Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

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AdminMegan

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Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by AdminMegan » Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:02 pm

Do you have dreams of becoming a Supreme Court Justice? Currently, every one of the Supreme Court Justices has attended either Harvard or Yale; if Supreme Court nominee Amy Coney Barrett gets nominated however this will end the reign of the prestigious ivy league graduates. In the history of the United States, only 48 of the 112 justices graduated from law school. Those that did graduate were all from prestigious schools. Share your thoughts!

acr

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by acr » Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:11 pm

Cool

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by acr » Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:18 pm

This site used to be so helpful and informative and now we have mods posting garbage topics like this

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by Rooks » Tue Oct 06, 2020 7:37 pm

Lol a mod really posted this? I'm not a religious man, but I spit out one word after reading this... Jesus

Next thread: "hey guys, Trump went to Penn undergrad. Does this mean if I go to Penn undergrad that I'll become the next president if I work hard?"

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by Voy3urBoy » Tue Oct 06, 2020 9:35 pm

:lol: I share in your disappointment
acr wrote:
Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:18 pm
This site used to be so helpful and informative and now we have mods posting garbage topics like this

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:31 pm

How likely is the signal boost going to translate to a rankings climb for ND?

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by winterwolf » Sat Oct 10, 2020 5:59 pm

laanngo wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:31 pm
How likely is the signal boost going to translate to a rankings climb for ND?
Interesting Q. Nothing really to compare it to. It's 22 now and usually ranges in the T20-30 if I'm correct. I'd assume it'd break into T19-T17, but find it difficult to believe it'll go higher than GW/WUSTL/UCLA, unless the next class is also obscenely strong.

Long-term consequences to reputation are really interesting though.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:33 pm

winterwolf wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 5:59 pm
Interesting Q. Nothing really to compare it to. It's 22 now and usually ranges in the T20-30 if I'm correct. I'd assume it'd break into T19-T17, but find it difficult to believe it'll go higher than GW/WUSTL/UCLA, unless the next class is also obscenely strong.

Long-term consequences to reputation are really interesting though.
Honestly UCLA/WUSTL/Vandy/USC have better things going for them than a signal boost via a Scotus person. Signal boost only matters if your signal is good in the first place, and there's no question that T19 schools are great if you actually want to be a lawyer. ND might make T20 an actual thing by closing the revolving door at spot #20.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by nixy » Sun Oct 11, 2020 12:31 am

laanngo wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:31 pm
How likely is the signal boost going to translate to a rankings climb for ND?
It's not.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Sun Oct 11, 2020 10:52 am

nixy wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 12:31 am
laanngo wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:31 pm
How likely is the signal boost going to translate to a rankings climb for ND?
It's not.
Care to explain?

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cavalier1138

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by cavalier1138 » Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:05 am

laanngo wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 10:52 am
nixy wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 12:31 am
laanngo wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:31 pm
How likely is the signal boost going to translate to a rankings climb for ND?
It's not.
Care to explain?
Law school rankings are not impacted by one alum getting a coveted position in the legal field.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Sun Oct 11, 2020 10:01 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:05 am
Law school rankings are not impacted by one alum getting a coveted position in the legal field.
Generally not - it's about what the entering class can realistically expect. but Scotus is a high profile and highly desired position. It's akin to a bunch of free advertisements that the general population sees. I have no doubt that HLS producing more scotus justices than Y has contributed to the pop mythology that it's better. When thinking of a top 25 school to apply to, there's a great chance someone recalls off the top of their head ND since ACB has been in the news a lot recently and will continue to do so as long as she is associated with Trump. Is this large enough to affect the rankings? If we were talking about GULC v Cornell then absolutely not, but rankings are much more pliable down the road.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by nixy » Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:08 pm

laanngo wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 10:01 pm
cavalier1138 wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:05 am
Law school rankings are not impacted by one alum getting a coveted position in the legal field.
Generally not - it's about what the entering class can realistically expect. but Scotus is a high profile and highly desired position. It's akin to a bunch of free advertisements that the general population sees. I have no doubt that HLS producing more scotus justices than Y has contributed to the pop mythology that it's better. When thinking of a top 25 school to apply to, there's a great chance someone recalls off the top of their head ND since ACB has been in the news a lot recently and will continue to do so as long as she is associated with Trump. Is this large enough to affect the rankings? If we were talking about GULC v Cornell then absolutely not, but rankings are much more pliable down the road.
It still won't make a difference. ND is what ND is, ACB isn't getting nominated b/c she went to ND. The rankings also aren't determined by what the general population thinks; the general population doesn't create them, USNWR does (and the reputation part of the ranking is based on evaluations by judges/practicing lawyers). Also I don't think the general population is weighing how many SCOTUS justices went to Harvard v. Yale, Harvard is just a bigger name/brand. Rolex has much bigger brand recognition than, say, Patek Philippe, but that doesn't determine how watch aficionados rank them.

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mjb447

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by mjb447 » Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:19 pm

But Y is still ranked higher - even if you were right about the existence and origins of that "pop mythology," the rankings don't care that much about it.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:37 pm

mjb447 wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:19 pm
But Y is still ranked higher - even if you were right about the existence and origins of that "pop mythology," the rankings don't care that much about it.
Everyone in lawyering knows Yale is the best in spite of the pop mythology. But is ND law 22? 25? It's less clear than Y=1, G=14, which is why the news of UND law getting into the supreme court painting it positively might lead to faculty assessment and prospective students to treat it better than its current rank. As I said,
laanngo wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 10:01 pm
If we were talking about GULC v Cornell then absolutely not, but rankings are much more pliable down the road.
1 person from UNDLS (who graduated a while ago) getting a scotus seat doesn't mean anything for current students (unless Barrett decides on preference for her alma mater in hiring clerks) in the way that consistently getting students into article 3 clerkships expects students at a law school to do the same in following years. It's great advertising though.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:45 pm

nixy wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:08 pm
It still won't make a difference. ND is what ND is, ACB isn't getting nominated b/c she went to ND.
Of course not. But it's a lot of positive press for the law school, in suggesting that it is good enough to get someone on the supreme bench. If nothing else, it's notable and will cause ND law to stick around in someone's mind in a positive way when applying to law schools. Unlike the justices of Obama or Bush, extra attention will be lavished on her throughout the years due to being nominated by a President the press won't shut up about.
nixy wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:08 pm
Also I don't think the general population is weighing how many SCOTUS justices went to Harvard v. Yale, Harvard is just a bigger name/brand.
Yes but a quick perusal of number of scotus justices per law school confirms the bias. It certainly didn't create it.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by nixy » Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:55 pm

You’re conflating a whole bunch of things - rankings, positive press, popular opinion, etc. They’re not all the same thing. And it doesn’t matter whether ND is ranked 22 or 25. That’s not going to make a difference to anyone and it doesn’t change what ND is in any way.

There are also only 9 justices. She’s going to get attention because she’s one of nine, not because Trump appointed her. There are also people whose opinion of her (and ND) will decline because she’s a Trump appointee.

Also the “bias” toward Harvard is because there are more Harvard grads, not because Harvard is better at creating SCOTUS justices.

I mean, you are more than welcome to believe that ACB getting nominated/appointed has some significance for ND, I just don’t think most people (outside ND’s PR department) are going to agree with you.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by The Lsat Airbender » Mon Oct 12, 2020 3:32 pm

Do we need to expand the "T6" to seven, or is it simply time to accept that the "N" in "CCN" stands for Notre Dame?

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:02 pm

nixy wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:55 pm
You’re conflating a whole bunch of things - rankings, positive press, popular opinion, etc.
Other people do that too, which can result in an actual rankings change.
nixy wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 2:55 pm
I mean, you are more than welcome to believe that ACB getting nominated/appointed has some significance for ND, I just don’t think most people (outside ND’s PR department) are going to agree with you.
Does it mean nothing? If nothing else, it's noteworthy. Exactly how significant is it? If ND and another law school were equally good then wouldn't you say ND is now better in having better optics?

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by nixy » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:19 pm

No. It gives their PR machine something to churn, but I don’t think that improves their optics.

I’m also not sure you know how the rankings are calculated.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by The Lsat Airbender » Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:42 pm

Counterpoint: Stanford's presence on SCOTUS in the late 20th century with Rehnquist and O'Connor probably helped contribute to SLS's rise in prestige relative to Columbia/Chicago/NYU/Penn. But that's twice as many justices, including the Chief, and Stanford enjoyed a lot of other tailwinds during the same time period.

Barrett, alone, won't be able to haul ND into the T20, but she helps make that a distinct possibility as opposed to a pipe dream.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by dabigchina » Tue Oct 13, 2020 5:31 pm

Guys, we gotta stop feeding the troll. sad that I have to say this about a "supermod," but replying to these low effort posts only encourages her to post more, as she's just trying to stir up engagement.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Wed Oct 14, 2020 11:44 am

nixy wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:19 pm
No. It gives their PR machine something to churn, but I don’t think that improves their optics.

I’m also not sure you know how the rankings are calculated.
Law school rankings are different in focusing on student outcome as opposed to research output, but I'm fairly sure that the law school rankings also include faculty assessment of reputation, which getting someone into scotus could only reflect well on.
The Lsat Airbender wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:42 pm
Counterpoint: Stanford's presence on SCOTUS in the late 20th century with Rehnquist and O'Connor probably helped contribute to SLS's rise in prestige relative to Columbia/Chicago/NYU/Penn. But that's twice as many justices, including the Chief, and Stanford enjoyed a lot of other tailwinds during the same time period.

Barrett, alone, won't be able to haul ND into the T20, but she helps make that a distinct possibility as opposed to a pipe dream.
Of course one justice is insufficient to get a school from 22-25 to stably 20. It could help, if some other pieces fell into place.
dabigchina wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 5:31 pm
Guys, we gotta stop feeding the troll. sad that I have to say this about a "supermod," but replying to these low effort posts only encourages her to post more, as she's just trying to stir up engagement.
Not a troll. It's a real question with such a high profile position, and she's only getting more coverage with stuff like this: https://teacher-scholar-activist.org/20 ... olleagues/

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by nixy » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:18 pm

It’s a stupid question. No one cares or should waste time on it.

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Re: Schools that produce Supreme Court Justice

Post by laanngo » Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:48 pm

nixy wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:18 pm
It’s a stupid question. No one cares or should waste time on it.
winterwolf wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 5:59 pm
laanngo wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:31 pm
How likely is the signal boost going to translate to a rankings climb for ND?
Interesting Q.

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

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