Make my decision for me TLS Forum

[cool of law]

So I put up a poll a week ago, but accidentally made it end early. I have been offered $20,000 to Arizona (non-resident) and nothing from UC Davis (just got off the WL)

Arizona: Cheaper, already committed, smaller class size, not in the horrrible CA job market, solid long time T1, already signed a lease, this may be dumb but easier to be near the top of my class (?)

Davis: Higher ranking, in California (I'm a resident and would like to stay here if I could get a job), the school is close to the Capitol.

Is Davis much better for socal?

[bk1]

Davis is far far far far better for all of CA, so if you want CA then it is a pretty easy choice.

That being said sticker at Davis is almost two hundred thousand dollars and that is way too risky. If you really want CA I would retake and reapply.

[cool of law]

Thanks BK,

Question: Would it be bad to choose U of A even if I'm not suuuper amped on working in Arizona. I read an article that Arizona has the 26th biggest lawyer surplus which is way better than 2nd (for CA). I feel committed to Arizona, have already signed a lease and formed connections. I'd totally be up for working in Arizona, not thrilled about it, but better than being unemployed in CA. I just feel like Davis is rising higher and higher.

[bk1]

Firstly while Davis' rankings are rising higher and higher, that doesn't mean they are any better of a school than they used to be. Davis is still a peer of Hastings despite the gap of 20 places in ranking. Davis still only places about 60-70% of its grads into full time lawyer jobs (whereas it is more like 70-80% at Arizona). I think their prospects are fairly comparable. You'll have a higher shot at any legal employment coming from Arizona but you'll have a better shot at high paying employment coming from Davis.

Is it 20k/year from Arizona or 20k total? If it's 20k total I think Arizona is still really risky (160k debt) compared to Davis (180k debt) and at that cost it is a nobrainer to take Davis if you want CA (but I would really counsel that you should go to neither of them). If it's 20k/year then Arizona begins to be slightly reasonable in terms of costs (120k debt) and at that point you should go to Arizona because it will be far far easier to pay back your debt than it would be at Davis.

If you really want CA or your Arizona scholarship is 20k total then I think that retake/reapply is the best bet. If your Arizona scholarship is 20k/year I'd say take that if you are okay with working in Arizona though it is still more expensive than it should be.

[cool of law]

It is 20k/year no stips

[bk1]

It is 20k/year no stips

If you're okay with AZ then Arizona. Though if you want to try for CA still you can always retake/reapply and at worst you will have the same options next cycle.

[cool of law]

I'm OK with Arizona. Where are you headed in the Fall?

[cool of law]

Anyone else care to weigh in on how they voted?

[snapdragon]

I voted Arizona, because you're OK with AZ and UCD at sticker would probably be too risky for my tastes.

[robotclubmember]

if you're ok with a 1/3 chance of not having a job, a 1/3 chance of having a shit job that pays what you could get looking for work now, and a 1/3 chance of finding employment you may be satisfied with coupled with a 100% chance of close to a quarter mil in debt, go wherever you want, either school will work for you. i hear california has a booming economy and is desperately lacking in available lawyers, so i would try UC first.

[legalmindedfella]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you have another thread that explains you deferred at Arizona and just now got off the waitlist at UC-Davis? This isn't a cut-and-dry decision, this is Davis + clear lifetime risk for ethics complaints.

Edit: Thread for reference is here - http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=159587

[cool of law]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you have another thread that explains you deferred at Arizona and just now got off the waitlist at UC-Davis? This isn't a cut-and-dry decision, this is Davis + clear lifetime risk for ethics complaints.

Edit: Thread for reference is here - http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=159587

haha, different person

[cool of law]

if you're ok with a 1/3 chance of not having a job, a 1/3 chance of having a shit job that pays what you could get looking for work now, and a 1/3 chance of finding employment you may be satisfied with coupled with a 100% chance of close to a quarter mil in debt, go wherever you want, either school will work for you. i hear california has a booming economy and is desperately lacking in available lawyers, so i would try UC first.

Is this referring to Arizona or Davis in particular? The last sentence would imply Davis? Or both?

[LilGuy]

Bear Down!!

I'm currently an undergraduate at the U of A. The women are beautiful, the weather is great, and the rent is cheap. Tucson is kind of a ghetto armpit of a city. But as long as you don't go more than two miles from the campus on the north and east sides and one mile on the west and south sides, it's really O.K. I assume you've checked it out already, but if you need any info, feel free to ask me.

[robotclubmember]

if you're ok with a 1/3 chance of not having a job, a 1/3 chance of having a shit job that pays what you could get looking for work now, and a 1/3 chance of finding employment you may be satisfied with coupled with a 100% chance of close to a quarter mil in debt, go wherever you want, either school will work for you. i hear california has a booming economy and is desperately lacking in available lawyers, so i would try UC first.

Is this referring to Arizona or Davis in particular? The last sentence would imply Davis? Or both?

the last sentence was sarcasm. california legal market = lulz fest

[071816]

if you're ok with a 1/3 chance of not having a job, a 1/3 chance of having a shit job that pays what you could get looking for work now, and a 1/3 chance of finding employment you may be satisfied with coupled with a 100% chance of close to a quarter mil in debt, go wherever you want, either school will work for you. i hear california has a booming economy and is desperately lacking in available lawyers, so i would try UC first.

Is this referring to Arizona or Davis in particular? The last sentence would imply Davis? Or both?

the last sentence was sarcasm. california legal market = lulz fest

The bay area's legal market seems to be a lulz fest. LA isn't that much worse than a lot of other markets. Hell, you could call just about every market a "lulz fest" in comparison to how they were 10 years ago.

[cool of law]

if you're ok with a 1/3 chance of not having a job, a 1/3 chance of having a shit job that pays what you could get looking for work now, and a 1/3 chance of finding employment you may be satisfied with coupled with a 100% chance of close to a quarter mil in debt, go wherever you want, either school will work for you. i hear california has a booming economy and is desperately lacking in available lawyers, so i would try UC first.

Is this referring to Arizona or Davis in particular? The last sentence would imply Davis? Or both?

the last sentence was sarcasm. california legal market = lulz fest

The bay area's legal market seems to be a lulz fest. LA isn't that much worse than a lot of other markets. Hell, you could call just about every market a "lulz fest" in comparison to how they were 10 years ago.

Any insight on the AZ market? I keep going back and forth on the decision.

[fingersxd]

Go to Arizona. Job prospects are reasonably comparable and you will come out with WAY less debt.

Also, you should ask Davis for $ and when they say "no", you should ask how much they intend to raise their tuition the next few years. Even for in-state the numbers at other CA state schools weren't pretty.

[cool of law]

Should any weight be given to long-term benefits of going to a higher ranked school? I know after your first job, it really doesn't matter where you went to school (assuming you have a good first job, and your school wasnt HYS)...but does it?

I was talking to a family friend who is an attorney and he mentions he always looks where opposing counsel went to school, then again , I'm sure it doesn't help him win cases any easier.

At this moment, I am leaning AZ, but I had a similar decision in undergrad and ended up going to the more prestigious school and I believe it has along me along the way...i dunno, just thinking

[jwmalone87]

Has Davis still not gotten back to you regarding financial aid? They don't give large merit amounts but they do with need-based. If you get $ (or if the financials don't matter), I think you should come to Davis based on how much more the geography appeals to you. If not, I'd probably balk.

[cool of law]

I just noticed that the $41,100 tuition figure from UC Davis was last year's, this year i believe it is over $45,000 and surely rising. I did notice that they have an outstanding LRAP program.

[SchopenhauerFTW]

if you're ok with a 1/3 chance of not having a job, a 1/3 chance of having a shit job that pays what you could get looking for work now, and a 1/3 chance of finding employment you may be satisfied with coupled with a 100% chance of close to a quarter mil in debt, go wherever you want, either school will work for you. i hear california has a booming economy and is desperately lacking in available lawyers, so i would try UC first.

Is this referring to Arizona or Davis in particular? The last sentence would imply Davis? Or both?

the last sentence was sarcasm. california legal market = lulz fest

It was off the charts.

[fingersxd]

I just noticed that the $41,100 tuition figure from UC Davis was last year's, this year i believe it is over $45,000 and surely rising. I did notice that they have an outstanding LRAP program.

Ask them. Your CoA is probably mroe at UC Davis than you calculated.

[SchopenhauerFTW]

Bear Down!!

I'm currently an undergraduate at the U of A. The women are beautiful, the weather is great, and the rent is cheap. Tucson is kind of a ghetto armpit of a city. But as long as you don't go more than two miles from the campus on the north and east sides and one mile on the west and south sides, it's really O.K. I assume you've checked it out already, but if you need any info, feel free to ask me.

[SchopenhauerFTW]

The bay area's legal market seems to be a lulz fest. LA isn't that much worse than a lot of other markets. Hell, you could call just about every market a "lulz fest" in comparison to how they were 10 years ago.

True, but California is still lulzier than most. I remember when things started slowing down in the summer of 2008 and hearing people say that it would get better that fall. Nope.jpg. And yet I can't stop myself from enrolling in a California school.

I voted UC Davis btw.