Which for business and corporate law? Forum

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:26 pm

Temple, Penn State, Pitt, Miami.

I'm a Temple undergrad and I've had about enough of the campus. It's a dreary miserable place most days, and I was told by a Law professor that they don't tend to place graduates in the corporate setting.

Penn State is giving me 15k a year. Everything I've read seemed good except that the median starting salary is 60,000. Compared to the other schools thats very low. And it's in the middle of nowhere. I'm also considering a jd/mba and Smeal is a very good business school.

Pitt from what I've read its hard to focus on corporate law at Pitt. Again if I go for jd/mba that may not be an issue, and theyre offering 12k.

Miami I don't know if the novelty of Miami itself is affecting my perception of the school. Class sizes are huge, they accept most people that apply. I don't know how good of a school it could really be.

TheFactor · Post by **TheFactor** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:43 pm

I hope for your sake that you are a flame.

dpk711 · Post by **dpk711** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:44 pm

TheFactor wrote:I hope for your sake that you are a flame.

TITCR

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:59 pm

not hip to forum lingo

TheFactor · Post by **TheFactor** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:00 pm

Uh oh...

d34d9823 · Post by **d34d9823** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:02 pm

d9138c wrote:not hip to forum lingo

They are hoping you are making shit up because the chances of you getting a firm job from any of those schools are <20%.

mst · Post by **mst** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:02 pm

If you are not a flame:

Sorry, don't mean to be mean. But there is no correct response. Your only hope for corporate law realistically out of any of these places is to be top 2-5% after 1L, transfer to a t10 after a year, and interview well at OCI. Otherwise, there's a good chance you'll be enjoying funemployment or shitlaw for the rest of your (possibly non-existent) legal career from any of those schools.

A large portion of those classes end up unemployed. 60k would be a dream to them.

MrPapagiorgio · Post by **MrPapagiorgio** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:06 pm

d34dluk3 wrote:
d9138c wrote:not hip to forum lingo
They are hoping you are making shit up because the chances of you getting a firm job from any of those schools are <20%.

mst wrote:If you are not a flame:

Sorry, don't mean to be mean. But there is no correct response. Your only hope for corporate law realistically out of any of these places is to be top 2-5% after 1L, transfer to a t10 after a year, and interview well at OCI. Otherwise, there's a good chance you'll be enjoying funemployment or shitlaw for the rest of your (possibly non-existent) legal career from any of those schools.

Your chances just dropped from less than 20% to less than 5% in a matter of minutes! Hurry up and attend this fall so you graduate as soon as possible and stop the bleeding. Don't even think about retaking and reapplying.

The Gentleman · Post by **The Gentleman** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:11 pm

Well what do you mean by business and corporate law? If you're talking about working for a big law firm and making six figures, none of the schools you mentioned will give you a reasonable shot. Retake and reapply.

But if you're interested in working with smaller, local businesses, then I would choose Pitt. It's the dominant school in its market and there are plenty of small firms that handle that type of law. You won't earn nearly as much money or prestige as you would have if you'd gone the biglaw route, but small business law has its perks. (I'm a clerk at a small firm) Instead of being part of a group of hundreds of attorneys who work thanklessly on a project, you actually get to work one on one with clients and deal directly with their problems and their business's problems. However, the starting salary is quite low (40-60k) and there's no guarantee of a job, so proceed at your own risk.

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:13 pm

not even temple? it at least places here http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:17 pm

researching actual job placement for any school gets cloudy because they always highlight the few that succeed so i really am kind of asking blindly

d34d9823 · Post by **d34d9823** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:20 pm

d9138c wrote:not even temple? it at least places here http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843

Exactly. How do you feel about wagering $200K on a 16% chance that you will get a $165K/yr job?

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:23 pm

d34dluk3 wrote:
d9138c wrote:not even temple? it at least places here http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843
Exactly. How do you feel about wagering $200K on a 16% chance that you will get a $165K/yr job?

where does 200k come from?

MrPapagiorgio · Post by **MrPapagiorgio** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:23 pm

d34dluk3 wrote:
d9138c wrote:not even temple? it at least places here http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843
Exactly. How do you feel about wagering $200K on a 16% chance that you will get a $165K/yr job?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkzMA1jrm00

arvcondor · Post by **arvcondor** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 4:29 am

mst wrote:If you are not a flame:

Sorry, don't mean to be mean. But there is no correct response. Your only hope for corporate law realistically out of any of these places is to be top 2-5% after 1L, transfer to a t10 after a year, and interview well at OCI. Otherwise, there's a good chance you'll be enjoying funemployment or shitlaw for the rest of your (possibly non-existent) legal career from any of those schools.

A large portion of those classes end up unemployed. 60k would be a dream to them.

Is this your experienced 0L opinion?

lisjjen · Post by **lisjjen** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 4:37 am

And OP, there's plenty of things to do with a law degree that are rewarding. But the concept of going to any law school and making 6 figures is in league with American hegemony and frat boy i-bankers.

A beautiful relic from the 20th Century.

reasonable_man · Post by **reasonable_man** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:27 am

I'm done crushing dreams and being the jerk-off that spews reality err negativity. Op. Each of these schools is a fine choice and will yield equally strong opportunities at the end of school (particularly in "corporate law"). All you really have to do is just show up, be in the top 3.2% of the class and there will literally be recruiters waiting for you at the back of the room on graduation day. Each of these finely manicured, well-spoken gentlemen will have in hand offers to work in legal and non-legal capacities at all manners of law firms with all sorts of interesting and unique practice areas and specialties. They will be accompanied by gorgeous women waiting to sniff coke directly from your cock as you shower them in crystal in a firm-provided limo. Something classy like an escalade stretch, no doubt. This is a "no-lose" scenario.

Congratulations on figuring out the law school secret early in life and taking the required steps (going to college and obtaining enough credits to graduate), to jump on board early. Not everyone can do that. As for the 60k figure at Penn State, pay no attention to that. Its a silly lie. Lies like that are perpetrated by the same assholes who believe in the bi-modal distribution of starting attorney salaries. These nay-sayers are just losers that don't graduate in the top 3.2% of their graduating classes of their respective law schools. They aren't like you. They didn't have a "plan" from the get go. They had no intention of "working their butt off," "networking" and "being on law review." They simply didn't think of these brilliant and fool proof plans. They had no plan to overcome arbitrary and meaningless grading standards. They didn't plan on spending weeks on end studying for finals. This 96.8% group of losers never had what it took to succede in life anyway (law school or not), and that's why you should simply ignore their negativity and march forward, unimpeded by the "warnings" of these losers, trolls and future JDU posters.

So go forth young scholar. Be the best special snow-flake you can be!!!!!!

arvcondor · Post by **arvcondor** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:30 am

reasonable_man wrote:I'm done crushing dreams and being the jerk-off that spews reality err negativity. Op. Each of these schools is a fine choice and will yield equally strong opportunities at the end of school (particularly in "corporate law"). All you really have to do is just show up, be in the top 3.2% of the class and there will literally be recruiters waiting for you at the back of the room on graduation day. Each of these finely manicured, well-spoken gentlemen will have in hand offers to work in legal and non-legal capacities at all manners of law firms with all sorts of interesting and unique practice areas and specialties. They will be accompanied by gorgeous women waiting to sniff coke directly from your cock as you shower them in crystal in a firm-provided limo. Something classy like an escalade stretch, no doubt. This is a "no-lose" scenario.

Congratulations on figuring out the law school secret early in life and taking the required steps (going to college and obtaining enough credits to graduate), to jump on board early. Not everyone can do that. As for the 60k figure at Penn State, pay no attention to that. Its a silly lie. Lies like that are perpetrated by the same assholes who believe in the bi-modal distribution of starting attorney salaries. These nay-sayers are just losers than don't graduate in the top 3.2% of their graduating classes of their respective law schools. They aren't like you. They didn't have a "plan" from the get go. They had no intention of "working their butt off," "networking" and "being on law review." They simply didn't think of these brilliant and fool proof plans. They had no plan to overcome arbitrary and meaningless grading standards. They didn't plan on spending weeks on end studying for finals. This 96.8% group of losers never had what it took to succede in life anyway (law school or not), and that's why you should simply ignore their negativity and march forward, unimpeded by the "warnings" of these losers, trolls and future JDU posters.

So go forth young scholar. Be the best special snow-flake you can be!!!!!!

Very uninventive trolling, despite the amount of time you spent on it.

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:17 am

reasonable_man wrote:I'm done crushing dreams and being the jerk-off that spews reality err negativity. Op. Each of these schools is a fine choice and will yield equally strong opportunities at the end of school (particularly in "corporate law"). All you really have to do is just show up, be in the top 3.2% of the class and there will literally be recruiters waiting for you at the back of the room on graduation day. Each of these finely manicured, well-spoken gentlemen will have in hand offers to work in legal and non-legal capacities at all manners of law firms with all sorts of interesting and unique practice areas and specialties. They will be accompanied by gorgeous women waiting to sniff coke directly from your cock as you shower them in crystal in a firm-provided limo. Something classy like an escalade stretch, no doubt. This is a "no-lose" scenario.

Congratulations on figuring out the law school secret early in life and taking the required steps (going to college and obtaining enough credits to graduate), to jump on board early. Not everyone can do that. As for the 60k figure at Penn State, pay no attention to that. Its a silly lie. Lies like that are perpetrated by the same assholes who believe in the bi-modal distribution of starting attorney salaries. These nay-sayers are just losers that don't graduate in the top 3.2% of their graduating classes of their respective law schools. They aren't like you. They didn't have a "plan" from the get go. They had no intention of "working their butt off," "networking" and "being on law review." They simply didn't think of these brilliant and fool proof plans. They had no plan to overcome arbitrary and meaningless grading standards. They didn't plan on spending weeks on end studying for finals. This 96.8% group of losers never had what it took to succede in life anyway (law school or not), and that's why you should simply ignore their negativity and march forward, unimpeded by the "warnings" of these losers, trolls and future JDU posters.

So go forth young scholar. Be the best special snow-flake you can be!!!!!!

well thank god i still have a chance to "succede"

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:46 am

I have been waitlisted at american, w&m and brooklyn as well. would it be worth paying full price if any of those schools come though or is it not worth the risk.

RPK34 · Post by **RPK34** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:59 am

d9138c wrote:I have been waitlisted at american, w&m and brooklyn as well. would it be worth paying full price if any of those schools come though or is it not worth the risk.

Maybe W&M if it's in state tuition, even then its shaky. And I only say that in the sense that W&M might be a decent investment, not that your chances of doing corporate law from there are very good.

d9138c · Post by **d9138c** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:15 am

RPK34 wrote:
d9138c wrote:I have been waitlisted at american, w&m and brooklyn as well. would it be worth paying full price if any of those schools come though or is it not worth the risk.
Maybe W&M if it's in state tuition, even then its shaky. And I only say that in the sense that W&M might be a decent investment, not that your chances of doing corporate law from there are very good.

but all things being unequal doing well in either of those schools should still bode well compare to the other four right? also no body likes incurring huge amounts of debt but i have no UG debt at all so I have a little flex room.

njn3 · Post by **njn3** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:57 am

in concerns with these schools...idk...if you really want business or corporate law and the best chance for this retake...

With that said, the legal market in pittsburgh is pretty insulated, in terms of getting corporate law in the city really in terms of school quality this is really what they look at:
1. t-14
2. maybe schools like vandy/wustl with bigger reps
3. Pitt

so for the few corporate positions open after t-14ers take them, there is a bit of a chance for pitt grads albeit very low (might be higher with the mba)...lots of lawyers in pittsburgh went to pitt or duquesne and most of them hold these schools in high regard still despite the rankings...i know Reed Smith usually may at least interview there and take a few people per year...

Honestly...you have decent job prospects in pittsburgh from pitt, and decent prospects in philly from temple...(i'd personally avoid penn state because it's in the middle of nowhere (law school isn't at state college i don't think...but CoL could be cheaper...with that said you can get it pretty cheap in pittsburgh as well...)...but corporate law may be difficult from any of these schools

in terms of the other schools you're waitlisted at, it depends...american, w & m, and brooklyn likely wouldn't do any better in pittsburgh or philly than pitt or temple...but they prob would give you a better chance at DC or NY than your current options...
At the same time in terms of their own markets they are probably worse off than pitt and temple are in their respective markets

JusticeHarlan · Post by **JusticeHarlan** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:10 pm

d34dluk3 wrote:
d9138c wrote:not even temple? it at least places here http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843
Exactly. How do you feel about wagering $200K on a 16% chance that you will get a $165K/yr job?

Also, the 16% data is a year old. Class of 2010 was at 11%

Hank Chill · Post by **Hank Chill** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:12 pm

I wouldn't expect biglaw from any of those schools, OP.

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