Discrepancy on LST- what's up? Forum

[Toodle-loo]

According to Law School Transparency (http://www.lstscorereports.com/national/), the full cost of attendance for a non-resident at UMich is nearly 20k less than a Duke Student. However, non-resident tuition at UMich is almost exactly the same as Duke tuition and it has been since at least 2013 (according to ABA docs). It seems like A2 and Durham have similar Costs of Living, so....

Any idea about what causes the difference in LST's published stats?

[Lawcat11]

I think and I could be wrong, but maybe it's because after a year at Mich you qualify for in-state tuition?

[Toodle-loo]

I think and I could be wrong, but maybe it's because after a year at Mich you qualify for in-state tuition?

That's certainly not the idea I've gotten reading through their website's resources on residency, and it would only account for appx 6-10k difference over 2 years. It would be awesome if in-state residency was a possibility after a year though, whether that solves this particular mystery or not.

[Clearly]

I'll shoot a PM to the guy who brought us the gift that is LST.

[Toodle-loo]

I'll shoot a PM to the guy who brought us the gift that is LST.

Straight to the source! That seems efficient. Thanks!

[jenesaislaw]

*waves*

Talk about service!

Will look into this now.

[Toodle-loo]

*waves*

Talk about service!

Will look into this now.

Oh hey! Thanks!

[jenesaislaw]

According to Law School Transparency (http://www.lstscorereports.com/national/), the full cost of attendance for a non-resident at UMich is nearly 20k less than a Duke Student. However, non-resident tuition at UMich is almost exactly the same as Duke tuition and it has been since at least 2013 (according to ABA docs). It seems like A2 and Durham have similar Costs of Living, so....

Any idea about what causes the difference in LST's published stats?

UMich non-resident is $56,112 this year. At Duke it's $57,717.

The COL is where the differences are starker. $18,550 at Michigan and $21,834 at Duke.

So in sum that's a difference of $4889 this year. However, the estimate measures students starting next year, so we have to account for tuition increases and COL increases. We assume a 2% increase for COL across the board. This means the COL will go up more at Duke than Michigan because of a higher starting point. The differences in tuition increases are less severe (.5% difference) but larger numbers to start with (tuition is out of control). Duke also starts higher so the percentage increase is more severe.

Add to this three years of increases plus interest accumulated on the differences and you see how there's about a 30k difference in how much you owe at each school.

In other words, no problem here! Phew.

ETA: making some changes to the text here -- it's late.

[Toodle-loo]

UMich non-resident is $56,112 this year. At Duke it's $57,717.

The COL is where the differences are starker. $18,550 at Michigan and $21,834 at Duke.

So in sum that's a difference of $4889 this year. However, the estimate measures students starting next year, so we have to account for tuition increases and COL increases. We assume a 2% increase for COL across the board. This means the COL will go up more at Duke than Michigan because of a higher starting point. The differences in tuition increases are less severe (.5% difference) but larger numbers to start with (tuition is out of control). Duke also starts higher so the percentage increase is more severe.

Add to this three years of increases plus interest accumulated on the differences and you see how there's about a 30k difference in how much you owe at each school.

In other words, no problem here! Phew.

ETA: making some changes to the text here -- it's late.

So in the calculation of cost, you've included the fact that Duke has far more in required fees (which I noticed), and that accounts for a bit of it. For CoL, does LST calculate those independently or use the ones that are provided by each school's website?

[Toodle-loo]

ETA: making some changes to the text here -- it's late.

Also, please don't feel like these questions have to be answered immediately - I'm aware that my night owl tendencies are not normal or healthy

[jenesaislaw]

I'm up and thinking about it, no worries.

We get the COL starting point from the schools, and apply a 2% COL adjustment each year. The starting point is what the schools reported on the 509s for 2015-16 (thus it gets an adjustment for 2016-17, 17-18, and 18-19).

There's also a 4.2x% origination fee that expands the difference.

I just ran the differences through a spreadsheet for you. This is pre-interest and pre-origination fees.

For a student starting at Duke in 2016 and using the increase assumptions laid out on the school's profile on LST, total COA is $255,095. At Michigan it is $237,775.

In other words, $17,320 turns into about $30k if you borrow due to origination fees and interest.

[jenesaislaw]

PS I really encourage you to fill out financial worksheets on LST. Create an account and give it a shot. It outlines everything for you rather clearly. (Or so I hope...I'm the responsible party. Feedback welcome!)

[Clearly]

This is entirely unsolicted by LST. But I hope lots of TLSers use this link:
http://www.lawschooltransparency.com/ho ... lp/#donate
This service is so critical and so often cited here, I do hope we're collectively helping support it.

[jenesaislaw]

Thanks for that. We really do need the money. How's that for transparency?

[Toodle-loo]

I'm up and thinking about it, no worries.

We get the COL starting point from the schools

ooookkk I think I see now - So it was mildly interesting to me that the CoL was so much higher per year in Durham than A2, as I've looked up basic costs in each and they seem comparable. If either is "more" expensive, I'd say it's been A2. The key (I think) is that the UMich CoL estimate is based on 8months, and most other schools (including Duke, if I'm not mistaken), use a 9 month estimate.

Thank you so much for your help and resources, and I'll definitely be using some of those worksheets. It was just a curiosity bugging me and I wondered. I really appreciate your responses!

[Toodle-loo]

This is entirely unsolicted by LST. But I hope lots of TLSers use this link:
http://www.lawschooltransparency.com/ho ... lp/#donate
This service is so critical and so often cited here, I do hope we're collectively helping support it.

I have a running list of places to donate to after I round off my savings. 7Sage is at the top of this list, and I have no problem adding LST as well