Cornell vs Chicago vs NYU Forum

[Mountaineer78]

First post on here so sorry about any mistakes I may have made in doing it. Anyway, I've heard back from most of the schools I applied to with the exceptions of HYS, which I'm steadily losing hope in. I got a whole bunch of wait lists but was lucky to be accepted to UChicago, NYU, and Cornell with varying scholarships, all paid evenly over three years:

$75000 at UChicago

$100000 ($120000 with PI internship during 2L) at NYU

$165000 at Cornell

For career goals, I would like to work in public interest or government work in some way particularly in a capacity involving public international law if possible. I've thought maybe a good way to get going in the right direction for this would be a clerkship, so I've considered that too. I know the difficulty of all this hence my focus on the T14 schools I was accepted to.

Apart from the scholarships, I'll be paying for law school using loans, and so the LRAP if I go that direction.

I don't really have a preference for location, although I'm sure Chicago or NY would be better placed to live than Ithaca, so this isn't much of a factor.

I know that this is a personal decision I'll have to make, but given this, does anyone have any advice on what I should do?

If it helps, I'm a KJD, 179/3.9 (but initially got a 163), non-URM, with probably below average softs from a prestige-less state school.

Thanks in advance!

[L’Étranger]

This is a great result, but you still (believe it or not) under performed your numbers. Did you apply late in the cycle? If so, I would add a fourth option - wait until next year and reapply for better results.

[James.K.Polk]

Dude, you're gonna get at least one of HYS, just wait.

[Mountaineer78]

I had to wait for a LOR and the October LSAT score, so I wasn't complete until mid-November, but I didn't think that was too late? Yet I haven't heard anything from HYS. I had hoped not to take a year off, but judging by my many wait lists, I definitely underperformed so it's something I'm considering.

[somethingElse]

1) That is definitely not too late to apply.

2) All of your waitlists are most likely due to YP.

[Mountaineer78]

I've tried convincing myself that it's YP, but the lack of a js1 or any other kinds of news from all of HYS worries me.

[fliptrip]

I'm 179/3.9.

You are here too early. Wait until you hear from HYS, hard as it may be. Can't really tell you what to do without knowing your costs at an HYS option.

[Mountaineer78]

Honestly, the long time gap had dashed my hopes of HYS, but if there's still a chance, I suppose I'll continue to hold out.

[fliptrip]

There's definitely still a chance. You've survived major ding waves at both HLS and YLS. SLS is hard to read with respect to timing of things, but rest assured that if they wanted to be rid of you, they would be.

[03152016]

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[Biglaw1990]

I wouldn't settle for anything less than HYS with your stats.

[03152016]

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[gamerish]

Like everyone else has said, I'd wait for HYS before making any decisions. If you don't wind up getting any of them, I'd start negotiating with NYU and Chicago as much as possible as they really did low ball you with schollys, given your stats. If that doesn't pan out, I'd reapply because anything less than HYS or $$$$ at CCN down is an injustice to someone with your numbers.

If you don't wind up getting any of HYS, I'd take a hard look at your personal statement, LORs and application as a whole to see where some perceived weakness may be. I certainly have below average softs and, while I got hit with a similar smattering of WLs in the mid-T14, I was able to get an H acceptance and my numbers are definitely not as good as yours.

[03152016]

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[Lavitz]

I had similar numbers/softs and then offers in my cycle, so I'm not that surprised. But you've definitely still got a good shot at Harvard at least.

But assuming you didn't get HYS, waiting a year isn't guaranteed to change anything. This isn't a situation where you're applying with a much better LSAT score or applying much earlier. Maybe the drop in applications will help, or your GPA will increase. Or you figure out what was weak in your app and you can fix it. And if you could do something cool for a year, that may help, but I don't think taking, say, some entry level job for a year will increase your chances. With that said, I think time off between undergrad and law school is beneficial just to enjoy your 20s before committing yourself to law. So sure, you should consider waiting a year, but you should be considering that anyway, not just because you hope it'll help your chances next cycle.

And if you don't get HYS either this cycle or next, it's not the end of the world. Honestly, even if you did get into H, I'd strongly consider a full ride at any T-14 over H (assuming sticker). Personally, I ended up "settling" for Cornell with $150K, and I'm confident I ended up in the same position I'd be in if I went to H (clerking then BL), except I have $200,000 less debt than I would have. I don't share the same interest in international public law, but to the extent it exists, I know we cater to it, although I imagine it'd be easier to get from H.

You should certainly wait and see what happens with HYS. For now, with deposit deadlines approaching, I'd probably negotiate, visit all schools, and then deposit at one of them--probably Cornell or NYU--then see what happens.

[Mountaineer78]

For what it's worth apart from HYS, I am still waiting on a decision from Penn and Northwestern, though I'm guessing I know how that one will go. I don't think there was anything terrible in my application. I used my university's law school advisor, who went to HLS, as a resource throughout the process, and everything seemed in order. My uneducated guess was that the jump in LSAT was deterring schools. Is this something that a school like CLS will just tell you if asked?

As for negotiating, how should I go about doing this? I know Chicago has a form I can request, but I assumed at absolute best they would only maybe be swayed a little by NYU's offer. And with NYU, without superior offers, how do I get any leverage? And should I wait on HYS to attempt this process?

Thanks a lot for all the help so far everyone. It's giving me some things to really think about.

[Lavitz]

As for negotiating, how should I go about doing this? I know Chicago has a form I can request, but I assumed at absolute best they would only maybe be swayed a little by NYU's offer. And with NYU, without superior offers, how do I get any leverage? And should I wait on HYS to attempt this process?

Use the Cornell offer at NYU. It's at least a higher dollar amount even if NYU doesn't consider them a "peer." See if NYU will at least drop the PI stip so you get $120K guaranteed. If they can do this quickly, then you could take the new offer to Chicago. Otherwise, the current NYU offer could possibly get Chicago to budge. In fact, maybe the Cornell offer would work, but I'm more familiar with people successfully using Cornell to negotiate with NYU than with Chicago. You should not wait on HYS because there's no telling if you're getting in there. If you get in, you can reopen negotiations.

[FlanAl]

I'll second everyone else saying wait for HYS. But with the options you have I'd go with NYU. New York City is probably the best place to be for 3 years if you are trying to go into non-profit. You'll be able to get a lot of experience during the semester interning for free etc.. BUT it's March and HYS is definitely your best option given your interests.

[Nekrowizard]

You should go to NYU because you can walk down to the Luxor Lounge between classes and do 4 shots for $10. HYS can't offer that level of convenience. You should definitely not give up hope in HYS, however. If you don't get in this time around, you really should take a year off and figure out whether you used any racial slurs in your personal statement by accident. That'll at least give you more negotiation leverage even if you don't end up going.