UC vs. OSU Forum

[raven1231]

Background on me:
I'm 26 and have a BS in Psychology, BS in Criminal Justice, MS in Criminal Justice, and am in the process of becoming fluent in arabic. I worked in management for 6 years and hope to work for the federal government after law school.

So, this is the situation I'm in. I wanted to stay relatively close to home because my fiancé loves her job and I didn't want her to have to quit it. So, I applied to UC, UK, Case Western Reserve, OSU, IU, and Notre Dame.

I got offered the following:

University of Kentucky-full-tuition plus 10k
University of Cincinnati- 45k total scholarship plus a 5k fellowship with The Ohio Innocence Project
Case Western Reserve-Full-tuition plus international law fellowship
Indiana University-Bloomington- total of 90k scholarship (out of state tuition)
Ohio State University- total of 40.5k scholarship (in-state)
Notre Dame-Still waiting but applied at the very end of their deadline.

I narrowed down my options to UC and OSU. I crossed off Case due to their frightening bar passage and employment rates, and UK because it was so similar to UC but in KY. IU I decided against because even with 90k off tuition out of state would still run me 67k. So, in regards to UC and OSU, for OSU I would be looking at 46k in tuition plus living expenses. UC I would be looking at 22k total as I live in Cincinnati. I'm leaning towards UC due to finances and their relatively similar stats.

OSU has employment at 10 months out of 89%/UC's is 82%
OSU's bar passage is 92.6%/UC's is 86%
Median starting salaries for OSU is 50/70k/UC is 45/91
Both have big law employment of 10% which is comical but really is irrelevant for what I want to do.
Employment areas are similar too OSU-LF 45%, Business 26%, Government 16%/ UC-LF 45%, Business 21%, Government 19%

Other benefits to UC is it's relatively small school and has a very good faculty to student ratio, I would be working with the OIP which is something I'm very passionate about and would be guaranteed experience. OSU on the other hand is more nationally renowned, would diversify my education, has a large alumni network, is consistently ranked as a tier one school.

[Tiddlywinks]

So you're basically in the same position I was last year. I'm from the Akron area and wanted to stay in Ohio as well. Applied to OSU and Case and got both to within 80k CoA (OSU is gonna cost you over 100k). I'm guessing you have a LSAT between 158-163. You need to retake if you really want to want work for the Federal government, which is what my end goal is also. OSU is way too expensive, but UC would be fine if you could live with working local gov or a small firm.
I ended up sitting out a year and retaking and went from a 160->169 and am now accepted to Michigan with 100k+. From what I understand T14 looks very good coming back to Cleveland/Cbus which I think would help you the most. Disclaimer 0L.

[raven1231]

Thanks and yeah my LSAT was a 162. I literally only had a month and a half to prep for it too. Because of that I'm sure I could get it higher. I'm just getting old and was hoping to be able to start my career as soon as possible lol. I also am not too concerned with making a lot of money (which is why I went for Criminal Justice), I just want to enjoy my job and feel like I'm doing something meaningful with my life.

I'm currently going through the hiring process with the ATF (about 2/3rds the way there) but that won't be finished until past August. If it works out I'd be delaying law school anyway. I also thought about maybe attending UC and transferring after the first year.

[Tiddlywinks]

Thanks and yeah my LSAT was a 162. I literally only had a month and a half to prep for it too. Because of that I'm sure I could get it higher. I'm just getting old and was hoping to be able to start my career as soon as possible lol. I also am not too concerned with making a lot of money (which is why I went for Criminal Justice), I just want to enjoy my job and feel like I'm doing something meaningful with my life.

I'm currently going through the hiring process with the ATF (about 2/3rds the way there) but that won't be finished until past August. If it works out I'd be delaying law school anyway. I also thought about maybe attending UC and transferring after the first year.

I'm right there with ya man, I'm 25 now. You can definitely do better if you scored a 162 in a month and a half. If you want to work for the DoJ or anything like that, I'd sit out and go 170+. But I mean honestly, if you even increased 2-5 points in June I'm sure UC would bump you up some and maybe give a stiped. UC would be good if you wanted to be a local DA or ADA, which are very respectable outcomes.

[raven1231]

Thanks! I really wouldn't mind either of those positions at all honestly. If I do enroll in August of this year it will probably be at UC. If not I'll just do what you said and retake it. I would really like to work for the federal government though, especially the DOJ and am very interested in Counter-terrorism work.

As for the LSAT I graduated in late August from my Master's and took the October LSAT. I had surgery and bunch of other crap that threw everything off prior to that. I have no doubt I could bring my score up but am not looking forward to taking the test again ha ha.

Thanks for your advice though!

[VPlaw]

Background on me:
I'm 26 and have a BS in Psychology, BS in Criminal Justice, MS in Criminal Justice, and am in the process of becoming fluent in arabic. I worked in management for 6 years and hope to work for the federal government after law school.

So, this is the situation I'm in. I wanted to stay relatively close to home because my fiancé loves her job and I didn't want her to have to quit it. So, I applied to UC, UK, Case Western Reserve, OSU, IU, and Notre Dame.

I got offered the following:

University of Kentucky-full-tuition plus 10k
University of Cincinnati- 45k total scholarship plus a 5k fellowship with The Ohio Innocence Project
Case Western Reserve-Full-tuition plus international law fellowship
Indiana University-Bloomington- total of 90k scholarship (out of state tuition)
Ohio State University- total of 40.5k scholarship (in-state)
Notre Dame-Still waiting but applied at the very end of their deadline.

I narrowed down my options to UC and OSU. I crossed off Case due to their frightening bar passage and employment rates, and UK because it was so similar to UC but in KY. IU I decided against because even with 90k off tuition out of state would still run me 67k. So, in regards to UC and OSU, for OSU I would be looking at 46k in tuition plus living expenses. UC I would be looking at 22k total as I live in Cincinnati. I'm leaning towards UC due to finances and their relatively similar stats.

OSU has employment at 10 months out of 89%/UC's is 82%
OSU's bar passage is 92.6%/UC's is 86%
Median starting salaries for OSU is 50/70k/UC is 45/91
Both have big law employment of 10% which is comical but really is irrelevant for what I want to do.
Employment areas are similar too OSU-LF 45%, Business 26%, Government 16%/ UC-LF 45%, Business 21%, Government 19%

Other benefits to UC is it's relatively small school and has a very good faculty to student ratio, I would be working with the OIP which is something I'm very passionate about and would be guaranteed experience. OSU on the other hand is more nationally renowned, would diversify my education, has a large alumni network, is consistently ranked as a tier one school.

May I suggest reconsidering IU Bloomington because they are now ranked 25 and with a 90K scholarship and instate after one year, that would be good. Also, Ohio State would be good too. Cincy has moved up in the rankings. Also, see what Notre Dame says. I do know Notre Dame is really big on taking students that REALLY want to attend (hint hint). Good luck

[A. Nony Mouse]

Thanks! I really wouldn't mind either of those positions at all honestly. If I do enroll in August of this year it will probably be at UC. If not I'll just do what you said and retake it. I would really like to work for the federal government though, especially the DOJ and am very interested in Counter-terrorism work.

As for the LSAT I graduated in late August from my Master's and took the October LSAT. I had surgery and bunch of other crap that threw everything off prior to that. I have no doubt I could bring my score up but am not looking forward to taking the test again ha ha.

Thanks for your advice though!

I may have misunderstood, but it sounds like you want to stay in the general Ohio area? Because counterterrorism for the DOJ is going to be very very hard to do in Ohio. (If the plan is to uproot after law school, then never mind!)

[raven1231]

Thanks! I really wouldn't mind either of those positions at all honestly. If I do enroll in August of this year it will probably be at UC. If not I'll just do what you said and retake it. I would really like to work for the federal government though, especially the DOJ and am very interested in Counter-terrorism work.

As for the LSAT I graduated in late August from my Master's and took the October LSAT. I had surgery and bunch of other crap that threw everything off prior to that. I have no doubt I could bring my score up but am not looking forward to taking the test again ha ha.

Thanks for your advice though!

I may have misunderstood, but it sounds like you want to stay in the general Ohio area? Because counterterrorism for the DOJ is going to be very very hard to do in Ohio. (If the plan is to uproot after law school, then never mind!)

Nope you didn't misunderstand. I'm ok with moving after law school and so is my fiancé, it's just currently we want to stay here for a few more years. She loves her job and isn't ready to quit just yet, and we own a house that we aren't ready to sell yet either.

[A. Nony Mouse]

That makes sense, thanks for clarifying. The only reason I bring it up is that local Ohio schools are more helpful for local Ohio jobs than for moving away (that also said, DOJ hires from a wide range of schools and grades/experience are arguably more important than pedigree. There just aren't a ton of entry level DOJ jobs).

[raven1231]

That makes sense, thanks for clarifying. The only reason I bring it up is that local Ohio schools are more helpful for local Ohio jobs than for moving away (that also said, DOJ hires from a wide range of schools and grades/experience are arguably more important than pedigree. There just aren't a ton of entry level DOJ jobs).

Oh I completely agree which is sort of another reason why I want to stay local. So just incase it doesn't work out I can hopefully find decent employment near our home.

I know through the honors program last year they pulled from a lot of schools in Ohio actually. Including OSU, UC, and CWRU, whereas states like Kentucky they only pulled from UK. Regardless though it will be highly competitive, but one can dream ha ha

[A. Nony Mouse]

Of course!

[yenisey]

So you're basically in the same position I was last year. I'm from the Akron area and wanted to stay in Ohio as well. Applied to OSU and Case and got both to within 80k CoA (OSU is gonna cost you over 100k). I'm guessing you have a LSAT between 158-163. You need to retake if you really want to want work for the Federal government, which is what my end goal is also. OSU is way too expensive, but UC would be fine if you could live with working local gov or a small firm.
I ended up sitting out a year and retaking and went from a 160->169 and am now accepted to Michigan with 100k+. From what I understand T14 looks very good coming back to Cleveland/Cbus which I think would help you the most. Disclaimer 0L.

I'm also admitted to OSU and CWRU and my dream school is Michigan. How did you manage to make my dream true in retaking? Would please give me some advice in detail?

[raven1231]

Heard back from OSU and they bumped my scholarship from 40.5k to 55.5k, leaving me with 32k tuition if I go there. Definitely considering it more now. I'm going to the admitted students day this weekend which will hopefully help me decide.

[Clyde Frog]

Heard back from OSU and they bumped my scholarship from 40.5k to 55.5k, leaving me with 32k tuition if I go there. Definitely considering it more now. I'm going to the admitted students day this weekend which will hopefully help me decide.

I really think you should retake. 32k is still 32k that you have to pay back later and it just makes more sense to study for another couple months so that you don't have to pay that. 1.5 months was definitely not enough time for me to prepare for the LSAT as well as most other high scorers on TLS.

[raven1231]

Ironically according to US NEWS UC places a higher percentage of graduates in 251-500, and 500+ size law firms than OSU. Not that either are high, nor schools you go to for big law.

251-500: 14% OSU, 18% UC
500+: 12% OSU, 14% UC

Also, OSU's higher job placement at 10 months out has to do more with their school funded positions which accounts for 18% of their employment, whereas UC has 0% school funded positions (Not that it is something you necessarily want).

[albanach]

Also, OSU's higher job placement at 10 months out has to do more with their school funded positions which accounts for 18% of their employment, whereas UC has 0% school funded positions (Not that it is something you necessarily want).

So, think about that. If you strike out at OCI and are approaching graduation without an offer, wouldn't you much rather be at a school that has school funded positions?

If you can pass the bar and get a year's actual practice experience you are hugely more employable. I don't know about the program, but if they'll fund you to do a clerkship, you might be competitive for a judge that you wouldn't otherwise have a chance of working with. Similarly, if you get a year as a PD or AG, you have a leg up into those roles and even if you don't follow it as a career you have a ton of litigation experience.

[raven1231]

Also, OSU's higher job placement at 10 months out has to do more with their school funded positions which accounts for 18% of their employment, whereas UC has 0% school funded positions (Not that it is something you necessarily want).

So, think about that. If you strike out at OCI and are approaching graduation without an offer, wouldn't you much rather be at a school that has school funded positions?

If you can pass the bar and get a year's actual practice experience you are hugely more employable. I don't know about the program, but if they'll fund you to do a clerkship, you might be competitive for a judge that you wouldn't otherwise have a chance of working with. Similarly, if you get a year as a PD or AG, you have a leg up into those roles and even if you don't follow it as a career you have a ton of litigation experience.

Oh I agree, which is why I added the "not that it is something you necessarily want part". However, to make things even more interesting is that UC's 2015 employment numbers (which were just submitted to the abs) are now even with OSU in overall employment 88% UC/89% OSU and higher in long term bar passage required jobs 91% UC/80% OSU. But, to your point yes it would be nice if UC offered school funded positions for that reason, but if another school is placing the same amount of students without it, that says something as well.

[rustyboxer]

Also, OSU's higher job placement at 10 months out has to do more with their school funded positions which accounts for 18% of their employment, whereas UC has 0% school funded positions (Not that it is something you necessarily want).

So, think about that. If you strike out at OCI and are approaching graduation without an offer, wouldn't you much rather be at a school that has school funded positions?

If you can pass the bar and get a year's actual practice experience you are hugely more employable. I don't know about the program, but if they'll fund you to do a clerkship, you might be competitive for a judge that you wouldn't otherwise have a chance of working with. Similarly, if you get a year as a PD or AG, you have a leg up into those roles and even if you don't follow it as a career you have a ton of litigation experience.

Oh I agree, which is why I added the "not that it is something you necessarily want part". However, to make things even more interesting is that UC's 2015 employment numbers (which were just submitted to the abs) are now even with OSU in overall employment 88% UC/89% OSU and higher in long term bar passage required jobs 91% UC/80% OSU. But, to your point yes it would be nice if UC offered school funded positions for that reason, but if another school is placing the same amount of students without it, that says something as well.

Do you have the link to UC's 2015 numbers?

[raven1231]

Also, OSU's higher job placement at 10 months out has to do more with their school funded positions which accounts for 18% of their employment, whereas UC has 0% school funded positions (Not that it is something you necessarily want).

So, think about that. If you strike out at OCI and are approaching graduation without an offer, wouldn't you much rather be at a school that has school funded positions?

If you can pass the bar and get a year's actual practice experience you are hugely more employable. I don't know about the program, but if they'll fund you to do a clerkship, you might be competitive for a judge that you wouldn't otherwise have a chance of working with. Similarly, if you get a year as a PD or AG, you have a leg up into those roles and even if you don't follow it as a career you have a ton of litigation experience.

Oh I agree, which is why I added the "not that it is something you necessarily want part". However, to make things even more interesting is that UC's 2015 employment numbers (which were just submitted to the abs) are now even with OSU in overall employment 88% UC/89% OSU and higher in long term bar passage required jobs 91% UC/80% OSU. But, to your point yes it would be nice if UC offered school funded positions for that reason, but if another school is placing the same amount of students without it, that says something as well.

Do you have the link to UC's 2015 numbers?

Sure thing! This is from their email to admitted students after they sent their data into the ABA. The data hasn't yet been listed on the ABA site for 2015 though.
[img=http://s18.postimg.org/7oi6fk2hh/Screen_Shot_2016_04_12_at_5_13_18_PM.jpg]

[Theresa87]

RETAKE. I was deciding between UC and OSU last year. OSU had given me about half tuition. To justify it, I told myself that I at least wanted to retake to get full tuition there, if not to shoot for a T14. Family/friends seemed to think that made sense. I ended up with a 14 point score increase.

[raven1231]

Indiana University Bloomington came back and my total scholarship would be raised from $90,000 to $112,500 (started at $75,000). I have until May 1st to commit.

[rustyboxer]

Indiana University Bloomington came back and my total scholarship would be raised from $90,000 to $112,500 (started at $75,000). I have until May 1st to commit.

Have you taken this offer to osu?

[raven1231]

Indiana University Bloomington came back and my total scholarship would be raised from $90,000 to $112,500 (started at $75,000). I have until May 1st to commit.

Have you taken this offer to osu?

Not yet but I forgot to mention My OSU scholarship was bumped up already to $55,500 (making tuition about $33,000). That was before I received this though.

[jk148706]

Retake.

And see this thread. http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 0#p8912630

[raven1231]

RETAKE. I was deciding between UC and OSU last year. OSU had given me about half tuition. To justify it, I told myself that I at least wanted to retake to get full tuition there, if not to shoot for a T14. Family/friends seemed to think that made sense. I ended up with a 14 point score increase.

That's awesome! Where do you plan on going this year? I was in a similar spot and only had about a month and a half to study for the LSAT.