Emory Law Forum

[The Dark Kite]

Anyone attend Emory Law or have friends/family attending? I just wanted to know how OCI has gone in the recent past few seasons and whether or not it's an enjoyable experience, employment prospects are generally good, whether or not there's national prospect in employment (I'd prefer to practice in New York or Chicago), etc.

I toured Cornell a few weeks ago and the young lady giving me the tour kept mentioning Emory law students being present at a lot of summer associate gigs alongside rising Cornell 3L's (which I don't believe was intentional on her part) -- seems like Emory students, or at least those in the top quarter, fare pretty well in what's left the job market?

Thoughts?

[HYS123]

A friend of mine just landed a V10 gig from Emory OCI, very near the top of his class. Completely anecdotal I know, but he seemed to echo what you said about the top quarter.

[Ramius]

http://lawschooltransparency.com

This is all you need. Anecdotes are useless, data is what matters.

[MyNameIsFlynn!]

LST is all you really need to know. Emory might not be bad if you get the Woodruff (full) scholly

Fwiw, the ATL legal market still sucks and Emory grads are competing with Vandy, Duke, UVA, and the top students at GSU and Mercer for Atl gigs, so that doesn't help either. Have friends around top 20 and top 30 who are both still looking for work post 2L summer

[The Dark Kite]

So I think the consensus is probably that I'd be comparatively safer attending WASHU than Emory if I'm trying to tap the Chicago market? It's weird to conceptualize and I realize that there are myriad factors that play into what makes one school superior to another other than rankings... but it's a matter of less than a handful of USNWR rankings (granted, also the difference between T20 and not).

[hephaestus]

If you want to practice in NY or Chicago, going to school in Atlanta makes no sense. Shoot for the T14, especially NU or UChi.

[cotiger]

So I think the consensus is probably that I'd be comparatively safer attending WASHU than Emory if I'm trying to tap the Chicago market? It's weird to conceptualize and I realize that there are myriad factors that play into what makes one school superior to another other than rankings... but it's a matter of less than a handful of USNWR rankings (granted, also the difference between T20 and not).

LSAT/GPA?

As far as just general LST employment stats, WUSTL (WashU) and Emory are pretty similar. But Emory generally places in Georgia (and not in Illinois at all), whereas WUSTL spreads out a bit more, with Illinois being the #3 option. So yeah, if you're trying to end up in Chicago, WUSTL would be the much better choice.

Better yet would be Northwestern.

[vicpin5190]

So I think the consensus is probably that I'd be comparatively safer attending WASHU than Emory if I'm trying to tap the Chicago market? It's weird to conceptualize and I realize that there are myriad factors that play into what makes one school superior to another other than rankings... but it's a matter of less than a handful of USNWR rankings (granted, also the difference between T20 and not).

WashU has pretty strong ties to the St. Louis/Chicago market, though if you go to WashU i think it is more conducive to practicing in St. Louis so you should factor that in. St. Louis is a nice city if you go to the right places, but it isn't Chicago for sure.

[cotiger]

If you want to practice in NY or Chicago, going to school in Atlanta makes no sense. Shoot for the T14, especially NU or UChi.

Yeah, NU is relatively getable because of its appetite for splitters. Just gotta hit that 170.

Chicago may be out of the question, depending on OP's GPA.

[hephaestus]

If you want to practice in NY or Chicago, going to school in Atlanta makes no sense. Shoot for the T14, especially NU or UChi.

Yeah, NU is relatively getable because of its appetite for splitters. Just gotta hit that 170.

Chicago may be out of the question, depending on OP's GPA.

True. At any rate, I don't see why Emory would be in consideration.

[The Dark Kite]

Don't get me wrong, guys... lol. I'd go to a T14 if it was an option, especially Northwestern (which is, not coincidentally, my first choice). I know the market is awful right now and going outside the T20 is a gamble but I have to be practical. So I'm just trying to weigh the options as best I can. Still waiting for the October score to get back to me, I was hitting 166's on PT's. I know a lot of people go down on game day but I'm confident. Either way, it's looking like a retake might be in order for December.

With the way the cycles been playing out these past few years, it seems as though schools are waitlisting people/holding out longer and longer.. and so therefore: when you apply in the cycle isn't AS large of a factor as it once was. Thoughts?

I'd take it again in December and get apps out early January if seats weren't already gonna be largely filled by then.

[Ti Malice]

So I think the consensus is probably that I'd be comparatively safer attending WASHU than Emory if I'm trying to tap the Chicago market? It's weird to conceptualize and I realize that there are myriad factors that play into what makes one school superior to another other than rankings... but it's a matter of less than a handful of USNWR rankings (granted, also the difference between T20 and not).

Ignore USNWR. Outside of the T14 (and even within, to an extent), everything places locally/regionally. Emory means nothing to employers in Chicago.

[timmyd]

If you did well at Emory, I don't think it "would mean nothing to an employer in Chicago". That is speculation on my part though. I think, and this seems to be confirmed by students at UT that are able to place outside the region, outside the t14 at least you need to do well to be able to place nationally. It is very possible to do though at schools 15-25 I would say if you do well. It is true that if you are at median at Emory or UT for that matter...you arnt getting Chicago without some strong connections or ties and even then its a toss up.

[cotiger]

Don't get me wrong, guys... lol. I'd go to a T14 if it was an option, especially Northwestern (which is, not coincidentally, my first choice). I know the market is awful right now and going outside the T20 is a gamble but I have to be practical. So I'm just trying to weigh the options as best I can. Still waiting for the October score to get back to me, I was hitting 166's on PT's. I know a lot of people go down on game day but I'm confident. Either way, it's looking like a retake might be in order for December.

With the way the cycles been playing out these past few years, it seems as though schools are waitlisting people/holding out longer and longer.. and so therefore: when you apply in the cycle isn't AS large of a factor as it once was. Thoughts?

I'd take it again in December and get apps out early January if seats weren't already gonna be largely filled by then.

T20 doesn't mean anything. There's T14, a handful of top regionals, and then the rest of T1. Sure, it would be possible to get to Chicago with top 10% at Emory, but you'd have to get that top 10% first. If you aren't completely satisfied with staying in Atlanta, then don't go to Emory, because Atlanta is where you'll most likely end up.

With a 166 and a decent GPA (say, 3.6X), you're a shoo-in at WUSTL with a strong possibility of big money. That's your best option at those scores. Obviously, TCR is keep studying and hit a 170 for Northwestern.

[Anthony Davis]

Don't get me wrong, guys... lol. I'd go to a T14 if it was an option, especially Northwestern (which is, not coincidentally, my first choice). I know the market is awful right now and going outside the T20 is a gamble but I have to be practical. So I'm just trying to weigh the options as best I can. Still waiting for the October score to get back to me, I was hitting 166's on PT's. I know a lot of people go down on game day but I'm confident. Either way, it's looking like a retake might be in order for December.

With the way the cycles been playing out these past few years, it seems as though schools are waitlisting people/holding out longer and longer.. and so therefore: when you apply in the cycle isn't AS large of a factor as it once was. Thoughts?

I'd take it again in December and get apps out early January if seats weren't already gonna be largely filled by then.

T20 doesn't mean anything. There's T14, a handful of top regionals, and then the rest of T1. Sure, it would be possible to get to Chicago with top 10% at Emory, but you'd have to get that top 10% first. If you aren't completely satisfied with staying in Atlanta, then don't go to Emory, because Atlanta is where you'll most likely end up.

With a 166 and a decent GPA (say, 3.6X), you're a shoo-in at WUSTL with a strong possibility of big money. That's your best option at those scores. Obviously, TCR is keep studying and hit a 170 for Northwestern.

It's worth mentioning that Emory's OCI doesn't have any Chicago firms (or if they do, it's a negligible number); whereas they actually have a strong presence in ATL, a presence in NYC, and something resembling a presence in DC. Working to finish in the top 10% so that you can network alone, or send out cold resumes to Chicago firms isn't really an enticing prospect.

[The Dark Kite]

So in all honesty, if you guys were me and you got a 165 LSAT, you'd retake for a 170 and apply in January for a better shot at NUSL? And yes, I have 1+ years of WE (2 by the time I actually attend, as I'm still working full time) along with other strong softs (but no, I haven't cured cancer, flown to the moon, or competed in the olympics, so... I understand it's fairly irrelevant lol).

[cotiger]

It's worth mentioning that Emory's OCI doesn't have any Chicago firms (or if they do, it's a negligible number); whereas they actually have a strong presence in ATL, a presence in NYC, and something resembling a presence in DC. Working to finish in the top 10% so that you can network alone, or send out cold resumes to Chicago firms isn't really an enticing prospect.

Yeah, I want to clarify that I have no actual knowledge about how difficult it would be to get to Chi from Emory. I was just using the hypothetical that even if it were simply a matter of getting top 10%, that would still make Emory a terrible option.

[gregfootball2001]

If you aren't completely satisfied with staying in Atlanta, then don't go to Emory, because Atlanta is where you'll most likely end up.

And I'd argue that if you wanted to stay in Atlanta, in most cases, UGA would be the better choice. But perhaps that's a thought for a different thread.

[deadpanic]

So in all honesty, if you guys were me and you got a 165 LSAT, you'd retake for a 170 and apply in January for a better shot at NUSL? And yes, I have 1+ years of WE (2 by the time I actually attend, as I'm still working full time) along with other strong softs (but no, I haven't cured cancer, flown to the moon, or competed in the olympics, so... I understand it's fairly irrelevant lol).

Is your current job pretty good? Quite honestly, if it is decent, I would not quit it to go to Emory...not worth it. Northwestern or Cornell would probably be worth it.

[20141023]

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[hephaestus]

+1 to regulus. The issue is that a non-T14 could likely take you places you have ties if you are at the top of the class, but thinking you will perform better than your peers is an incredibly dangerous assumption. Instead you should be thinking of a place where performing at or below the median can still allow you to achieve your goals. Honesty, if you get a 166 and really want Chicago, you are unlikely to find a school worth attending. It's better to apply in January with a 170 than in October with a 166.

[WanderingPondering]

These are not the potential placement abilities of Emory and WashU, but rather the actual placement results; even so, I think they are pretty telling:

Emory (Top 3 Placement Regions for the Class of 2012):
Georgia: 45%
New York: 9%
Florida: 8.3%

WashU (Top 3 Placement Regions for the Class of 2012):
Missouri: 24.7%
DC: 8.0%
Illinois: 8.0%

As you can see, neither school has a "good" chance of getting you to Chicago or New York unless you are towards the top of your class.

I think you are being misleading considering WashU. After MO/STL, the top 6 landing spots for graduates are DC, Illinois, Foreign Country, NY,California, and Texas. These are probably the 6 most "desirable places" and 40% of the class ends up there. Now, consider that many people at WUSTL are from Saint Louis or the Midwest, there is also some self selection. Only 25% of the class stays in MO, so everyone else has to go elsewhere, right?

You're right in the sense that it is certainly not definite, and there is of risk in attending WUSTL hoping to go to nyc and only nyc.

[20141023]

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[cotiger]

I think you are being misleading considering WashU. After MO/STL, the top 6 landing spots for graduates are DC, Illinois, Foreign Country, NY,California, and Texas. These are probably the 6 most "desirable places" and 40% of the class ends up there. Now, consider that many people at WUSTL are from Saint Louis or the Midwest, there is also some self selection. Only 25% of the class stays in MO, so everyone else has to go elsewhere, right?

That's why I said that those numbers are "not the potential placement abilities of Emory and WashU, but rather the actual placement results."

You also have to be careful with those employment percentages because they include all types of employment in the respective regions and not just FTLT JD-required ones. Accordingly, an "8% employment rate in Illinois" might actually be closer to a 6% employment rate for full-time lawyers in that area.

Obviously, TCR is retake to 170 -> Northwestern. But is WUSTL really a bad option for OP if he stays at a 166? He's likely for significant money with a good chance at Chicago/NYC if he does well in LS, and is still looking ok (bc of assumedly low debt/overall placement) if he doesn't do as well.

[The Dark Kite]

And this is probably a slap-worthy question, but: applying to schools in the ChiCity area like Loyola or Kent would be too much of a gamble in terms of gaining meaningful employment after graduation, right? Even if I'm able to negotiate large/full scholly's?