Emory $$ vs. UC Irvine $$ Forum

[Metaread]

This decision is fairly urgent, as UCI's housing deadline is May 2nd. UCI is giving me a 40% merit scholarship, Emory close to 33% (at 45k over 3 years). Total COA is higher at Emory, but that's including the exorbitant Living expenses that they have listed on the Emory law website.

Monetary calculations.
Emory (taken from Emory Law website)
Fixed Costs

Tuition: $44,600
Fees: $498
Total: $45,098

Estimated Expenses (Costs may vary based on my choices)

Living Expenses: $18,602
Books: $2,000
Health Insurance: $2,360
Parking: $660
Loan Fees: $676
Total $24,298

Estimated costs for one year at Emory: $69,396 - 15,000 -5,000 for overest. living costs = $49,396 p/year

UC Irvine (taken from UCI Law website)
Student Services Fee: $972.00
Tuition: $10,152.00
Professional Degree Supplemental Tuition $29,404.00
Assoc. Grad Students Fee $27.00
Student Center Fee $409.50
Bren Events Center Fee $69.00
Recreation Center Fee $264.00
Student Health Insurance $1,982.00
Nonresident Supplemental Tuition $12,245.00
Professional Degree Supplemental Tuition Differential -2,400.00
Total California Nonresident Annual: $ 53,124.50 x 0.6 = 31,874.70 p/year

2011-2012 Estimated Nine-Month UCI Law Student Budget

Living On Campus (Verano)
Housing/Living $10, 845
Travel $2,471
Personal $2,354
Law Books $1,955
Total : $17,625

Living Off Campus (Vista del Campo, Puerta del Sol, etc)
Total: $24,004

Est. costs for one year at UCI: 31,874 + 17,625 = $49,499.70 p/year

Sum Total:
est. Emory 49,396 p/year
est. UC Irvine Non-Resident 49,499.70 p/year (prob. higher as the law school's official living expenses estimate is considered to be unrealistic)

Other details:
-I have no real preference where I practice law.
-I am aiming for Big Law, I am fully aware how little chance I have of making it.
-I am on the waitlists for several other schools, including BU (my top choice at the moment).
-I do not want to retake the LSAT, I got a 170 average on my practice tests and my actual LSAT score was slightly below that, I am satisfied. My GPA is 3.4 and there's no way to change that short of attending grad school. I could seek employment and reapply, but at this point in time I'd rather take what I have and run with it. The only real advantage I'd have in reapplying is that I could get a chance to send in my apps earlier (applied in early November 2010), rewrite my personal statement, etc and put in an early decision to GW/BU or something.

At the moment it seems to be a question of risk with possibly good but uncertain payoff (UCI) or you know what you're getting and it's ok/good but not great (Emory). If you still think I should reapply, please let me know.

[Aberzombie1892]

There is a realistic chance that you would regret either.

Would you rather regret it in CA or regret it in GA? Neither is worth the type of debt you will be taking on and odds are you won't making a ton of money right out.

[weejonbu]

This may be the most detailed CoA comparison I've ever seen posted.

[scammedhard]

Where do you live? What is your state of residence?

[Metaread]

I am an American citizen but don't live in either Georgia or California. Still unsure which state I'd prefer, as I haven't had the chance to visit either.

[ballpop]

There is no way CoA is anything like that. The average rent in OC is 1600+ a month. Rent in Atlanta is dirt cheap.

[scammedhard]

I guess that if I have to, I'd go to Emory, but it just seems to expensive for my taste.
Your low GPA is killing you here. Did you apply to WUSTL?

[Metaread]

Yeah, I heard that Emory's living expenses estimate is too high, not sure how much lower it would be though. Similarly I'm not sure how much higher OC rent would be...1600 may be the average, but I've seen some going as low as 800 p/month as well. =\

I didn't apply to WUSTL, as I thought I wouldn't really have a chance. I've been waitlisted at schools below it in average GPA and LSAT scores so....*shrug*

[Mickey Quicknumbers]

Yeah, I heard that Emory's living expenses estimate is too high, not sure how much lower it would be though. Similarly I'm not sure how much higher OC rent would be...1600 may be the average, but I've seen some going as low as 800 p/month as well. =\

I didn't apply to WUSTL, as I thought I wouldn't really have a chance. I've been waitlisted at schools below it in average GPA and LSAT scores so....*shrug*

FWIW, I was about 8k under this year for Emory, but I also have rent cheaper than pretty much everyone I know. I think 5k a year below expected COA is the norm.

[Grizz]

There is a realistic chance that you would regret either.

Would you rather regret it in CA or regret it in GA? Neither is worth the type of debt you will be taking on and odds are you won't making a ton of money right out.

This.

[Metaread]

5k under, ok, I'll add that to the estimations. Thanks Mickey Quicknumbers!

Since people are saying neither Emory nor UC Irvine would be worth it....what would you recommend I do instead? I feel like I'm out of options at this point, even I know that's not truly the case. I live overseas and do not speak the language here fluently (yet), moreover I would only be able to get a low-paying job here if I did apply and if I was fluent. Going back to the States would mean I'd pretty much be on my own. Very few family members live in the States right now who I get along with, I have no cousins or siblings there who could help me find a job etc. Aiming to find a job by myself in this economy hasn't worked out well so far. I was offered internships at several places, but I asked for paid internships, they said they could only offer unpaid positions as their paid positions were "filled already." I could go to grad school, but that's time spent studying for another standardized test and getting new recommendations (from professors who in a year's time won't be as familiar with what I wrote for their classes or said to them). Plus, people say grad school barely pays out either.

If I did go to Emory or UC Irvine and I placed squarely on the median, how much would I make (est.)? I hear that the amount one makes per year drops sharply, so that more than half the class is making 40-60, and a tiny proportion making close to 100-160k.

[Blindmelon]

Isn't UCI only provisionally accredited so you can't take the bar outside CA? I think UCI sticks you in CA no matter what, so I'd be warry (please verify this someone),

[firemed]

Do you have GPA stipulations at one or both? That effects my vote.

[firemed]

Isn't UCI only provisionally accredited so you can't take the bar outside CA? I think UCI sticks you in CA no matter what, so I'd be warry (please verify this someone),

I do not believe this is true. I believe you are allowed to take the bar anywhere after UCI graduation.

[Grizz]

5k under, ok, I'll add that to the estimations. Thanks Mickey Quicknumbers!

Since people are saying neither Emory nor UC Irvine would be worth it....what would you recommend I do instead? I feel like I'm out of options at this point, even I know that's not truly the case. I live overseas and do not speak the language here fluently (yet), moreover I would only be able to get a low-paying job here if I did apply and if I was fluent. Going back to the States would mean I'd pretty much be on my own. Very few family members live in the States right now who I get along with, I have no cousins or siblings there who could help me find a job etc. Aiming to find a job by myself in this economy hasn't worked out well so far. I was offered internships at several places, but I asked for paid internships, they said they could only offer unpaid positions as their paid positions were "filled already." I could go to grad school, but that's time spent studying for another standardized test and getting new recommendations (from professors who in a year's time won't be as familiar with what I wrote for their classes or said to them). Plus, people say grad school barely pays out either.

If I did go to Emory or UC Irvine and I placed squarely on the median, how much would I make (est.)? I hear that the amount one makes per year drops sharply, so that more than half the class is making 40-60, and a tiny proportion making close to 100-160k.

Don't go to law school if you're not fluent in English.

[crit_racer]

5k under, ok, I'll add that to the estimations. Thanks Mickey Quicknumbers!

Since people are saying neither Emory nor UC Irvine would be worth it....what would you recommend I do instead? I feel like I'm out of options at this point, even I know that's not truly the case. I live overseas and do not speak the language here fluently (yet), moreover I would only be able to get a low-paying job here if I did apply and if I was fluent. Going back to the States would mean I'd pretty much be on my own. Very few family members live in the States right now who I get along with, I have no cousins or siblings there who could help me find a job etc. Aiming to find a job by myself in this economy hasn't worked out well so far. I was offered internships at several places, but I asked for paid internships, they said they could only offer unpaid positions as their paid positions were "filled already." I could go to grad school, but that's time spent studying for another standardized test and getting new recommendations (from professors who in a year's time won't be as familiar with what I wrote for their classes or said to them). Plus, people say grad school barely pays out either.

If I did go to Emory or UC Irvine and I placed squarely on the median, how much would I make (est.)? I hear that the amount one makes per year drops sharply, so that more than half the class is making 40-60, and a tiny proportion making close to 100-160k.

Don't go to law school if you're not fluent in English.

[firemed]

Don't go to law school if you're not fluent in English.

I would normally agree with this... but the OP seems to have a better grasp on the language than many of the posters here. Also, if OP wasn't fluent, how the heck did he/she get almost a 170. I think OP might not be giving him/herself enough credit.

[spets]

5k under, ok, I'll add that to the estimations. Thanks Mickey Quicknumbers!

Since people are saying neither Emory nor UC Irvine would be worth it....what would you recommend I do instead? I feel like I'm out of options at this point, even I know that's not truly the case. I live overseas and do not speak the language here fluently (yet), moreover I would only be able to get a low-paying job here if I did apply and if I was fluent. Going back to the States would mean I'd pretty much be on my own. Very few family members live in the States right now who I get along with, I have no cousins or siblings there who could help me find a job etc. Aiming to find a job by myself in this economy hasn't worked out well so far. I was offered internships at several places, but I asked for paid internships, they said they could only offer unpaid positions as their paid positions were "filled already." I could go to grad school, but that's time spent studying for another standardized test and getting new recommendations (from professors who in a year's time won't be as familiar with what I wrote for their classes or said to them). Plus, people say grad school barely pays out either.

If I did go to Emory or UC Irvine and I placed squarely on the median, how much would I make (est.)? I hear that the amount one makes per year drops sharply, so that more than half the class is making 40-60, and a tiny proportion making close to 100-160k.

Don't go to law school if you're not fluent in English.

I'm pretty sure he's living overseas right now, and he's not fluent in the language of whatever foreign country he lives in. So he's saying it would be difficult for him to take a year off and procure a job (whether in the States or abroad).

[firemed]

I'm pretty sure he's living overseas right now, and he's not fluent in the language of whatever foreign country he lives in. So he's saying it would be difficult for him to take a year off and procure a job (whether in the States or abroad).

Wow... I just re-read, and you are totally right. RC fail on three people's part, including me. Herp Derp.

[Grizz]

I'm pretty sure he's living overseas right now, and he's not fluent in the language of whatever foreign country he lives in. So he's saying it would be difficult for him to take a year off and procure a job (whether in the States or abroad).

Wow... I just re-read, and you are totally right. RC fail on three people's part, including me. Herp Derp.

I assumed he was here in the US writing his post but normally lives overseas. Oops.

[Metaread]

Both schools say that I can keep the scholarship every year if I "remain in good standing". I think that means I have to maintain a 2.0 GPA and not be kicked out. Not certain though.

To clear up all the confusion, haha: I am living overseas right now, not fluent in the language they use here. I am fluent in English, however, as my opening post (hopefully) demonstrated.

[ViP]

Isn't UCI only provisionally accredited so you can't take the bar outside CA? I think UCI sticks you in CA no matter what, so I'd be warry (please verify this someone),

No, provisional accreditation means you can take the bar anywhere in the country. It carries literally all the implications of full accreditation aside from the official title. You have to "earn" the title by operating adequately at provisional level for a few years.