Berkeley versus NYU versus Columbia Forum

[Hermione]

So I am aware that this topic is covered ad nauseum, and I've read most of them, but now I find myself in the same boat, and now I understand the various topics.

I have always wanted to stay in California, and specifically LA. I go to undergrad there, and I love the weather and the atmosphere and the city that pretends to be a city. As such, my first choice has always been Berkeley (probably since I was 12 and I first visited SF, as lame as that sounds.), and I didn't think that I would get in with my grades. When I did get in, I was sure I would go. However, now I'm having second thoughts.

I got into both Columbia and NYU. I'm not a huge fan of NYC, or the cold, to be perfectly honest. However, I would like to do BigLaw. If I knew I wanted to do IP or public interest, the choice would be a lot easier. However, I don't really know what I want to do as of yet. Everything seems really interesting. At the moment, I'm really interested in business litigation, which is obviously a large area, but that's the most I've been able to narrow it down. I have no plans of staying in New York, so BigLaw there doesn't particularly interest me. However, I have been hearing stories on both sides of the fence.

Some people say that you should go to the best ranked school that you get into. Others say you should stay in the region you want to work. I've had people tell me that Berkeley doesn't actually place that well in BigLaw, and some people that tell me the grading system there is actually really helpful.

Opinions? Advice?

[lovejopd]

I am Jelly... Sorry that I do not contribute to your topic

[Hermione]

I am Jelly... Sorry that I do not contribute to your topic

Hey. I totally understand. I feel really snide making this post in the first place. Believe me, I've been in shock every time I got an acceptance. I didn't think I would get into most of the places I applied. I don't even tell anyone at school or any friends that I got into schools, cause I don't wanna piss anyone off. This is pretty much the only place I feel comfortable asking this advice (yay for anonymity on the internets), cause if I asked friends, they would all look at me like I was insane.

[Boggs]

Berkeley is fine for Biglaw. Columbia certainly has an edge, but you should look at geographic placement. Where do you want to be after you graduate? All three schools will place you anywhere in the country, but they probably have advantages in their respective areas.

If you want to be in LA, I think you'd be in just as good a position going to Cal. Plus you'd enjoy the experience more.

[lovejopd]

I am Jelly... Sorry that I do not contribute to your topic

Hey. I totally understand. I feel really snide making this post in the first place. Believe me, I've been in shock every time I got an acceptance. I didn't think I would get into most of the places I applied. I don't even tell anyone at school or any friends that I got into schools, cause I don't wanna piss anyone off. This is pretty much the only place I feel comfortable asking this advice (yay for anonymity on the internets), cause if I asked friends, they would all look at me like I was insane.

Haha, you deserve it, so you don't have to feel bad about telling your friends that you got into awesome schools!
My feeling is that if you choose to study in the east coast, then CLS. If you want to stay in CA, Berkeley. Heard about any scholarship option yet?
(Other guys will help you too)

(NYU<CLS) vs. Berkeley

[lovejopd]

Watching Youtube videos might help. Sorry I am killing my time while studying LSAT

NY/CLS: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UjsXo9l6I8

Berkeley: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ig-rgeXpF8&feature=fvsr

[worldtraveler]

It sounds like you are trying to justify picking Berkeley. There are a fair amount of people who pick Berkeley over NYU or Columbia so you're not alone. I know a lot of people at Berkeley find employment in LA and we get a large number of LA firms. I think you should just attend the admitted students weekend and talk to people about options in LA. It really won't be hard to find people who could tell you about placement.

[UtilityMonster]

Columbia hands down.

[sach1282]

If you want to stay on the west coast, I can't see how you can justify picking NYU/CLS over Berkeley.

Also, if you got into all three of those schools, Berkeley's matching scholarship program seems like it would be a great opportunity to get some extra cash.

[Veyron]

Berkley is shitty for biglaw but only because CA is shitty for biglaw. Vis-a-vis getting a job in LA, all three schools will be roughly equal in their shittyness. If there is no price difference and you are 100% set in staying in CA (by which I mean you'd take asking "would you like fries like that" there over Biglaw in NYC then by all means choose the school you like best.

[dixiecupdrinking]

If you don't want to go to school in NYC, and you don't want to work in NYC, why would you go to CLS or NYU? Life is too short. Get off TLS and go to Berkeley.

[handsonthewheel]

If you're from California, and can make a good argument to firms for why you went out east, I don't think it's that much of a problem for getting jobs back in California. If anything, it's a matter of how many OCI employers are from those offices. I know people at non-Berkeley/Stanford T-14's that are from California and have jobs lined up back in the state.

If you really don't care for New York, go with Berkeley. I, personally, would go to Columbia because it'd be an interesting experience and because I would just want the name on my resume. For jobs, if you only want California, you're probably about on the same ground. However, with Columbia, I would assume you could more easily have a back-up biglaw OCI bidding schedule with New York firms.

[Hermione]

Also, if you got into all three of those schools, Berkeley's matching scholarship program seems like it would be a great opportunity to get some extra cash.

If I don't get money from either school, does Berkeley still consider a matching scholarship program?

Also, the problem is that I'm not dead set against NYU or Columbia. If I was, I wouldn't be posting. I guess my question was merely whether I would be at a disadvantage for BigLaw jobs in California if I was graduating from Berkeley. I do realize that Columbia opens up doors in NYC that wouldn't open for me otherwise, and of course, I am taking that under consideration.

[Shaggier1]

If you were trying to go for NYC biglaw, I would say CLS or NYU; otherwise there is no significant difference between those schools' and Berkeley's ability to place you in BigLaw.

If LA is where you want to be, Berkeley is easily your best bet. I go to Boalt and I got multiple v25 offers in LA without ever having lived there (my only connection to CA at the time of OCI was the year I had just spent there as a 1L)**. I had good grades, but not exceptional grades. I am not sure I could have done that out of CLS/NYU.


**I also had 3 V10 offers is NYC without ever having lived there either. This has less to do with your situation and more to do with me trying to rebut the general (and, in my opinion, misplaced) TLS sentiment that Berkeley students don't do well in BigLaw. A lot of the students who didn't get jobs at OCI were essentially public-interest minded. They applied only to the most elite plaintiffs side firms (Leiff Cabraser, Altshuler Berzon) and didn't bother with mainstream biglaw. So while they technically "struck out" at OCI, they didn't really do OCI in the way that people gunning for BigLaw did.

[johansantana21]

Why is NYU even in this conversation?

[rad lulz]

.

[Guchster]

go to berkeley.

cls isn't as powerful on the west coast as it is here on the east. ignore the rankings for this type of decision.

[071816]

Why is NYU even in this conversation?

I feel a good "HYS CC" vs "HYS CCN" debate coming on...

I was thinking the same thing. Definitely by page two.

[Guchster]

lol at dixie creating alts for the 4 NYU votes.

[Onthebrink]

For what it's worth I have heard both sides of the Berkeley grading system argument from trial attorneys. It seems like it comes down to the philosophy of the partner. Some of then want to see grades and talk about how you did in X class and others could care less. Best of luck Hermione, there really isn't a wrong answer (but try to get all the $$$ you can) and congratulations.

[FlanAl]

can't be of a whole lot of help but just wanted to say that with LA ties it might be good to open up the east coast market by going to school at Columbia. I think the question has to be: any job in California vs. Biglaw regardless of location. Another thing to consider is whether or not you would maybe want to do public interest. A lot of people say they only want to do big law for a few years and then do public interest. A good deal of people doing this get to school and decide that they just want to do PI altogether. Although I'm sure Columbia has great lrap and is good for PI, being plugged into the bay area for that kind of stuff would be a huge advantage.

also if any of these schools do graded legal writing don't go there.

[Redamon1]

Also check out this great TLS thread that compiles recent detailed employment stats from schools as they slowly emerge (CLS data are quite general and hard to read compared to B and N).

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=174447

You'll also find discussion of the "portability" of schools' degrees on page 4.

[Chucky21]

ccn = columbia cornell nyu right?

[bk1]

You have to decide whether biglaw or being in CA is more important to you.

If CA biglaw > NYC biglaw > CA otherlaw --> Columbia/NYU
If CA biglaw > CA otherlaw > NYC biglaw --> Berkeley

[handsonthewheel]

ccn = columbia cornell nyu right?

Columbia Chicago NYU