Tulane v. University of Washington Forum

[trojanseahawk]

I'm a Seattle native; originally thought I'd want to practice there but am now considering practicing in California. Tulane was the first school I was accepted to, giving me a scholarship of $25K/year. My boyfriend of four years was also just accepted to their medical school program and will be attending in the fall (which is a big plus for me). UW only gave me 4K/year, but I could live at home to save money and would receive in state tuition.

I'm visiting Tulane in two weeks for their admitted students day (with boyfriend in tow), but cannot for the life of me figure out where I will be most happy.

Here are my pro/cons:

Tulane:
+Boyfriend (who I would live with, thus reducing cost of living which is already significantly less in NOLA)
+Significant scholarship
+Weather
+From what I hear, quality of life is pretty high at Tulane
-not as much ability to get a job on the West Coast? Can anyone confirm this?
-much smaller city, less to do?
-far away from family
-Just fell in the rankings from 47 to 51. Will this be significant?

University of Washington
+Family (who I would live with for the first year... Let's be honest, don't know if I can guarantee I'll stay living at home for all three years)
+Just jumped in the rankings from 30 to 20
+I'm familiar with Seattle and what life would be like there
-far away from boyfriend
-still might have issues getting a job anywhere but Seattle


Can anyone give me some insight on where they would choose based on those pro/cons? I'm having a lot of issues making a decision, and at this point am debating sending in two initial deposits while I decide. Have also debated about Hastings, but am currently thinking the COL in San Francisco and no scholarship might make this too cost prohibitive. Am also still waiting to hear from Davis and USC, although I got rejected from UCLA so I'm not sure how likely USC is.

Thanks for any and all help.

[Lord Randolph McDuff]

Is this where you are asking us to tell you if you should break up with your boyfriend? Look, this question is all about your relationship. I think going to UW because of some ranking magazine means you care more about your career than the relationship. This is fine, but be very clear that the message to the boyfriend will be sent.

Hate to be the bearer of potentially bad news but no way you guys make it if you could have done New Orleans together and you choose Seattle knowing he can't be there. Only you can answer this... is he the one!!!???

[trojanseahawk]

No, interestingly enough I'm on this forum for law school advice, not relationship advice. My question is essentially whether the significant rankings difference will make it impossible for me to achieve the same jobs at Tulane that I would have at UW. Currently I'm interested in intellectual property, entertainment law and constitutional law, but obviously this could change. I was simply listing my pro/con list so all information is present.

[Lord Randolph McDuff]

Ok here ya go Miss it isn't a big deal to move across the country from my boyfriend of four years.

Both these schools are regional. Maybe even UW more so, despite its better rep among lawyers and judges, etc. If you go to UW and aren't in the top 5% of your class, you will have basically no shot at employment outside the state. Even then, your best option will definitely be in Seattle. I know many people like to disagree about their schools "portability" but frankly they are biased. No one in Oregon is going to hire you when they have a perfectly good grad from Lewis and Clark or U of Oregon who has interned with them/has ties there. Cali has 300 law schools and no jobs, no one is going to hire an out of state UW grad.

I go to to a similar school in many ways. People on TLS, for example, like to say that CU is the "strongest school in the Mountain West." This is totally meaningless. You want to work in Colorado, you go to CU if you are smart. You want to work in Idaho, you go to U of Idaho.

As far as rankings go in terms of jobs in state... these schools are peer schools even though one is a bit harder to get into and higher regarded. Because they are both regional, your employment outcomes will be more tied to the economies of the two states than any magazine ranking. I'd have to say Seattle looks stronger than NOLA here, but maybe the south rises again.

Good luck!

[seatown12]

I think going to UW because of some ranking magazine means you care more about your career than the relationship. This is fine, but be very clear that the message to the boyfriend will be sent.

No, interestingly enough I'm on this forum for law school advice, not relationship advice.

Lol. The answer is yes you will have much better options coming out of UW, especially if you want to be on the West Coast. With in-state UW is only a couple thousand more. You would be an idiot, looking at it strictly from a career perspective, to go to Tulane.

[seatown12]

these schools are peer schools even though one is a bit harder to get into and higher regarded.

Sorry but no; CU and Tulane are peer schools, but UW is significantly better than both. Look at the employment stats.

[tennisking88]

You would be an idiot, looking at it strictly from a career perspective, to go to Tulane.

Not really. Like any other bottom T1 school, if you place in the top 1/3-1/4, you should find an OK job.

Only you can answer the question about the bf. Can you handle the distance? If not, you gotta consider Tulane.

[Lord Randolph McDuff]

Look at the employment stats.

All three are peer schools in the sense that all three get you employed in their home states, with Tulane actually having more alumni outside of its home state. Actually, this year CU had worse employment than UW, but more of CU's class employed were in JD required jobs. Only 4/5 of UW's employed at nine months were in JD required jobs, not all of those full time. Medians are identical.. CU gets more aps.. Identical peer review and judges and lawyers scores...

Peer schools. Seattle economy is kicking Denvers ass, but thats your difference and that fluctuates.

Sorry but no; CU and Tulane are peer schools, but UW is significantly better than both.

Sorry, but two years ago only seven schools separated CU and UW in the rankings. You probably would have said they were peers then. You are overly influenced by a magazine. Don't give bad advice to this nice lady who is making a huge decision.


OP: you want the State of Washington, you go to UW. You want Cali, go to the best Cali school you get into. You want Lousiania/the south and boyfriend, you go to Tulane.

All schools out of the top 15 or so are totally regional. This can't be repeated enough on here.

[seatown12]

OP: you want the State of Washington, you go to UW. You want Cali, go to the best Cali school you get into. You want Lousiania/the south and boyfriend, you go to Tulane. Vandy, Emory, or 'Bama, or UGA, etc. etc.

UW dominates Seattle; Tulane dominates nowhere. They are not peers.

[Lord Randolph McDuff]

OP: you want the State of Washington, you go to UW. You want Cali, go to the best Cali school you get into. You want Lousiania/the south and boyfriend, you go to Tulane. Vandy, Emory, or 'Bama, or UGA, etc. etc.

UW dominates Seattle; Tulane dominates nowhere. They are not peers.

UW dominates Seattle. Tulane is the best bet for employment in NOLA/Louisiana, unless from NOLA and coming back from a T-14/Vandy. Same could be said for Seattle- people make the argument that you should go to T-14 and come back to Seattle if you are from there.. not my favorite argument but there are certainly firms in which that would provide a boost.

I shouldn't have said south for Tulane I was just trying to emphasize how different it was. Your right Tulane doesn't dominate anywhere. I think UW is a better school because of its secure home market. I just say they are peers because essentially her decision is a regional one, and they are peers in that regard. I mean some people choose jobs over location, and in that case UW is safer than Tulane or for that matter most state schools right now. I for one choose location over money, another common route. I'd rather make 55k in the place where I want to live than 100k in say, Seattle, and that is not just because of cost of living differences. Going to UW to work in Northern CO would be dumb. I actually know someone who transferred from a "T-20," Minn, to OU Law because they realized no one gave a shit about Minn Law in Oklahoma. In that sense, Minn, OU, KU, CU, UF, OSU, you name it are all peer schools. Location is the first concern, and if that isn't a big issue for an applicant they should consider the strength of regional economies.

UW is an awesome school don't get me wrong.

OP: Have you spoken to your boyfriend about not going to Tulane? I couldn't help but assume you were influenced by rankings by the timing of your inquiry this morning...

[trojanseahawk]

Yes, he wants me to go wherever I think is best for me. Definitely a bit of fear after no one on this boards thinks long distance work, and, in addition, we'd be doing law school AND med school. I've definitely been influenced by the rankings. Before I was comparing #33 to #47 and now I'm comparing #20 to #51. I plan on practicing on the West Coast regardless and am nervous about Tulane's ability to get me there. I've been accepted to Hastings as well, but I'm not sure how much more it would boost my shot despite the much more massive price tag.

[bk1]

If you want to end up on the west coast then I would drop Tulane. While Hastings would be the best for CA, it's just too expensive to be worth considering. That leaves UW. If you were paying for CoL then I would say that UW is still too expensive, but with 12k+in-state+living at home, I think UW becomes reasonable.

[minnbills]

Stay where you have ties. UW is a very good school to boot.

[Doorkeeper]

Do you want to live/work in Washington after law school? If so, go UW.

If California, Hastings.

If New Orleans, Tulane.

[flem]

Well UW moved up to 20 in the rankings, while TTTulane fell out of the top 50. I think we know the correct answer here.

[dissonance1848]

You are from Seattle. Only serious choice here is UW. As long as you can wing a long distance relationship, you are good to go.

UC Hastings makes no sense. Expensive and no ties -> lots of debt, and no jerb.

Tulane might have your BF, but you don't have ties in NOLA (and don't bet on being high enough in the class to get work out of state; also, what work you would find would be mainly in the East Coast, thus nullifying the benefits, since you want to work on the East Coast).

Go to UW.

[tennisking88]

Yes, he wants me to go wherever I think is best for me. Definitely a bit of fear after no one on this boards thinks long distance work, and, in addition, we'd be doing law school AND med school. I've definitely been influenced by the rankings. Before I was comparing #33 to #47 and now I'm comparing #20 to #51. I plan on practicing on the West Coast regardless and am nervous about Tulane's ability to get me there. I've been accepted to Hastings as well, but I'm not sure how much more it would boost my shot despite the much more massive price tag.

For the love of God don't choose schools based on one years' rank. UW could easily drop back to 30 by the time you graduate (same w/rise for Tulane).

If you and your bf are both in different cities that are very very far away from each other, for four years, I do not see how this ends up working.

I maintain that Tulane isn't as bad an option as others think. UW is a better school, and the fact that you have ties there makes it even more attractive. But if you do well at Tulane, I would say you could very well find a job even in CA. The "prepare to stay in NOLA if you go to Tulane" sentiment is wrong. Their placement stats for 2010 (--LinkRemoved--–%202010.pdf) indicate that only ~40% of the class stayed in LA, and 60% went to NY, TX, or "other". On the Tulane website, it shows that ~11% of classes of 2008-2010 went to the "West & Northwest" regions (http://www.law.tulane.edu/tlsabout/index.aspx?id=528). Again, I think it really depends on how well you do.

That being said, I think UW would give you more leeway to do worse. That is, you could still be in the middle of your class, and probably find work in Seatlle, as where being in the middle of the class at Tulane would leave you with less options.

[dissonance1848]

Forget about where grads go after graduation. If someone does median rank, goes back home and becomes temp. doc review or brewing at Starbucks, it becomes "10% of class headed to the West Coast". Meaningless data.

The best bet is UW. Having ties from Seattle is going to help some, to be sure, but it wouldn't outweigh the difference in class rank probably necessary to get you work in Seattle from Tulane as opposed to from UW.

If your BF is going to Med school, find out where he wants to end up practicing medicine (not just med school, then residency). That should help you out.

[minnbills]

It's much much more likely that OP will end up median or lower than in the top part of the class at Tulane. You're either comfortable with your options from that point, or you don't go.

And, those out of state numbers don't mean much if you don't know what those jobs are. For all we know, those people went home to work doc-review because they couldn't find anything.

Granted, I'm pretty conservative when it comes to choosing a school- I think you stay in your home region in almost every circumstance unless you're going t14. Having those connections and network during the job search has got to be a help, I wouldn't want to look for a job with no contacts or only new contacts.

[tennisking88]

It's much much more likely that OP will end up median or lower than in the top part of the class at Tulane.

lol what? how do you know?

[minnbills]

It's much much more likely that OP will end up median or lower than in the top part of the class at Tulane.

lol what? how do you know?

it's basic math really, though I should have said "around median or lower."

[cinephile]

Definitely a bit of fear after no one on this boards thinks long distance work, and, in addition, we'd be doing law school AND med school.

This is why I think long distance is actually better. You'll both be too busy to see much of each other anyway. Not everyone can make it work, but I know lots of couples who have.

[minnbills]

Definitely a bit of fear after no one on this boards thinks long distance work, and, in addition, we'd be doing law school AND med school.

This is why I think long distance is actually better. You'll both be too busy to see much of each other anyway. Not everyone can make it work, but I know lots of couples who have.

yeah- hell I had two professors in UG whose families lived halfway across the country.

[tennisking88]

Definitely a bit of fear after no one on this boards thinks long distance work, and, in addition, we'd be doing law school AND med school.

This is why I think long distance is actually better. You'll both be too busy to see much of each other anyway. Not everyone can make it work, but I know lots of couples who have.

This is retarded. Anyone who has ever been in a long distance relationship will tell you it's far worse than being in an actual relationship, to the point where it's not even a relationship, just a series of temporary flings. Being in a long distance relationship for 3+ years is unheard of. But this is a law school forum not a relationship advice forum.

[CanadianWolf]

OP: You present two distinct issues here: one personal & one professional. The answer to each issue is obvious; if you want the relationship to continue, then Tulane is the better choice; if you want the best career options, then the University of Washington is the better choice.