Michigan no longer a T10 - run away all is doomed Forum

[SquedTheScholar]

http://www.usnews.com/education/best-gr ... aw-schools

That is all.

[Mack.Hambleton]

well they're 12th in BL+FC (57%) so really more accurate

[starry eyed]

So "DVP" it is.

[usernotfound]

...

[Mal Reynolds]

A blind squirrel finds a nut every once and a while because Michigan is a terrible school.

[r1tlv50]

A blind squirrel finds a nut every once and a while because Michigan is a terrible school.

Jesus Christ. What's their crime, charging less than $60K for sticker tuition? Having a football team?

I don't have any ties to Michigan...

[CaptainJapan]

A blind squirrel finds a nut every once and a while because Michigan is a terrible school.

+100 TLS street cred for hating on bottom-half t14s

[ballcaps]

A blind squirrel finds a nut every once and a while because Michigan is a terrible school.

Jesus Christ. What's their crime, charging less than $60K for sticker tuition? Having a football team?

i thought there was some sarcasm floating around? maybe not...

[r1tlv50]

r1tlv50 wrote:
Quote:
A blind squirrel finds a nut every once and a while because Michigan is a terrible school.


Jesus Christ. What's their crime, charging less than $60K for sticker tuition? Having a football team?


i thought there was some sarcasm floating around? maybe not...

I dunno, there's nothing to suggest it from that short of a post. I hope so though, but there isn't really a limit to how far some people have their heads up their asses over 'preftige' (reason number 11989878 people generally don't like lawyers)

[Mal Reynolds]

I'm sorry people must not be evaluating law schools on job placement data anymore.

[r1tlv50]

lol don't think jobs have ever been the number one consideration for any published lists...there's always been some hot air thrown into the equation

i just looked and mich does have a low biglaw + fedclerk score though. presumably average COA is also lower than other t14s

[Mal Reynolds]

lol don't think jobs have ever been the number one consideration for any published lists...there's always been some hot air thrown into the equation

i just looked and mich does have a low biglaw + fedclerk score though. presumably average COA is also lower than other t14s

Jerbless but $250k in debt rather than $280k. What a bargain.

[r1tlv50]

Jerbless but $250k in debt rather than $280k. What a bargain.

50-55% biglaw + fedclerk numbers at Michigan vs. 60-70% at the other T14's. I'm not buying that you'd only be able to save 30k living out there as opposed to east coast or CA. I'm not gonna crunch the numbers on that one but just eyeballing it it looks like it could make economic sense even without great financial aid

[Tiago Splitter]

Jerbless but $250k in debt rather than $280k. What a bargain.

50-55% biglaw + fedclerk numbers at Michigan vs. 60-70% at the other T14's. I'm not buying that you'd only be able to save 30k living out there as opposed to east coast or CA. I'm not gonna crunch the numbers on that one but just eyeballing it it looks like it could make economic sense even without great financial aid

Mal just did the work for you. It doesn't.

[r1tlv50]

r1tlv50 wrote:
Quote:
Jerbless but $250k in debt rather than $280k. What a bargain.


50-55% biglaw + fedclerk numbers at Michigan vs. 60-70% at the other T14's. I'm not buying that you'd only be able to save 30k living out there as opposed to east coast or CA. I'm not gonna crunch the numbers on that one but just eyeballing it it looks like it could make economic sense even without great financial aid

Mal just did the work for you. It doesn't.

Oh okay 250 v. 280 was from the profiles. Really hoping I can avoid throwing down the COL they're estimating, but that's a different topic.

In any event, it's not night and day the way "terrible school" suggests.

Also kinda odd Penn outperforms Mich on the biglaw stuff pretty heavily some years yet they're considered peers

[Mal Reynolds]

They're not peers at all. Penn is clearly superior.

[zhongxiaozhui]

They're not peers at all. Penn is clearly superior.

[r1tlv50]

haha. I got that from the HYS -> CCN -> PV...etc breakdowns people post on here (i think they normally group Penn and Mich). i agree that the job data favor penn

[Mack.Hambleton]

Penn has a higher BL+FC % than NYU, so yeah

[052220152]

virginia isnt really that great either, 63% firm plus clerks, they hire a ton of their students, pretty TTT behavior
duke is 60%
m 57%
b 56%
n 63%
c 68% (apparently all to nyc tho)

these numbers are all close enough that $$$ should change where you go. basically, if you dont go to penn or higher, make sure that you are getting good money

[BigZuck]

haha. I got that from the HYS -> CCN -> PV...etc breakdowns people post on here (i think they normally group Penn and Mich). i agree that the job data favor penn

Those groupings are generally based on admissions criteria (HYS is hardest to get into, CCN a little easier, MVPB a little easier than that, DCNG easier than that) also kinda based on job outcomes (HYS has better outcomes than CCN, CCN has better outcomes than MVPB, etc.) but mostly it's just kind of TLS convention and not worth trying to decipher those tiers because you can find all sorts of exceptions.

[84651846190]

virginia isnt really that great either, 63% firm plus clerks, they hire a ton of their students, pretty TTT behavior
duke is 60%
m 57%
b 56%
n 63%
c 68% (apparently all to nyc tho)

these numbers are all close enough that $$$ should change where you go. basically, if you dont go to penn or higher, make sure that you are getting good money

Yeah, if you're dead set on biglaw, Cornell might be the best bang for your LSAT points and/or $$$ if you can't get into a T6.

[052220152]

virginia isnt really that great either, 63% firm plus clerks, they hire a ton of their students, pretty TTT behavior
duke is 60%
m 57%
b 56%
n 63%
c 68% (apparently all to nyc tho)

these numbers are all close enough that $$$ should change where you go. basically, if you dont go to penn or higher, make sure that you are getting good money

Yeah, if you're dead set on biglaw, Cornell might be the best bang for your LSAT points and/or $$$ if you can't get into a T6.

cornell needs to get more love, who gives two shits if it mostly feeds to nyc, those numbers are fuckin golden

[r1tlv50]

r1tlv50 wrote:

haha. I got that from the HYS -> CCN -> PV...etc breakdowns people post on here (i think they normally group Penn and Mich). i agree that the job data favor penn

Those groupings are generally based on admissions criteria (HYS is hardest to get into, CCN a little easier, MVPB a little easier than that, DCNG easier than that) also kinda based on job outcomes (HYS has better outcomes than CCN, CCN has better outcomes than MVPB, etc.) but mostly it's just kind of TLS convention and not worth trying to decipher those tiers because you can find all sorts of exceptions.

penn v. nyu in particular makes me wonder though. just on very general evaluations of the schools (biglaw and clerk percentages, gpa/lsat), it seems like penn's got the advantage in everything but the lsat percentiles

[sims1]

r1tlv50 wrote:

haha. I got that from the HYS -> CCN -> PV...etc breakdowns people post on here (i think they normally group Penn and Mich). i agree that the job data favor penn

Those groupings are generally based on admissions criteria (HYS is hardest to get into, CCN a little easier, MVPB a little easier than that, DCNG easier than that) also kinda based on job outcomes (HYS has better outcomes than CCN, CCN has better outcomes than MVPB, etc.) but mostly it's just kind of TLS convention and not worth trying to decipher those tiers because you can find all sorts of exceptions.

penn v. nyu in particular makes me wonder though. just on very general evaluations of the schools (biglaw and clerk percentages, gpa/lsat), it seems like penn's got the advantage in everything but the lsat percentiles

I don't think Penn beats NYU in big law (even if it's just because of proximity to law firms). The differential can in part be explained by people with good grades self-selecting out of the biglaw route at NYU for PI.