ff Forum

[deebo12]

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[ryemanhattan]

I would go with the GG full ride. Santa Clara at sticker is not worth it under any situation. Of my two friends who went to GG, one is working in the field she wanted to, the other transferred to Berkeley. Small sample size, so don't read into it too much. Look at the total costs of the degree... if USF will cost you $50k more than GG, don't even think about it. $25k... maybe.

[ilovesf]

can't answer without knowing your numbers, but none of those three options are very good. Also, there are a lot of GGU transfers at Hastings, but you should never, NEVER go to a school with the hopes of transferring. I believe I read somewhere online that for GGU, 3.0 is top 30%. That is an AWFUL stip, and you have a good chance of losing your scholarship.

[Grizz]

The tentative plan is to seriously weigh GGU - I'm working, I can already help pay for some law school, but if it's free and ABA accredited, who cares.

Well, legal employers. Or more specifically, they won't care, as they bin your resume. Welcome to the new economy.

[deebo12]

f

[deebo12]

The tentative plan is to seriously weigh GGU - I'm working, I can already help pay for some law school, but if it's free and ABA accredited, who cares.

Well, legal employers. Or more specifically, they won't care, as they bin your resume. Welcome to the new economy.

Yeah, reading further into what I wrote will reveal that I may be able to use the degree at my current job. I have contacts already in a law firm that I file clerked at, as well, and various alum contacts of GGU, Fordham, SCU, and even one Boalt guy who favors me I think.

Starting from 0, sure it's tough to have a low-ranked school law degree. But in my *work* experience in the professional world, once you're working, it comes down to how good you are at your job and who you know.

[deebo12]

I would go with the GG full ride. Santa Clara at sticker is not worth it under any situation. Of my two friends who went to GG, one is working in the field she wanted to, the other transferred to Berkeley. Small sample size, so don't read into it too much. Look at the total costs of the degree... if USF will cost you $50k more than GG, don't even think about it. $25k... maybe.

At USF it's 29k-16k first year = 13k, and some chipped away because of money from work. Then 8k a year after that, with 3.2 stip. This may include other scholarships earned while there.

[Bronck]

Yeah, these aren't very good options.... but maybe do GGU and then if you lose the scholarship due to stipulations, drop out?

[Grizz]

Yeah, reading further into what I wrote will reveal that I may be able to use the degree at my current job. I have contacts already in a law firm that I file clerked at, as well, and various alum contacts of GGU, Fordham, SCU, and even one Boalt guy who favors me I think.

Starting from 0, sure it's tough to have a low-ranked school law degree. But in my *work* experience in the professional world, once you're working, it comes down to how good you are at your job and who you know.

You're not the only one with a network. But if you can 100% come back to your current job, go to GGU. If not, retake or don't go. I seriously suggest you look at the salary information on Law School Transparency for these schools. Then remember that it's even worse now than what you see on those graphs, because most of them are from 2009.

USF and Santa Clara are objectively not worth the cost. But remember that even if you go to GGU, the chances are better than a coin flip that you end up paying full tuition. Which would objectively suck. So keep that in mind.

[deebo12]

Yeah, these aren't very good options.... but maybe do GGU and then if you lose the scholarship due to stipulations, drop out?

That seems reasonable. Nothing but time lost, and even some credits gained. Although, not sure if it's possible to begin law with some credit already earned or if you have to begin at 0.

[smelltheglove]

None of the above. Seriously.

[timbs4339]

I'd say GGU, with the huge caveat that you need to be absolutely 100% sure you will drop out if you lose the scholarship. Spending ANY money on GGU right now is just not worth it especially if you currently have a job.

The trouble from any of these schools is going to be getting that first job that will allow you to prove yourself. A significant portion of the class will be unemployed, working for free, working non-law retail jobs, or working temp or part-time jobs. Even then your first job will immediately close a lot of doors (for example, unless your first job is a biglaw job, biglaw is effectively closed to you unless you get a federal clerkship or a job with the DOJ, SEC, etc that are more competitive than biglaw).

How old were the GGU grads who you met who had good jobs?

[ilovesf]

can't answer without knowing your numbers,

addressed this at the end of my post.

sorry, didn't realize since you didn't type it out in numbers. Have you thought about staying at your job for another year and retaking? A couple point bump would change A LOT for you. Also, sure, some GGU grads get jobs. My stepdad went to GGU... in the 70s. He was a partner at a firm and is now solo. You can't really compare pre-ITE and ITE job anecdotes though.

[deebo12]

GGU grads I know graduated during the '00s.

[jarofsoup]

USF or SCU. GGU is looked down upon in the bay atleast USF and SCU has some sort of regional presence.

[bk1]

All 3 schools are objectively terrible and expensive. GGU is also far worse than the already awful USF/SCU. Coming out of these schools you will have less than a 50% shot at getting a full time job as a lawyer, heck more likely a 25-30% shot (check out the job data section on http://www.lawschooltransparency.com). You really only have a few options:

1. Go to GGU, drop out if you don't do well (you need to be willing to make this hard choice). The problem with this is that you have a very high chance of not doing well and you will have wasted a year or more of your life trying and getting nowhere. And in the end, since you have a high chance of dropping out, you aren't even likely to be a lawyer coming out of GGU (or USF/SCU for that matter, but paying for any of these schools is a horrible idea).

2a. Retake the LSAT. If you can get into the upper 160's or better, the schools that are open to you will be infinitely better than the 3 you are considering. You might be at least able to swing UCI/UCD/UCH. Granted those schools at sticker are insanely risky, but at least you have a decent shot (2/3+) at being a full time lawyer. I would honestly say that your chances of doing better on the LSAT are likely higher than your chances of being a full time lawyer coming out of your 3 current options.

2b. Retake the LSAT and consider schools elsewhere. The Bay Area (and all of CA to a lesser extent) legal market sucks and UCD/UCH suffer accordingly. Looking at LST they barely put 2/3 of their grads into full time jobs as lawyers. If you can do better, you can get into decent schools in other areas that would give you decent scholarships (e.g. Illinois/WUSTL/Minnesota/Iowa/IUB/etc). The sad fact of the matter is, if you really want to be a lawyer you will likely have to be flexible in where you are okay with going to school and working after graduation. Alternatively you might also be able to get into a decent part time program (e.g. Fordham/GW) even without scholarship you could work your way through school to help minimize the debt.

[Grizz]

GGU grads I know graduated during the '00s.

'00s is ancient history

[deebo12]

Thanks all for the input, I'll take it into consideration!

[20160810]

a JD from GGU is a professional death sentence in the Bay Area. The other two schools are mediocre, but the scholarship from USF makes it worth considering I suppose (I've met some amazing lawyers who went to USF, but the reality in the new economy is that unless you're in the top-5% there you don't have a prayer at getting a good job, and there is a 95% chance you'll fail to be in the top-5%).

In all honesty, if this were me, I'd retake and reapply. Your options at this point aren't good, and connections at a firm you file clerked for aren't going to cut the mustard when you're coming to them hat in hand with median grades from a dog-shit law school like GGU.

But since nobody wants to hear retake/reapply, here's my 2 cents: Take the money from GGU, keep your living expenses as low as possible (seriously, sleep on a couch in the Tenderloin if you have to, but do not borrow money if you have the savings to eek out a year of cheap living, which is hard but not impossible in the City), and if you end the first semester outside the top-10%, drop out, retake, and reapply. If you end up with good grades, transfer to Davis or Hastings (or Cal/UCLA if that's possible, but I don't think they take a lot of transfers from GGU, if any). DO NOT TAKE YOUR JD FROM GGU!

[romothesavior]

In all honesty, if this were me, I'd retake and reapply. Your options at this point aren't good, and connections at a firm you file clerked for aren't going to cut the mustard when you're coming to them hat in hand with median grades from a dog-shit law school like GGU.

Yeah this. Tons of people "know people" or even worked at a firm before law school, but it doesn't mean much if you have a terrible degree and non-elite grades.

[jarofsoup]

If you have a back ground in science. Specifically if you majored in electrical engineering SCU would be a good option over the others. (If you are debt adverse it wouldn't)

I would not go to GGU for a windfall.

[LawperaMan]

GGU has some of the worst scholarship stipulations out there.