URM 3.47 / 161 – Admitted to T20 - Advice wanted Forum

[fl00bye]

AA male, just admitted to a T20, need advice.

If I attend, I would be below the school’s GPA and LSAT medians (I’d be within the 25th percentile for both). I haven’t received any information regarding scholarship for the T20 school, but so far, I have full rides at all TT and TTT schools I have heard back from. I am getting a lot of pressure from my parents and colleagues to attend the T20, regardless of cost (no, my parents would not be paying), but am reluctant to enroll at a school where my chances for success may be stifled by the academic prowess of my peers.

I guess my real question is how do students who fall below a school’s median LSAT/GPA numbers, URM or otherwise, generally fair in terms of grades, job placement, success, happiness, etc.? While I am intrigued by the prospect of attending a T20 school, I also don’t want to be blown out of the water by the competition. I’ve been trying to find stats on URM 1L and 2L grades, but these are numbers that, I can imagine, law schools do not generally share with curious members of the public.

[twenty]

Definitely do not worry about the prowess of your peers. There's plenty of material on TLS demonstrating how there is basically zero correlation between grades/LSAT and your law school GPA.

Definitely, however, do worry about how you're going to pay back sticker price + cost of attendance loans from a T20. (Appreciating you haven't heard back on scholarships here yet)

You should probably retake the LSAT and come back next year, tbh.

[The Brainalist]

On average, people fare better in terms of employment below median at a top school than top quarter at a T2 or T3. In the list of things you have to consider in choosing a school, the comparative qualifications of your fellow students should be way towards the bottom (and is probably the wrong way to see it - having successful classmates is a good thing).

[TheSpanishMain]

This is anecdotal, but IIRC there was an AA male who barely sneaked into UVA, way below the median LSAT. He ended up dominating and was like top 10%-15%.

I don't know if I'd say that the LSAT has NO correlation with 1L performance, but it's certainly not the be all end all.

[californiauser]

T20 is a meaningless distinction. Which school is it and where do you want to practice?

If you want to practice in Alabama and the "T20" is UCLA, then it might make sense to attend the TT with a fullride if said TT is in your desired market.

[fl00bye]

Definitely do not worry about the prowess of your peers. There's plenty of material on TLS demonstrating how there is basically zero correlation between grades/LSAT and your law school GPA.

Definitely, however, do worry about how you're going to pay back sticker price + cost of attendance loans from a T20. (Appreciating you haven't heard back on scholarships here yet)

You should probably retake the LSAT and come back next year, tbh.

Thanks for the quick response.

I have considered retaking, but (1) I took the test three times this year (canceled, 159, 161), (2) I have already completed every published preptest. I was pretty disappointed with my 161 (was consistently scoring 168-170) and felt really confident after leaving the testing center. Really have no idea what happened, which makes me very reluctant to sit for the test again (I wouldn't want to spend a year study material I had already covered, inflate my PT scores, and be left in a similar/worse position than I am in now).

[fl00bye]

T20 is a meaningless distinction. Which school is it and where do you want to practice?

If you want to practice in Alabama and the "T20" is UCLA, then it might make sense to attend the TT with a fullride if said TT is in your desired market.

WUSTL. Not sure where I want to practice, partially why I am so conflicted. I know the portability of a WUSTL degree is debatable, but my other options (Cardozo, USF, Santa Clara) seem to be generally regarded as regional schools.

[twenty]

Oh yikes. Those other schools have nasty stipulations on their scholarships. Do yourself a huge favor and don't go to those, for sure.

WUSTL at sticker is really not a great plan, either.

Honestly, you should probably not go to law school with those numbers. I ended up running out of retakes on my cycle as well, and am now likely going to have to sit out two cycles. It's not fun by any stretch, but the choices you have are really bad. :\

edit> Cardozo's stipulations actually may not be that bad. I still wouldn't recommend this, but this is probably the least bad option you have.

[californiauser]

Oh yikes. Those other schools have nasty stipulations on their scholarships. Do yourself a huge favor and don't go to those, for sure.

WUSTL at sticker is really not a great plan, either.

Honestly, you should probably not go to law school with those numbers. I ended up running out of retakes on my cycle as well, and am now likely going to have to sit out two cycles. It's not fun by any stretch, but the choices you have are really bad. :\

edit> Cardozo's stipulations actually may not be that bad. I still wouldn't recommend this, but this is probably the least bad option you have.

I don't think OP necessarily has to sit out this cycle. He has a chance at the lower T-14.

OP you should apply to Michigan through Georgetown and whichever other T20s interest you. Also, head over to the URM 2013-2014 thread for more advice.

[Hutz_and_Goodman]

There's a relationship between LSAT/undergrad gpa and law school grades. However it's not perfect and there are people who under or over perform. The key issue is how much will it cost to attend?