ITT Chicago Kent (30k/yr) vs. retake & reapply Forum

[hawks1315]

Hello, all
I've been lurking and reading posts here for few years now but this is my first time posting.

Undergrad: ucla, psychology
GPA: 2.8
LSAT: 158
WE: 3 yrs but nothing impressive (bookkeeper at a small accounting firm)

My GPA is horrible. I still have nightmares about it. No excuse.
I've suffered through some anxiety issues, depression, and had a panic attack that happened on finals day
and actually failed three courses because their finals were all on that same day and I had to retake in my second yr.
I was mostly in denial but my family found out and I started slowly getting better with support system, counseling, etc.
The grade shows an upward trend in my last two years.

After undergrad, I spend years rebuilding my health. Think it took about 3 full years to really feel that I'm physically and mentally strong.
I regret not seeking any help soon but better late than never I guess.
I also continue to take careful measures to keep myself healthy (exercise, counseling, right foods, etc).

Now, the real question:

Chicago-Kent (30k/yr; no GPA requirement) vs. retake & reapply

I know it's not a great school but I really like that 30k/yr has no GPA requirement.
Also my family is adamant that I go to law school sooner than later since my father is retiring next year and they will support most of my COL if I go this year.
With the first deposit deadline approaching, I thought I might ask for some advice.

My first choice of schools were Loyola (LA) or USD since I've lived most of my life in S.Cali.
I'm waitlisted at USD and haven't heard back from Loyola. But even if I get in, I probably won't get much scholarship.
I don't mind living in big cities for few years but eventually I do want to settle down in suburban areas that resemble Orange County, Cali.
But this is probably after 10 yrs of experience and when I can open my own firm.

Obviously with this location in mind, it would be wonderful to go to UCLA or UCI but I've read from many posts that Cali schools (esp UCs) aren't very accepting towards splitters.
So I feel that even if I do much better on a retake, I wouldn't get into good UC schools or even if I do, it'll be sticker.

I want to minimize debt so I do want to get at least 1/2 to 3/4 tuition.
I don't want to work at a big firm. I want to work at a small to mid-sized firm.
Currently interested in labor & employment law or immigration law but I've heard it's not wise to choose a school based on your interest because it can easily change. So I'm thinking more about COA, whether I'll enjoy living in that place, etc.


So here are things to consider in my case:
- Took LSAT once and got 158 (studied for 3 months full-time and scored similarly in most of practice exams, only few with mid 160s)
- Places of preference: OC/LA/S.Cal but ultimately any place with not too high COL/COA
- Ties: lived most of life in S.Cali but my family lives in another country. My brother is an attorney in NY. Can save some COL if I go to schools near LA/Irvine/OC area because I have friends I can share the apt with.
- Prefer small/mid-sized firm
- COL will be paid by my family if I go this year (which I do want to pay back but family loan, so no interest and no immediate due date)
- Kent's 90k scholarship (no GPA requirement)= end up with around 60k debt w/ help from family for COL


If I do retake LSAT, I guess I'll take in October and reapply for the next cycle. Not sure if I'll be able to ED with October LSAT.
I'll have full 4 months to study for it. I'm not confident with 170 but a goal is for mid-160 score.
I took LSAT about a year ago and even though I wasn't satisfied with my score,
I've exhausted all the practice tests and wasn't improving scores. So I thought maybe that is the ceiling of my intelligence. I did study 3 full months for last LSAT so I'm going to have to drastically change my study plan and figure out what really went wrong if I want to reach this goal.

I'm also wondering if I don't get a much better LSAT (let's say maybe 160 instead of 158)
I wonder if that'll change much with T2 schools like Kent's scholarship and other schools' acceptance/scholarship since I have such a low gpa.

I did see that most schools don't seem to care about reapplying if they have a new lsat score
but I'm just afraid if I decide to retake and my score doesn't improve whole lot, I'll be still stuck with same range of schools
and the scholarship offer might even be lower since I was offered this amount but rejected the offer.
Also my family might not be able to help out with COL next year.
I do have some saved up money so I think I'll be in 80k debt instead of 60k if I do get same amount of scholarship next year.

Sorry for a long post. I wanted to explain every aspect so I can get some helpful insight and advice with everything considered.



TL; DR

- Low gpa; ucla (psychology); 2.8/158
- 30 yrs old; parents say they can provide most of COL if I go to law school this cycle but may be hard next yr due to retirement
- Chicago Kent scholarship 90k with no GPA requirement -> if I go this yr, 60k debt / if I go next yr, likely 80k if I use my savings
- Want to work at small to mid-sized law firms ; in a long run, want to settle somewhere like OC (not too crowded, suburban)
- Spent 3 full months studying bibles, past PTs but never hit higher than mid-160
- If retake, planning to take October 2016, goal mid-160


So, any thoughts and advice?
If I consider minimizing debt and with my preference for smaller sized firms, do you think it might be worth it to go to Kent this cycle?

[guynourmin]

If your goal is to minimize debt, I doubt you'll have much better options by waiting a year. If your goal is to eventually land back in Cali, you're going to really have to work for it because that's tough out of Kent - ties will be so important. If your goal is to eventually open your own firm, LOL. I really don't think one eye towards your own shop is something to have the summer before law school.


Anecdotal, of course, but my experience in Chicago is that Kent is thought of as solidly second-tier, but certainly no worse than anywhere else in the city (mind, of course, Chicago and NW). Looking at the numbers I would say you need to find out what people from Kent actually do when they graduate! High number of people going to small firms (ambulance chasers/Bk strip mall shops? Any decent jobs there?), business and industry (what are they doing?!) and jd-advantage positions. People are finding work it seems, but is it meaningful and would you be happy with it? And by people, I mean 2/3rds of the class. The rest seem effectively unemployed. Knowing that, that kind of competition, could mess with your currently healthy state of mind.

Is a retake going to help you? Seems like that may be your lsat-level, no? With a 158 retaking is never a bad option but waiting a year to apply with a 159 isn't going to change much, so you need to spend a little time on the lsat forum here and see if there were any obvious holes in your studying. I can tell you I wasn't on these boards until after I took the lsat and within 2 minutes HUGE flaws in my studying were revealed to me. Pretty disheartening, but if that is the case then a retake could be great for you.

Question for me is, and I don't know the answer but want to assume it's yes, is could you be in a similar situation in a better location? That is, less than 6 figures in debt, not absolutely terrible employment numbers (nothing to get too excited about, though), and all that in your ideal location?

[Nebby]

Retake

[Plurple_Unicorn]

Honestly, it's going to be pretty difficult to form ties to the Californian legal market, coming in from C-K. C-K is a regional school, and at most, you will be able to work in the Midwest.
On that note, if you can boost your lsat 3-5 points, you have a great chance of getting into Hastings. They are friendly to splitters.
Good luck!

[star fox]

It's IIT bro.

[CMac86]

I can't vouch/comment on anything related to the quality of the schools, but I can comment on the cost of living in Chicago.

I lived there for ten years (moved there for undergrad, stayed until I was 29). If you're willing to live in a studio apartment, you can easily find one for under $900/month in a decent-nice part of the city. I lived in Ravenswood and Rogers Park, each time in studios that were sub $750...and when I wanted the cheapest place possible, I had a studio for $570 (in Rogers Park), admittedly that was five years ago. The catch-the commute would be around 30-45mins via the L (subway/train) to Chicago-Kent. It is an extremely livable big city.

[Rigo]

It's not smart to go to a regional school in Chicago when you want California.