chances?" thread, they all consist of generally the same narrative. Below I've written an example of the exchanges I see sometimes.

"Hey guys, I'm a lurker. I'm not retaking so don't tell me to do that. No negative comments please.
I'm aiming for HYS. I'm a URM with a 2.3 gpa and I'm currently PTing at a 190 on the LSAT (180+10pt URM boost) What are my chances for HYS?"

Then people reply:

Come back when you have a real LSAT score.

It is going to be near impossible to get into H with a 2.3, their GPA floor is somewhere around a 3.6.... If you get a 190 you will still have a great cycle good luck!


I think that response often gets interpreted as " You can never live your dreams, just give up, you're never going to make it!"

You aren't all the way wrong in this regard. I've seen a decent amount of people get offended over legitimate and accurate advice. But there are some folks that have some sort of a shot that let their dreams get shot down on here lol and I don't get it. I just feel if someone believes in their heart they can get somewhere then fuck it... Go hard and apply. They can argue with us but not that admissions' decision and that will be it. At the end of the day even if they don't get into their dream school, the extra effort they put in as an attempt will serve them well in some other way (i.e. lower ranked schools that will be more likely to accept/raise schollies because of their diligent efforts), so its a win/win.

Yeah, I agree with your post. We shouldn't ever let negative people on a forum get us down or keep us from trying. That said, we have to be realistic, and sometimes what I enjoy most about TLS is the blunt honesty one receives. I guess it is advantageous to see beyond the purely negative shit, evaluate the truthful stuff you might not want to hear, and forge ahead to your dreams.

I'm a URM with a 3.9, average softs, and no LSAT yet. I am hoping that with a 170 I can get Harvard. Everyone on here has more or less been truthful and supportive of that goal. Of course online you're bound to encounter trolls and those that get pleasure from upsetting a complete stranger, but you can't worry about that shit. So I agree with you there, James.

How is your LSAT prep coming anyways? I remember seeing you post on here a bunch back in April and then you sort of disappeared? How have you been ?

Damn your GPA is nice. Study your ass off bro, 170s and the world is your oyster lol.

And I had to disappear to study honestly. I was starting to get addicted to these forums. Every now & then I slip back in it though lol. Studying's been ehhh. Its a very slow process but its getting there. Wish I was PT'ing a little higher right now (still low 170s, which I think might translate to a 168), but who knows what two more solid months will do for me.

How's your studying going bro?

[Barack O'Drama]

I think the first part of your theory about URM cycles being unpredictable is already widely accepted. However, I do think that for certain URMs, with high GPAs and LSAT scores, it is sort of easier to predict compared to their non-URM counterparts. IDK, just how it seems to me.

The rest of it sort of seems a bit disparate and jumbled up. I get what you're trying to say though and agree with the greater message.

ETA: I read the entire thing instead of just skimming the first parts. Haha. Are you using drugs, James?

I just wrote it all spur of the moment from my phone without even attempting to proof read. I think I'm one of the legitimate cases of ADD in this world, so my thoughts just jump from topic to topic all the time. Like I gotta really sit down & outline something before I write or otherwise it'll read like this lmaooo.


My goal though is to just keep people motivated & hungry. I hate when I read posts on this site of someone saying "can I get into this school?" And people say "no" and they just say screw it then. Like cough up the money for the apps if you can't get fee waivers! Lol.

I hear ya... I use my phone to go on here and probably mistype quite a bit. Not to mention all the grammatical problems. So no worries...

I really have to ask though, where on this site do these events occur?

It seems like when people don't get the answers they want in the "What are my chances?" thread, they all consist of generally the same narrative. Below I've written an example of the exchanges I see sometimes.

"Hey guys, I'm a lurker. I'm not retaking so don't tell me to do that. No negative comments please.
I'm aiming for HYS. I'm a URM with a 2.3 gpa and I'm currently PTing at a 190 on the LSAT (180+10pt URM boost) What are my chances for HYS?"

Then people reply:

Come back when you have a real LSAT score.

It is going to be near impossible to get into H with a 2.3, their GPA floor is somewhere around a 3.6.... If you get a 190 you will still have a great cycle good luck!


I think that response often gets interpreted as " You can never live your dreams, just give up, you're never going to make it!"

You aren't all the way wrong in this regard. I've seen a decent amount of people get offended over legitimate and accurate advice. But there are some folks that have some sort of a shot that let their dreams get shot down on here lol and I don't get it. I just feel if someone believes in their heart they can get somewhere then fuck it... Go hard and apply. They can argue with us but not that admissions' decision and that will be it. At the end of the day even if they don't get into their dream school, the extra effort they put in as an attempt will serve them well in some other way (i.e. lower ranked schools that will be more likely to accept/raise schollies because of their diligent efforts), so its a win/win.

Yeah, I agree with your post. We shouldn't ever let negative people on a forum get us down or keep us from trying. That said, we have to be realistic, and sometimes what I enjoy most about TLS is the blunt honesty one receives. I guess it is advantageous to see beyond the purely negative shit, evaluate the truthful stuff you might not want to hear, and forge ahead to your dreams.

I'm a URM with a 3.9, average softs, and no LSAT yet. I am hoping that with a 170 I can get Harvard. Everyone on here has more or less been truthful and supportive of that goal. Of course online you're bound to encounter trolls and those that get pleasure from upsetting a complete stranger, but you can't worry about that shit. So I agree with you there, James.

How is your LSAT prep coming anyways? I remember seeing you post on here a bunch back in April and then you sort of disappeared? How have you been ?

Damn your GPA is nice. Study your ass off bro, 170s and the world is your oyster lol.

And I had to disappear to study honestly. I was starting to get addicted to these forums. Every now & then I slip back in it though lol. Studying's been ehhh. Its a very slow process but its getting there. Wish I was PT'ing a little higher right now (still low 170s, which I think might translate to a 168), but who knows what two more solid months will do for me.

How's your studying going bro?

Damn, I am jealous of your LSAT progress... I am working hard, but it has been a slow process for me. I wasted a lot of time in the beginning of my prep looking for "silver bullet" or secrets to "gaming" the test. So right now I have found what is working for me (7Sage + The LSAT Trainer + Manhattan Prep) and as a result switched my test date to December. I would have loved to keep September, but I wasted a month and realized this test is too important for me. Honestly, if I don't do as well as I hope in December, I have no problem with sitting out a cycle to ensure I get my ass into the schools I want. H Y or Cornell, Colombia, NYU. I'm not really interested in any other school..

So right now it is going alright. I am working hard going through the course curriculum and really making sure I study the fundamentals of the test. I realized that I am really good at learning, and honestly enjoy it. So I am playing on my strengths and hoping it translates to success. I am realizing that a lot of the LSAT advice out there is flawed and that I don't think it makes total sense to take 30 practice tests and gain your improvement there. I think it makes more sense to go through the prep materials over and over and drill your weaknesses. I think it is easier to isolate your weaknesses by doing this and correct them more effectively. I also think timed sections are important as well.

I have a good feeling--So I'm hoping by December I will be able to score in the 170s. Even so, I think with my stats I should be able to get H with a mid-to-high 160s. I don't want to leave it up to chance, so I am working my ass off for that 170!

I'm glad you realized you were having a little addiction to the forum and took time to study. That's great man. I hope we end up at H together and achieve all of our dreams!

What prep materials have you been using? Anything out of the ordinary?