USC full ride v.s. T-14 $ Forum

[JamesMcGillEsquire]

pretty classic dilemma here:
USC full ride vs GULC with $72k scholarship vs Cornell with $105k scholarship

-The total Cost of Attendance (COA) of each.
USC's budget allocates about $15k for rent per year so I assume my total COA would be about $45-$60k.
GULC COA: about $170k. I don't plan on borrowing the full grad plus amount though I'm going to try to be frugal.
Cornell COA: A little bit lower than GULC, maybe around $150k.

-How you will be financing your COA, i.e. loans, family, or savings
All loans.

-Where you are from and where you want to work, and other places where you have significant ties (if any)

From Connecticut, went to school in New England. So no ties whatsoever to California. Plenty of ties to New England and the tri-state area. Don't really love NYC though, so I'd be willing to work somewhere else. I can't say for sure whether or not I want to work in LA because I'm not very familiar with it.

-Your general career goals
Don't really want big law, it sounds pretty miserable. I don't have any interest in tax or corporate law. I'd like to get a government job, maybe with the FBI or with a DA's office. Also would be interested in studying international law although I know that's not a viable career choice. So as far as my career goals/ interests go I feel like being in DC would be a good fit, not so much LA and certainly not Ithaca.

-Your LSAT/GPA numbers
167/3.83
-How many times you have taken the LSAT
twice.

As far as intangibles I really don't think I would like it in Ithaca. Also as I've mentioned I have no ties to California, so I'm not sure about USC but I would feel like an idiot passing up all that $.

[hearsay77]

Have you tried to negotiate with GULC using Cornell & USC's offers?

[bowser]

If you're really dead set on a government job, maybe you should stay closer to home? There are schools as reputable as USC in the East Coast area. If you're not from LA and don't any interest in moving there, I don't see why you would go to USC. If it's the money, can't you get about the same from an East Coast school like BC, BU, GW, etc?

I don't think you should go to Cornell at that price if you're not interested at all in biglaw.

[OhBoyOhBortles]

Seems like a retake may be in order.

[PeanutsNJam]

USC. Your reasons for wanting to be in DC are arbitrary. By that I mean, govt jobs aren't region locked. There are FBI offices in Cali.

[Tiago Splitter]

Seems like a retake may be in order.

Explain

[OhBoyOhBortles]

Seems like a retake may be in order.

Explain

OP has a killer gpa. OP also has relatively unlikely goals which means he/she should minimize debt as much as possible. If OP can take for a third time and get that score up 2-4 points they have a very good shot at a full ride in the lower t14 next year. 2 more lsat points would have made a Dillard feasible this cycle.

[Tiago Splitter]

Seems like a retake may be in order.

Explain

OP has a killer gpa. OP also has relatively unlikely goals which means he/she should minimize debt as much as possible. If OP can take for a third time and get that score up 2-4 points they have a very good shot at a full ride in the lower t14 next year. 2 more lsat points would have made a Dillard feasible this cycle.

See how easy that was? Might even get OP to actually follow your advice.

[BigZuck]

Yeah, I wouldn't go to law school at this time.

Big law sounds sucky, so therefore you want PI and/or international law. So, unicorns that you realistically probably won't actually mount unless you develop a burning PASSION for LOCAL GOVERNMENT WORK. Ithaca sounds yucky, so no Cornell for you. Gotta steer clear of NYC, yucky place. You want to work in DC, which is really tough. You're likely overestimating how easy it will be to save money in law school. The only viable school you got into (money wise) is a regional school in a market you have no ties to and you don't have a burning desire to live in that market long term.

I just get the sense that what you think law school is and what kind of job you'll get is not realistic, I would sit out at least a cycle, retake, and get a little more focus/learn about what law school/being a lawyer is all about.

[Tiago Splitter]

If you're really dead set on a government job, maybe you should stay closer to home? There are schools as reputable as USC in the East Coast area. If you're not from LA and don't any interest in moving there, I don't see why you would go to USC. If it's the money, can't you get about the same from an East Coast school like BC, BU, GW, etc?

I agree with this. Go close to home if you don't want biglaw. No reason to move across the country where you'll be at a disadvantage in hiring and you might not like it anyway.

Zuck is also right that you should tighten up your goals in order to make this decision easier. There's no reason to go to law school if you want to be the next MacGyver. If you want to be a DA then go cheap and local. If you really aren't sure then, like so many others before you, you'll walk the OCI plank regardless of which school you attend.

[JamesMcGillEsquire]

Have you tried to negotiate with GULC using Cornell & USC's offers?

I've negotiated with every school I was accepted to. Obviously I had the most success with USC. GULC only bumped me a very small amount when I showed them Cornell's offer. They didn't negotiate with my SC offer.

To answer another poster's question, I didn't get that much money from BC/ BU even after negotiating.

edit- also when you guys say "cheap and local" do you mean schools like BU and GW or are you talking local TTTTs for free?

[CanadianWolf]

Cornell because you aren't determined to live & work in Southern California.

[Big Dog]

I'd like to get a government job, maybe with the FBI or with a DA's office. Also would be interested in studying international law although I know that's not a viable career choice. So as far as my career goals/ interests go I feel like being in DC would be a good fit, not so much LA and certainly not Ithaca.

Retake is the only option. You won't reach any of those goals from 'SC without local ties.

[transferror]

edit- also when you guys say "cheap and local" do you mean schools like BU and GW or are you talking local TTTTs for free?

It's relative to the market and number/strength of schools feeding it. If you're in South Dakota and want to be a prosecutor, then yes SD for free is fine b/c it's the state flagship and there's no other competition, despite it being TTT.

In Boston, however, attending Suffolk or Northeastern is a terrible idea, even for free because of BC/BU + T14 kids with ties.

Jump over a state and UConn for free is fine if you want to be a prosecutor in CT (and you have ties there)

[Tiago Splitter]

edit- also when you guys say "cheap and local" do you mean schools like BU and GW or are you talking local TTTTs for free?

For someone with ambitions in the Northeast I'm thinking ideally of BC/BU. What kind of money did you get from GW? That seems like a better option than USC if you can get the costs to be the same.

[JamesMcGillEsquire]

edit- also when you guys say "cheap and local" do you mean schools like BU and GW or are you talking local TTTTs for free?

For someone with ambitions in the Northeast I'm thinking ideally of BC/BU. What kind of money did you get from GW? That seems like a better option than USC if you can get the costs to be the same.

got about $130k from GW after negotiating. It would have been only slightly cheaper than Cornell

[bowser]

I guess you're in a tough spot b/c USC is the only school offering full ride, which is weird to me.

Anyways--- i think USC at 40K or Cornell at 150K are decent options, if you're willing to consider Biglaw seriously as a fallback, and if you're willing to stay in California (and by willing I mean, fairly enthusiastic about the idea). Personally I'd retake if you think you can do better and try to get a bigger T-14 discount.

OP, if I asked you right now would you forego OCI after your 1L year?

[JamesMcGillEsquire]

I guess you're in a tough spot b/c USC is the only school offering full ride, which is weird to me.

Anyways--- i think USC at 40K or Cornell at 150K are decent options, if you're willing to consider Biglaw seriously as a fallback, and if you're willing to stay in California (and by willing I mean, fairly enthusiastic about the idea). Personally I'd retake if you think you can do better and try to get a bigger T-14 discount.

OP, if I asked you right now would you forego OCI after your 1L year?

I wouldn't just skip OCI for no reason if that's what your asking. I mean I might as well try it and see how I do right? Do you mean if I had really bad grades would I be ok not doing OCI? I'm not sure I understand the question

[bowser]

I wouldn't just skip OCI for no reason if that's what your asking. I mean I might as well try it and see how I do right? Do you mean if I had really bad grades would I be ok not doing OCI? I'm not sure I understand the question

I'm just trying to see how serious you are about avoiding Biglaw. T-14 gets a lot less valuable if you don't do OCI and you aren't interested in doing a fairly specific type of PI/Gov gig (USAO, national legal organizations like ACLU, etc.)

Trying to get a DA job out of law school just requires more perseverance/sticking to your guns. Ideally you'd want to do 2L summer at a DA office, which removes Biglaw from the picture. You can do the Biglaw thing your second summer and keep looking for DA jobs, but (1) you'll be less incentivized at that point, (2) it doesn't look that great to the DA offices that are hiring. I go to CLS which doesn't have a lot of people doing non-Biglaw, but the two I know going to DA offices did not do OCI.

[JamesMcGillEsquire]

received a very small bump from Cornell the other day... But I suppose now I will look like an even bigger idiot if I pass on Cornell :/

[UpandDown97]

received a very small bump from Cornell the other day... But I suppose now I will look like an even bigger idiot if I pass on Cornell :/

I would definitely strike USC out of the equation. I think Cornell is the right choice. You may have to put a few years in at a firm, but that would probably happen regardless.

[BiglawAssociate]

received a very small bump from Cornell the other day... But I suppose now I will look like an even bigger idiot if I pass on Cornell :/

I would definitely strike USC out of the equation. I think Cornell is the right choice. You may have to put a few years in at a firm, but that would probably happen regardless.

Why do people on this forum make it seem as if schools FORCE you to do biglaw??? It's your decision whether to do OCI.

If you didn't have loans, I don't see why you would bother doing biglaw/OCI.

I agree with Zuck - go get a paralegal job/case manager job or whatever and figure what the hell you want first. Stop listening to 0Ls on this forum.

[BigZuck]

I agree with Zuck