Columbia vs Reapply Forum

[Stannis the Mannis]

Hi everyone,

I had posted a thread a little while back in this forum.

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=247088

I’m a K-JD with a bioengineering background looking to go into IP Law. I’m coming from Seattle and would like to return here to work. I’m open to working in NYC or California, and would prefer biglaw there to non-biglaw in Seattle.

I applied with a 3.58 GPA and 172 LSAT and was pretty happy with my results. I got into some the bottom half of the T14 with up to a half scholarship, and some higher schools at sticker. Against most of TLS’s advice, I ended up depositing at Columbia without any scholarship money.

I retook the LSAT in June and scored a 177. My GPA also increased to 3.64 3.65 by then. I tried to negotiate with Columbia but they wouldn’t budge. So now I’m deciding whether to just stick it out at Columbia (which I do really like), or reapply to try for better scholarship offers or getting into Stanford (a fairly big stretch) or Harvard.

On one hand, I want to make the most of my LSAT score, and having a year of full time work experience could help with both law school admissions and getting my first job. Then again, if I don’t get better results I’ll feel like I wasted that time by pushing everything back a year. I’m currently paying sticker (with family loans) at Columbia, and that wouldn’t change if I got into Harvard or Stanford, so the financial consideration would be the potential to get more money at the lower schools (especially Columbia, or the other T6s). My GPA is slightly limiting though.

I’ve talked to a fair amount of people, and I’m leaning slightly towards staying with Columbia, but I’d appreciate any additional input. I'm pretty conflicted right now. Thanks!

[CanadianWolf]

Reapply with your new LSAT score of 177 & higher GPA of 3.64. You should get a full tuition scholarship to a few T-14 law schools.

[Clemenceau]

I had right around your numbers and got a decent chunk of change from cls. I would reapply if I were you.

No t14 full rides tho. I don't think that really happens for non-urms with ~3.6 gpa. Best I did was like $105k.

[Clemenceau]

And lol at reapplying being risky. Going to cls at sticker is easily the riskier option here. 177s aren't going out of style anytime soon

[Hutz_and_Goodman]

Definitely take a year off. You will benefit from not being K-JD and you will get somewhere between $50-110k to attend a T14. Add to that the $ you make working, plus the fun you will have for a year in your 20s not working a very intense 65-85 per hour a week job.

[AdInfinitum]

fwiw, I had similar stats to what you have now and got a decent scholarship from CLS (I was able to negotiate it up too from what they originally offered). Also received ~135k from some of the lower T14s. Reapplying seems like it would be a potentially great decision.

[Winston1984]

I had right around your numbers and got a decent chunk of change from cls. I would reapply if I were you.

No t14 full rides tho. I don't think that really happens for non-urms with ~3.6 gpa. Best I did was like $105k.

He might have a shot at getting NU's full ride. Think I saw some folks that got the Darrow with roughly those stats.

[Clemenceau]

I had right around your numbers and got a decent chunk of change from cls. I would reapply if I were you.

No t14 full rides tho. I don't think that really happens for non-urms with ~3.6 gpa. Best I did was like $105k.

He might have a shot at getting NU's full ride. Think I saw some folks that got the Darrow with roughly those stats.

Well if you mean NUs ed, that aint a full ride. But good point because that might be doable with those #s

[CanadianWolf]

OP: No need to limit yourself to NU ED, in my opinion. Your new numbers plus work experience should yield some great options within the T-14.

[Tiago Splitter]

I'd definitely wait. Make em pay for those numbers. You'll get a much better deal next time around.

[Stannis the Mannis]

And lol at reapplying being risky. Going to cls at sticker is easily the riskier option here. 177s aren't going out of style anytime soon

Most of the people I talk to (including some people I trust a lot) who have been working for a while bring up opportunity costs and "wasting a year of time/salary." I see the merits of both views, and generally agree with TLS on this issue; it's just interesting that there seems to be a pretty big generational divide.

After seeing some weird stuff this cycle, I'm also a bit worried about YP from some schools too.

[rpupkin]

And lol at reapplying being risky. Going to cls at sticker is easily the riskier option here. 177s aren't going out of style anytime soon

Most of the people I talk to (including some people I trust a lot) who have been working for a while bring up opportunity costs and "wasting a year of time/salary."

I am someone who worked a lot, both before and after law school, and I think this advice is nuts. If you're K-JD, you're probably 21 or 22 years old. You have your whole life to slave away earning money. I all but guarantee that when you're 30 or 40 and looking back on your life, you will wonder why on earth you sacrificed a year of your youth because of some bullshit advice about "opportunity cost."

There's more to life than earning money as soon as possible. Please, please...take at least a year before law school and enjoy life a little. I would recommend this even if you hadn't earned a higher LSAT score.

[Hutz_and_Goodman]

Op if you're unsure what to do, Google (or tls search) "dating"/"finding a wife" and "big law."

[timbs4339]

I mean it's not like you're going to tour EDM festivals to rave and take whatever they are calling MDMA these days. You're going to be working a steady but not too demanding job, learning office skills, and enjoying life a bit more than you would if you were a 1L or working biglaw (I won't like 2L and 3L at a school like CLS is like a vacation). You may even find you like the job so much you'll stay 2-3 years. And you would most certainly save a significant amount of money on top of what you'll be making. I know it's going to seem insane to your friends and family that you'd turn down CLS but this is really a no-brainer.

Take it from someone who rushed the K-JD route so as not to waste a year of Important Lawyer Time- I wish I'd had other decent options so I could have spent a few years in the workforce. FYI I got 50% from CLS with a 175 and 3.8 back in 2009- I have no idea why they won't pony up the extra cash now when apps are at historical lows.

[Synch]

Reapply. I had a slightly lower LSAT, and exactly the same GPA, and got $150k at Cornell, and $120 at a few others. You should be in line for good money at UChi as well, my guess is 60k.

[OhBoyOhBortles]

Reapply with your new LSAT score of 177 & higher GPA of 3.64. You should get a full tuition scholarship to a few T-14 law schools.

[Mack.Hambleton]

And lol at reapplying being risky. Going to cls at sticker is easily the riskier option here. 177s aren't going out of style anytime soon

[Stannis the Mannis]

I mean it's not like you're going to tour EDM festivals to rave and take whatever they are calling MDMA these days. You're going to be working a steady but not too demanding job, learning office skills, and enjoying life a bit more than you would if you were a 1L or working biglaw (I won't like 2L and 3L at a school like CLS is like a vacation). You may even find you like the job so much you'll stay 2-3 years. And you would most certainly save a significant amount of money on top of what you'll be making. I know it's going to seem insane to your friends and family that you'd turn down CLS but this is really a no-brainer.

Take it from someone who rushed the K-JD route so as not to waste a year of Important Lawyer Time- I wish I'd had other decent options so I could have spent a few years in the workforce. FYI I got 50% from CLS with a 175 and 3.8 back in 2009- I have no idea why they won't pony up the extra cash now when apps are at historical lows.

Almost everyone seems to be in agreement so far. I do have a question though. If I were to sit out, would the type of job matter at all? I'm mainly looking at something research/engineering oriented versus a legal job. I already have a fair amount of research experience.

[rpupkin]

Almost everyone seems to be in agreement so far. I do have a question though. If I were to sit out, would the type of job matter at all? I'm mainly looking at something research/engineering oriented versus a legal job. I already have a fair amount of research experience.

I think a research/engineering job would be better than a legal job. But also seriously consider working for a few months and taking a few months off to travel as well. Now's the time, bro.

[timbs4339]

I mean it's not like you're going to tour EDM festivals to rave and take whatever they are calling MDMA these days. You're going to be working a steady but not too demanding job, learning office skills, and enjoying life a bit more than you would if you were a 1L or working biglaw (I won't like 2L and 3L at a school like CLS is like a vacation). You may even find you like the job so much you'll stay 2-3 years. And you would most certainly save a significant amount of money on top of what you'll be making. I know it's going to seem insane to your friends and family that you'd turn down CLS but this is really a no-brainer.

Take it from someone who rushed the K-JD route so as not to waste a year of Important Lawyer Time- I wish I'd had other decent options so I could have spent a few years in the workforce. FYI I got 50% from CLS with a 175 and 3.8 back in 2009- I have no idea why they won't pony up the extra cash now when apps are at historical lows.

Almost everyone seems to be in agreement so far. I do have a question though. If I were to sit out, would the type of job matter at all? I'm mainly looking at something research/engineering oriented versus a legal job. I already have a fair amount of research experience.

Of course not. I can't say it would be an automatic boost in interviews at every place you interview (unless you want to do IP law) but (1) it wouldn't be a negative, and (2) it would help to work a job and get some experience working a FT job before going to work a very stressful FT job.

[trebekismyhero]

Almost everyone seems to be in agreement so far. I do have a question though. If I were to sit out, would the type of job matter at all? I'm mainly looking at something research/engineering oriented versus a legal job. I already have a fair amount of research experience.

I think a research/engineering job would be better than a legal job. But also seriously consider working for a few months and taking a few months off to travel as well. Now's the time, bro.

+1

[iamgeorgebush]

Reapply because (1) more scholarship $; (2) the WE will benefit you during OCI; (3) you will have a better head on your shoulders after having worked in the real world for a year; and (4) it's good for your happiness to step off the treadmill for a little while.

Also agree that it's fine to get a job that's not legal, especially if you're trying to do patent stuff. Getting a job at a law firm could also be fine, of course. I'd apply to both and see what offers you get.