Stanford at Sticker vs. UT Full Tuition Forum

[1212]

Hello everyone!

I am deciding between Stanford and a full ride at UT. Please help.

-From Texas (my family lives an hour outside of Austin, would love to stay close to them)

-Interested in practicing in Texas though Atlanta and DC are two places I would like to look for employment as well

-Interested in BigLaw and eventually becoming a professor later (not necessarily at t14 or anything, just something more conducive to being a wife/mom) or going in-house.

-Pretty debt adverse and already ~20k in debt from undergrad

Other options include: C,C,N ($),B, D,G

[Bronck]

Stanford 10 times out of 10.

- Stanford will get you to any of those locations. You already have ties to Texas, so no problem there.
- Much better placement into biglaw, academia, clerkships, etc.
- Provide need-based aid.

[splbagel]

If you're serious about academia, Stanford is definitely the way to go.

[Nelson]

I personally would pick Stanford. However, I think given your circumstances and desire to stay in Texas there is a rational case to be made for the full ride at UT.

[arewehavingfunyet]

The fact that you're even considering UT at this point makes me seriously question your decision making ability. The cost difference between Stanford and UT will be made up 10 fold with the opportunity and literal money you will get going to Stanford. You know what, just go to UT.

[bdubs]

If you had to take on debt for undergrad, you will probably qualify for financial aid at Stanford. I would still take Stanford at sticker, but that probably won't be your choice.

[drizzle12]

I would personally pick Stanford in a heartbeat. But I'd say just go where you'd be happiest. Based on what you said above, it seems like Texas would be a great place for you. You'd probably have better opportunities and possibly make more $$ if you attend Stanford, but if you do well at Texas there will still be plenty of opportunities for you.

Visit both schools if you can/haven't already and attend whichever one you feel happiest at.

[Doorkeeper]

From Texas (my family lives an hour outside of Austin, would love to stay close to them)

People seem to be overlooking this part...

[quiver]

I think your decision will/should turn how much weight you give to these two factors:

-From Texas (my family lives an hour outside of Austin, would love to stay close to them)

-Interested in BigLaw and eventually becoming a professor later (not necessarily at t14 or anything, just something more conducive to being a wife/mom) or going in-house

If you value those career aspirations over being close to family, go Stanford. If visa vera, go to UT. Very personal choice here and I think you would be reasonable to choose either one

[vivian3909]

Choose Texas. It's still a T14 and on the off chance that you're part of the half of the law school graduates who can't find a law job, at least you're not heavy in debt. I am choosing law schools too and am hoping to stay close to the fam as well.

[cutecarmel]

OMG. University of Texas? Isn't that a Top 15 school? There is no reason in hell that you should be that concerned about prestige. Debt free at a top 15 school vs 100k in debt at a higher ranked top 15 school? No brainer. UT 100%. You're going to get a good job and your not going to have debt up your ass to get it.

[crit_racer]

I was born and raised in Austin and go to UT. If I had the chance to go to Stanford, I would have in a heart beat. You are basically guaranteed a job in Austin (or anywhere else) w/ an SLS degree. At UT, from what I can gather, you have to do pretty well to land Austin. Try to think long term...Stanford is the right choice.

[071816]

Anyone who even considers UT in this situation is smoking drugs.

[Transferthrowaway]

This exact either/or was played out in a thread last year, with a lot of the same personal considerations. The person waffled for multiple pages before finally deciding that Stanford was tcr. Follow that poster's lead.

[HeavenWood]

OMG. University of Texas? Isn't that a Top 15 school? There is no reason in hell that you should be that concerned about prestige. Debt free at a top 15 school vs 100k in debt at a higher ranked top 15 school? No brainer. UT 100%. You're going to get a good job and your not going to have debt up your ass to get it.

If you want to work in academia, Stanford is leaps and bounds better than Texas. The difference in employment prospects for firm jobs is somewhat smaller, but the Stanford name gives you one hell of a cushion (hint: if worse came to worst, where would you rather be in the bottom quarter?). Whether you get a big firm job or an LRAP-eligible position, you won't have much of an issue paying off the debt. Also, 20k in UG debt is nothing.

If the alternative were CCN at sticker, I would definitely say Texas, but Stanford is Stanford.

[nonprofit-prophet]

Anyone that thinks this is an easy decision likely has little experience with legal employment. The whole "you'll make up the tuition difference through your employment post-Stanford" is a terrible argument. Cali and DC COL is so terrible compared to Texas that even if you found a firm that paid considerably higher bonuses than Texas firms (since base pay is the same), you'd still probably be behind Texas big law lawyers. And in terms of ATL, most firms don't pay market. Overall, the degree just gets you in the door, after that you need to create your own success at work; and with all big law jobs starting at 160, you have to decide how much extra prestige is worth to you.

With that in mind, zero debt at UT would be my choice. You'll have the same salary with no debt, and you're happy with being in Texas. However, if you decide that you have to have academia, than Stanford is probably the right call.


edit: also, the whole "where would you rather be bottom 1/3rd at" argument is dumb. OP, id bet money that you'd finish well above median. To put it nicely, the median people did not have the option of attending stanford.

[crit_racer]

Anyone that thinks this is an easy decision likely has little experience with legal employment. The whole "you'll make up the tuition difference through your employment post-Stanford" is a terrible argument. Cali and DC COL is so terrible compared to Texas that even if you found a firm that paid considerably higher bonuses than Texas firms (since base pay is the same), you'd still probably be behind Texas big law lawyers. And in terms of ATL, most firms don't pay market. Overall, the degree just gets you in the door, after that you need to create your own success at work; and with all big law jobs starting at 160, you have to decide how much extra prestige is worth to you.

With that in mind, zero debt at UT would be my choice. You'll have the same salary with no debt, and you're happy with being in Texas. However, if you decide that you have to have academia, than Stanford is probably the right call.


edit: also, the whole "where would you rather be bottom 1/3rd at" argument is dumb. OP, id bet money that you'd finish well above median. To put it nicely, the median people did not have the option of attending stanford.

youre assuming that he/she will get a biglaw job after going to UT, which is far from certain. Stanford basically guarantees a good job...UT does not. There aren't many guarantees in life, let alone in the legal profession. I don't know how someone could turn down SLS. Stanford will be much better for any kind of job in any location (including Austin).

[HeavenWood]

edit: also, the whole "where would you rather be bottom 1/3rd at" argument is dumb. OP, id bet money that you'd finish well above median. To put it nicely, the median people did not have the option of attending stanford.

It's not dumb... at all. I know people who got Levys who are bottom 1/3. I know people who snuck in off the waitlist who are top quarter. When you have a comparatively narrow LSAT/GPA range, scoring differences really don't matter that much. You should never go to any school counting on being at the top of class.

[bk1]

edit: also, the whole "where would you rather be bottom 1/3rd at" argument is dumb. OP, id bet money that you'd finish well above median. To put it nicely, the median people did not have the option of attending stanford.

It's not dumb... at all. I know people who got Levys who are bottom 1/3. I know people who snuck in off the waitlist who are top quarter. When you have a comparatively narrow LSAT/GPA range, scoring differences really don't matter that much. You should never go to any school counting on being at the top of class.

+1

[romothesavior]

OMG. University of Texas? Isn't that a Top 15 school? There is no reason in hell that you should be that concerned about prestige. Debt free at a top 15 school vs 100k in debt at a higher ranked top 15 school? No brainer. UT 100%. You're going to get a good job and your not going to have debt up your ass to get it.

No. This has nothing to do with prestige. I agree that there can be a rational argument made for UT if staying close to family is the key, but for career prospects, Stanford wins.

Just about everyone at Stanford will get a damn good legal job, and it has great national reach. It isn't about "prestige." It's about job opportunities. OP's career will likely be significantly better with a Stanford degree, she is more or less guaranteed a biglaw job if she wants it, she will have little problem getting back to Texas with a Stanford degree, and there will be an opportunity for academia that just won't be there at UT.

If being close to family is that important, then UT for free is a fine decision. You'll probably have a good outcome. But as far as objective opportunities go, Stanford by a mile.

[bdubs]

edit: also, the whole "where would you rather be bottom 1/3rd at" argument is dumb. OP, id bet money that you'd finish well above median. To put it nicely, the median people did not have the option of attending stanford.

It's not dumb... at all. I know people who got Levys who are bottom 1/3. I know people who snuck in off the waitlist who are top quarter. When you have a comparatively narrow LSAT/GPA range, scoring differences really don't matter that much. You should never go to any school counting on being at the top of class.

Your ability to get a 4.0 in undergrad is not a great predictor of getting a good LS GPA. Everyone on here likes to comment that you can't know whether you'll be good at law school, I highly disagree with that. I do agree that many people's ability to accurately reflect on their own strengths and weaknesses is pretty poor, but if you know people who are in a good position to gauge your ability to succeed in LS I think they can help you make an accurate assessment of generally how well you will do.

If unsure, choose Stanford. If significant financial aid is offered, choose Stanford. Otherwise choose based on location and career preference (TX Corporate = UT, Anywhere else, Academic = Stanford)

[bk1]

Everyone on here likes to comment that you can't know whether you'll be good at law school, I highly disagree with that. I do agree that many people's ability to accurately reflect on their own strengths and weaknesses is pretty poor, but if you know people who are in a good position to gauge your ability to succeed in LS I think they can help you make an accurate assessment of generally how well you will do.

I'm curious, what kind of people are you referring to with the bolded?

[crit_racer]

(TX Corporate = UT, Anywhere else, Academic = Stanford)

No, just no. Stanford>>>>>UT for TX biglaw (and everything else).

[kalvano]

I don't think the general wisdom that your school matters less once you've started working applies to HYS. Regardless of what you want to do in life, Stanford will always open doors that might otherwise be closed, even if you are very successful at UT.

[bdubs]

Everyone on here likes to comment that you can't know whether you'll be good at law school, I highly disagree with that. I do agree that many people's ability to accurately reflect on their own strengths and weaknesses is pretty poor, but if you know people who are in a good position to gauge your ability to succeed in LS I think they can help you make an accurate assessment of generally how well you will do.

I'm curious, what kind of people are you referring to with the bolded?

People who have taught either in law schools or in other rigorous academic disciplines that use similar evaluation methods. Some undergrads may get exposure to these people, others may get it in a professional setting.