URM 2014-2015 Cycle Thread Forum

[gamerish]

Post removed...

[okaygo]

Hi hi hi 0Ls!

I just finished my first semester at a T10. I hope your cycles are all going well. I remember feeling very stressed around this time of year regarding choosing which school I wanted to attend, and thinking about scholarship offers/negotiation season coming soon. If you all have any questions feel free to PM me - no guarantee I'll keep checking the thread.

Good luck!

Thanks for reaching out to us 0Ls! True leadership! Me likey!

Any advice? Exam prep? Networking? Professor relationships? Selecting a school (is culture undervalued)?

Because I'm only a 1L halfway through, I'm going to limit my advice to something I consider myself thoroughly knowledgable of - school selection.

Mechanics:

As I told a user who PM'ed me earlier, I think it is very important to consider the rank of your school. I know TCR on TLS is that it might make more sense to to attend, say, a T30 on a full ride in lieu of sticker at a T10/14. I do not know if I would impart that advice to someone else.

The logic behind all of that advice is that if you don't have the GPA to snag big law, then it's okay because you don't have the debt load that requires big law to pay it off. But this logic ignores the argument that if you really do want big law, firms are willing to go deeper into the class the higher ranked your school is. And if big law is something you actually want, then it may make more sense to go to the higher ranked school and land somewhere around the median there.

School Culture

If I had listened to a 2L that I spoke with before attending my law school I would have picked GULC instead of where I am now. So glad I didn't. I LOVE MY SCHOOL. It's such a better time than the image that was imparted on me, and I think that the relationships that I am building here were integral to my success last semester. So, yes, I do believe that school culture plays a huge part to mitigate the stress of law school - but I would also argue that you can't really get a good idea of a school's culture until you attend the school. At the very least survey multiple people.

Congrats on the acceptances today 0Ls!

[Tr3]

Ahh congrats for all the great news ITT!!!!


On another note... just submitted FAFSA and NeedAccess! NA sucks. Come on, I just want some money from one of these schools! lol ...but actually...


It's the little victories

[JamaicanSaiyan8]

Just received SEO interview invite!! Any input on what to be expected is welcomed and greatly appreciated!!

[LoganCouture]

I'm a happily committed woman, haha. I got this poll suggestion from DiniMae a while back and I'm curious to see the results! If y'all want to find love in the URM thread though, that'd be fine too

Yes blame me! But I'm like jemthey where it depends on where I go. My man isn't at all excited about Columbia......so there's that......

Really, why not? My SO would be happy with T6 (minus Yale, I think he secretly wishes I won't get accepted so that he doesn't have to live in New Haven) just because they're all in or near big cities. Not so hot on UVA, Mich, etc.

He's from the suburbs and can't imagine life any other way, so the UWS isn't appealing. He's #TeamB all the way -- he's ready for sunshine, especially with this snowstorm.

Well, B is beautiful and sunny after the fog burns off. Idk if I'd call it suburban though - well, not compared to other parts of the Bay anyway. It's a really cool area, although I don't know it super well. I'm sure if you bring him to ASW he'll fall even more in love with Boalt!

[03282016]

[DiniMae]

Ahh congrats for all the great news ITT!!!!


On another note... just submitted FAFSA and NeedAccess! NA sucks. Come on, I just want some money from one of these schools! lol ...but actually...


It's the little victories

I totally jumped on these as early as I could. FAFSA Jan 1, NeedAccess on the 17th - only was that late because I had to email my mom multiple times before she finally filled it out. Ugh.

Is there a point in filling this out if you and/or parents make a decent living? I think I'm going to have trouble getting my parent info.

[DiniMae]

Just received SEO interview invite!! Any input on what to be expected is welcomed and greatly appreciated!!

Good luck!

Know why you want to participate in SEO and which firms you'd like to work at. I think that's most important.

[03282016]

[90convoy]

Since we are on the topic

Are there any good resources to estimate the amount of need aid one will get?

[jlwx]

Just got off the phone with Dean Z.

GOT THE FULL DARROW AT MICHIGAN!!! SO UNBELIEVABLY HAPPY!

[DiniMae]

Since we are on the topic

Are there any good resources to estimate the amount of need aid one will get?

+1

Also, I used one of those calculators that told me what my EFC is -- is that subtracted from the cost of tuition and fees and then the school looks at what's left?

[DiniMae]

Just got off the phone with Dean Z.

GOT THE FULL DARROW AT MICHIGAN!!! SO UNBELIEVABLY HAPPY!

WOOOOWWWWWW!!!!!! Major congrats!!!!! Great job!

Glad to know Michigan doesn't care about a little snow.

[jemthey17]

Just got off the phone with Dean Z.

GOT THE FULL DARROW AT MICHIGAN!!! SO UNBELIEVABLY HAPPY!

AHHHHHHH!!!!!! Congrats! Well-deserved!

[cc78]

Just got off the phone with Dean Z.

GOT THE FULL DARROW AT MICHIGAN!!! SO UNBELIEVABLY HAPPY!

Congrats!

[jemthey17]

CC, do you mind if I ask why Stanford is your favorite? You can PM me, if you don't want to share publicly. I'm just having the hardest time here because I love so many schools.

[Tr3]

Just got off the phone with Dean Z.

GOT THE FULL DARROW AT MICHIGAN!!! SO UNBELIEVABLY HAPPY!

CONGRATS!!!

Is there a point in filling this out if you and/or parents make a decent living? I think I'm going to have trouble getting my parent info.

Varies by school. Check out the fin aid policies of the schools you're applying to because some require you to submit NeedAccess for merit scholarship consideration. If you want to try and get a Federal loan, you'll need to complete the FAFSA (which is a lot simpler than NeedAccess). To echo Wahrheit, it might add money to your package (it might not...). I would say do FAFSA first to see what your EFC is and then go from there.

Also, I used one of those calculators that told me what my EFC is -- is that subtracted from the cost of tuition and fees and then the school looks at what's left?

Generally, yes. But that's not to say the school will cover the remaining balance, that just gives them an indication of your need gap and then if they are feeling generous/have a big enough endowment, they could help you close that gap. They will, however, expect you to cover a good chunk with loans (they'll probably package you with Federal loans if you qualify).

[cc78]

Hey Jem,

I'm happy to share out here in the open because I've really enjoyed reading other people's thoughts about this whole game. Stanford for me is the strong leader in the clubhouse for a few reasons:

1. I'm pretty sure I am going to chase academia and basically, its Y>>>>>>S>>>H if that's your goal. I'm really excited also about SLS' joint degree programs, and would probably look at a PhD also if I can get into a program there (not easy...).

2. HLS is off the table for me...I've shared why with a number of folks, but please just trust me that it's off the table.

3. I love that SLS is small (smallest class size in the T14). I've been to business school and one thing I hated (among just about everything...God I hated business school) was my sense of alienation from from the school and from my classmates. Part of this was because I had such divergent interests from them. Business school is all about getting rich, and I am all about helping people. But another part of it was that the size of the school (~450 students in my class) allowed me to isolate myself. I am really attracted to a place where I can't hide.

4. I'm in my mid-30's and didn't exactly build a fortune working for the people, so SLS' need-based aid should be substantial for me. As a reference point, I got max aid at HLS.

5. I love SLS' rep for being laid back. I don't like hyper neurotic type-A folks and much prefer going to school with folks who are smart and going exciting places, to be sure, but also aren't anxiously asking about grades and ranks every other minute.

6. I'm a weather wimp. I live in the south now and the idea of doing snow and cold again just isn't appealing.

So that equals SLS for me. Now, because of my goals, I would have to strongly consider YLS if they blessed me with a call, or the Ruby or the RTK (academia qualifies for the RTK). If Penn gave a Levy for many reasons I'd have to at least consider it. The risk of going to those schools, though, even if they are free is that I'd either need to finish absurdly high in the class or absolutely get the PhD in order to have a chance at academia. Northwestern is also definitely in the running because they have an extant JD/PhD program with a number of departments and have a pretty good recent placement record.

That being said, I know that SLS will not have the kind of community of students of color, particularly African-Americans, that HLS has (there are two times as many black students at HLS as there are at Yale and Stanford combined). It's a huge trade-off, but one that I could justify for myself.

So, then, Jemthey, you can see why I want you to come on to SLS...we need to get that paltry 34 number up at least over 40.

[jemthey17]

Thank you so much, CC! This was super helpful for me and I'm sure helpful for other people in this thread trying to figure out where they will ultimately end up.

[LoganCouture]

One thing to consider though is if jemthey is leaning (nonacademic) PI - Harvard's LRAP seems better/more flexible (on first glance) than Stanford's. Of course, Yale's is better than both.

Not sure if #5 is true for Stanford...I personally think the laidback reputation is undeserved. But the niceness of the weather cannot be overstated.

[cc78]

One thing to consider though is if jemthey is leaning (nonacademic) PI - Harvard's LRAP seems better/more flexible (on first glance) than Stanford's. Of course, Yale's is better than both.

Not sure if #5 is true for Stanford...I personally think the laidback reputation is undeserved. But the niceness of the weather cannot be overstated.

Fair enough, and you have an authority on #5, LC that most of us only wish we could have. Maybe it's also relative--a few of these schools strike me as being terrifyingly competitive (HLS and CLS immediately come to mind).

And, as someone posted yesterday, the only way to really know a school's culture is to actually attend. If SLS turns out to be a little more stressed than I had hoped, I could live with that.

[LoganCouture]

One thing to consider though is if jemthey is leaning (nonacademic) PI - Harvard's LRAP seems better/more flexible (on first glance) than Stanford's. Of course, Yale's is better than both.

Not sure if #5 is true for Stanford...I personally think the laidback reputation is undeserved. But the niceness of the weather cannot be overstated.

Fair enough, and you have an authority on #5, LC that most of us only wish we could have. Maybe it's also relative--a few of these schools strike me as being terrifyingly competitive (HLS and CLS immediately come to mind).

And, as someone posted yesterday, the only way to really know a school's culture is to actually attend. If SLS turns out to be a little more stressed than I had hoped, I could live with that.

You're right, and I've never had the opportunity to judge HLS/other schools in the same way so I can't really compare them either. I think ultimately all schools are stressful and maybe you're right that Stanford is less so. Stanford's small size gives it the edge over HLS in many respects, and I'd consider the reduced gunner-ness/competition a side effect of that. There are more spots available (not only jobs but journals, leadership positions in student orgs, etc.) relative to the number of students and I think that goes a long way towards reducing competition.

[cc78]

You're right, and I've never had the opportunity to judge HLS/other schools in the same way so I can't really compare them either. I think ultimately all schools are stressful and maybe you're right that Stanford is less so. Stanford's small size gives it the edge over HLS in many respects, and I'd consider the reduced gunner-ness/competition a side effect of that. There are more spots available (not only jobs but journals, leadership positions in student orgs, etc.) relative to the number of students and I think that goes a long way towards reducing competition.

Oh, here's belated #7: You don't have to grade onto the Stanford Law Review, like you do in perhaps the most competitive thing in the world of law school, grading onto the Harvard Law Review And sadly, folks like me have to care about getting onto Law Review.

[LoganCouture]

You're right, and I've never had the opportunity to judge HLS/other schools in the same way so I can't really compare them either. I think ultimately all schools are stressful and maybe you're right that Stanford is less so. Stanford's small size gives it the edge over HLS in many respects, and I'd consider the reduced gunner-ness/competition a side effect of that. There are more spots available (not only jobs but journals, leadership positions in student orgs, etc.) relative to the number of students and I think that goes a long way towards reducing competition.

Oh, here's belated #7: You don't have to grade onto the Stanford Law Review, like you do in perhaps the most competitive thing in the world of law school, grading onto the Harvard Law Review And sadly, folks like me have to care about getting onto Law Review.

There are write-on spots on Harvard's, no?

[FairchildFLT]

Ahh congrats for all the great news ITT!!!!


On another note... just submitted FAFSA and NeedAccess! NA sucks. Come on, I just want some money from one of these schools! lol ...but actually...


It's the little victories

I totally jumped on these as early as I could. FAFSA Jan 1, NeedAccess on the 17th - only was that late because I had to email my mom multiple times before she finally filled it out. Ugh.

Is there a point in filling this out if you and/or parents make a decent living? I think I'm going to have trouble getting my parent info.

Dini you're a vet so I assume you don't live at home anymore...so you shouldn't need your parents information. I think military, marriage, or kids means you're an adult in FAFSAs eyes.