JD/MPP: UW vs. William and Mary (also waitlists) Forum

[jordanelizabeth]

Hey, y'all, this is my first time posting! I've searched for answers to these questions but haven't really been able to find many, so thanks in advance for the help!

I am graduating from UT Austin this semester (in a few weeks!) with a BA in Middle Eastern Studies and Russian Studies, and minors in Arabic and Russian languages. I have about a 3.4, took the LSAT twice with a high score of 163.

Currently, I have been admitted to UW (with no money yet, but scholarship reevaluations should be released in the next week or so) and William and Mary (with $10k/year), and am on the waitlist for Georgetown and UT (well, sort of -- I have an admission appeal pending, it's a little bit complicated). I also got $25k from University of Oregon (I am originally from Portland), but have already turned them down.

My seat deposit deadlines have been extended for both UW and W&M, and my plan is to decide between the two of them, and then wait out the Georgetown/UT decisions (which will probably be later in May or even later in the summer).

No matter where I end up, I plan on applying in my freshman year for a joint JD/MPP program. I have worked in politics basically since high school (interned in DC, done essentially three years worth of higher ed advocacy at the state level in Texas, lots of other state government experience) and would like to be involved in politics/the community/policy/legislative affairs in my career as an attorney.

Originally, I imagined that W&M would be a better school than UW for my goals -- proximity to DC, less of a regional school than UW, but I have been rethinking it, and the city of Seattle seems like a better place to be than the city of Williamsburg, especially for community involvement and the international kind of city that Seattle is. Additionally, the MPP program at UW is much better than at W&M. However, I don't want to make a decision necessarily based on the MPP program because I don't know what my likelihood of being admitted is. Overall, though, the atmosphere of Seattle -- despite its distance from DC -- seems like the better place for fostering connections and being involved politically and in the community.

So my two main questions are:
1) For a goal of being political and community involvement, would UW or W&M be a better choice?

2) For someone applying as a 1L, what do admissions stats at UW/W&M look like for their respective MPP programs? I have looked around and cannot seem to find any information (data, testimonials, anything) on this. I will probably contact the admissions offices this week to see if they have any insights.

Thanks in advance for the help!

[lymenheimer]

You should consider retaking for a third time. Getting close to 170 will get you admittance and a strong scholarship to UT if you want to stay in the area. That being said, if you want to do policy work, you should just do the MPP or an MPA.

[jordanelizabeth]

I did consider taking a year and doing some CC work to bring up my GPA and retake the LSAT, but I decided that it wasn't worth it to, because I would be happy to go to W&M or UW.

I know for a fact that I want to go to law school, which is why I am doing that first rather than an MPP. But an MPP is something I am strongly considering, especially because I could get it done in just one extra year. I know I want to be an attorney, but I am also very interested in policy and would love to have the two degrees to complement each other.

As I said above, the better MPP program doesn't make or break my decision about UW vs. W&M, because I am not 100% committed to doing that. It is, however, something I am considering.

[lymenheimer]

Your intro just seemed to focus a lot on the MPP. What do you want to do as a lawyer?

edit: I'd focus on your career goals and what school can get you into that, rather than seemingly focusing on the secondary degree. You can generally cross-register courses. So instead of getting the degree, you can take policy courses at whatever school you end up going to. But most people will encourage you to not do a joint degree, unless it furthers your employability/law career (ie an MSEE).

[jordanelizabeth]

I think I would like to do firm work, but I am not sure about that. I do know that, whatever kind of law I end up practicing, I would like to supplement that with substantial community and political involvement.

[lymenheimer]

I think I would like to do firm work, but I am not sure about that. I do know that, whatever kind of law I end up practicing, I would like to supplement that with substantial community and political involvement.

Well that's a really broad goal, which seems to back up my statement that you are more focused on policy than you are actual lawyering. If you want to potentially do big firm work, you need to aim higher than UW and W&M to maximize your chances. If you want small firm, then you need to look at the markets that those schools feed into and how sensitive they are to ties and other characteristics of applicants.

Edit: you can supplement your work with political involvement in any market from any school (as long as your employer is amenable to the means by which you plan on supplementing your work). You need neither a MPP nor a JD from one of these two schools to do so.

edit 2: regardless, these two schools seem really expensive at their current scholarship levels. Have you calculated the cost of attendance (or even looked at LST for each school for their price chart)?

[deepseapartners]

How will practicing law help you get involved in politics or government? Do you have a specific career trajectory in mind that requires practicing law? Do you have an anecdotal example?

[jordanelizabeth]

I think my original point/questions are getting a little bit confused --

I know that I want to be an attorney, but I am not sure exactly in what field or capacity exactly, and this is why I am going to law school. In that vein, considering that community involvement and politics are also important to me, my question is generally UW vs. W&M.

I am am considering applying to the joint JD/MPP program wherever I go, and am curious about those admission standards. I am only considering it at this point, and I would like to get a feel for the admissions process if possible and use the next few months to consider whether that is something I want to do. So, along that line, I am interested in anyone who has experience with joint degree admissions processes.

[lymenheimer]

I think my original point/questions are getting a little bit confused --

I know that I want to be an attorney, but I am not sure exactly in what field or capacity exactly, and this is why I am going to law school. In that vein, considering that community involvement and politics are also important to me, my question is generally UW vs. W&M.

I am am considering applying to the joint JD/MPP program wherever I go, and am curious about those admission standards. I am only considering it at this point, and I would like to get a feel for the admissions process if possible and use the next few months to consider whether that is something I want to do. So, along that line, I am interested in anyone who has experience with joint degree admissions processes.

"Board Index >> Choosing a Law School"

"What are the admissions processes for MPP?"

You're gonna have to go to "Top-MPP-Schools.com" for answers to these questions. If you don't know what you want to do as far as law goes, I wouldn't go to law school. If you're going to go anyways, I wouldn't choose either of these schools, because you have a lesser chance of reaching your goals if you become interested in "more prestigious" or at least more competitive stuff, so you should retake for 170 and reapply. If you are basing your law career on being able to impact the community or work on policy, then you should retake and go to GULC or something. Either way, the answer is: don't choose one of these two schools based on your desire to be involved in the community, because you can be involved in the community anywhere you go.

edit to be a bit more clear: you should choose the law school that will help you better reach your goals as a lawyer (at a reasonable cost), because of the bolded.

[jordanelizabeth]

I thought this would be a relevant forum because my main question is UW vs. William and Mary with a supplemental question about anyone who has experience with MPP admissions while in law school. But I will post on another forum, thanks!

[lymenheimer]

I thought this would be a relevant forum because my main question is UW vs. William and Mary with a supplemental question about anyone who has experience with MPP admissions while in law school. But I will post on another forum, thanks!

I was being glib. I guess sorry that wasn't more clear. People here have experience with dual degree programs. But the first consideration that you should be making is whether or not your professional goals as a lawyer will be fulfilled. But I've said that at least 3 times now in similar terms. So idk if it's not sticking or what. Good luck with your decision either way.

[cron1834]

Taking out a lot of loans to go to mediocre law schools is a questionable move in the best of circumstances, but when you can't articulate what kind of job you want it seems more than a little premature, and especially ill-advised. I would rethink this.

Edit - you don't actually mention loans, and you do mention GULC/UT waitlists (which means sticker). How are you paying for this?

[deepseapartners]

my main question is UW vs. William and Mary with a supplemental question about anyone who has experience with MPP admissions while in law school

Retake the LSAT. Neither of those schools is worth attending without a significant scholarship (especially if you are taking a politics/PI oriented career track). Honestly, most people on this forum will probably tell you to not even go to Georgetown or Texas without at least some money.