IP Law at Cal Western (T4)? Forum

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:08 pm

Long story short; I'm a recent UCSD graduate with a Bachelor's in Human Biology with an interest to study Intellectual Property (Biotech Patent Law, Pharmaceutical Patent, etc.) However, after skimming through some threads on this site for a couple hours, it seems as though everyone frowns upon going to a T4 School, especially if they have a specific field of Law they are interested in. Curious to hear some input on my situation. Is it likely that I could study Bio-related Intellectual Property Law if graduating from a T4 School like Cal Western? Any advice and input is appreciate, thank you in advance.

FlanAl · Post by **FlanAl** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:13 pm

most people on here will hate super hard but Cal Western is second place in San Diego which is a super sciencey IP market. That being said you will have to wait in line behind behind grads from t-14, UCLA USC, USD and maybe even davis/hastings. Cal Western has a huge presence in SD so if I were you I'd try to find a graduate of there who looks like he does what you might like to do. If you can't find one then you probably shouldn't go to Cal Western, but if you can I'm sure they wouldn't mind providing some good insight.

09042014 · Post by **09042014** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:18 pm

You aren't going to get a job in IP with a human bio degree.

Curry · Post by **Curry** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:19 pm

Desert Fox wrote:You aren't going to get a job in IP with a human bio degree.

THIS

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:31 pm

Desert Fox wrote:You aren't going to get a job in IP with a human bio degree.

Thanks for the input guys. Can you clarify on why this is the case? A Human Bio Degree is basically the same as a Biology degree with slightly more emphasis on Human Physiology (I'm sure you guys already knew this). Any clarification is appreciated. Thanks again.

09042014 · Post by **09042014** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:40 pm

UCSD1984 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:You aren't going to get a job in IP with a human bio degree.
Thanks for the input guys. Can you clarify on why this is the case? A Human Bio Degree is basically the same as a Biology degree with slightly more emphasis on Human Physiology (I'm sure you guys already knew this). Any clarification is appreciated. Thanks again.

You wouldn't get one with a BS in biology either. They want advanced degrees.

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:44 pm

I've met a couple and seen quite a few Biotech Patent Attorneys online (at Knobbe Martens Olson & Bear) that have nothing more than a B.S. in the sciences, one of the many being Biology. I'm curious to know why it would be difficult/impossible to obtain a career in Patent Law with my degree.

nealric · Post by **nealric** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:12 pm

The reason is that bio degrees are a dime a dozen and generally do not qualify you to do groundbreaking work in the field. Unless you are an engineer, it's PHd or bust for patent law.

Just because you met some IP lawyers with bio degrees does not mean it's at all common. Keep in mind that firms were desperate for IP people around '06. That is no longer the case.

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:13 pm

So it would be a waste of time for me to pursue this field?

glewz · Post by **glewz** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:29 pm

It's not a waste of time to pursue your degree - do what you want to do. You can get Biotech patent law with your bio degree - case western, however, limits your chances.

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:33 pm

Why would Cal Western limit my chances?

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:55 pm

UCSD1984 wrote:Why would Cal Western limit my chances?

Low on prestige = low on job placement in a competitive and saturated market.

09042014 · Post by **09042014** » Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:57 pm

Why can't you get into a t14?

risktaker · Post by **risktaker** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:00 am

You can get a job in patent litigation with a bio degree. It might be harder in this economy, but still possible. I would probably avoid Cal Western though. Try to shoot for USD if possible.

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:01 am

My Overall GPA is only about a 3.0, and I'm not sure how well I can do on the LSAT. I'm positive I can break a 160, but not sure about higher than that.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:02 am

UCSD1984 wrote:My Overall GPA is only about a 3.0, and I'm not sure how well I can do on the LSAT. I'm positive I can break a 160, but not sure about higher than that.

Don't know until you try duder

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:03 am

True, but I'd also like to stay local in San Diego. Having said that, USD would be the best possible choice...and I don't think it's a t14...unless I'm misunderstanding what "t14" stands for.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:04 am

UCSD1984 wrote:True, but I'd also like to stay local in San Diego. Having said that, USD would be the best possible choice...and I don't think it's a t14...unless I'm misunderstanding what "t14" stands for.

Time to reevalute what you like.

risktaker · Post by **risktaker** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:05 am

Yeah, you will need to break 160 for USD with that GPA at least for USD. I am also applying to USD for the current cycle and re-taking in Feb in hopes of breaking my last score of 157. I am also interested in IP with biochemistry degree from UCSD.

arhmcpo · Post by **arhmcpo** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:36 am

Because Cal Western is considered to be a terrible, terrible law school. In a time in which there are waaay too many law students, waaay too many unemployed lawyers, and waaay too few legal jobs - going to law school is a decision you should very carefully consider because it can lead you down a path to long term financial ruin.

Ideally you want to go to a law school that will improve your chances of landing the type of job you want (i.e. T14 which means one of the top 14 law schools in the country or USC/UCLA for southern california; at the least aim for a school that would not seriously hinder your chances (USD, Loyola, Pepperdine, UCI); but with Cal Western you would get a school that would set you up to fail by hindering your chances of not only getting your dream type of job, but any legal job at all.

Conventional wisdom is go to the best school your lsat/gpa can get you into or the next best school which gives you the biggest scholarship. If staying in the San Diego area is a must for you then going to USD could be good assuming they give you lots of $$$.

Sorry to sound negative but the legal industry is really messed up right now and has been for years, and your asking about attending one of the worst accredited law schools in CA

good luck

UCSD1984 · Post by **UCSD1984** » Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:14 am

I appreciate the input, thank you.

StevePirates · Post by **StevePirates** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:52 pm

I like California Western. I went there, and I'm gainfully employed in the legal profession. You could always pursue a dual degree to advance your science credentials.

But you need to be realistic about what the state of the profession is. Track down some firms in the markets where you want to practice. Look at their attorney rosters. Take notes on where those attorneys went. Go to those schools or better. Just because you want to practice in San Diego doesn't mean you should go to law school in San Diego.

treeey86 · Post by **treeey86** » Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:12 pm

A friend of mine who goes to a T25 school was offered a SA at Kenyon & Kenyon with nothing more than a BS and he passed the patent bar. His grades were good, but not stellar ( hovering around Top third, but I am not positive if he was above top third).

I thought I would post this for those students with a BS wondering if they could grab a respectable IP job without a PhD or otherwise. The answer is yes. Though if my friend is the norm or exception is beyond me.

Black-Blue · Post by **Black-Blue** » Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:58 pm

Whether you "can" get a patent prosecution job or not with a BS depends on (1) the field you're working, (2) the pedigree of your science degree (including GPA), and (3) work experience.

As for the field of patent prosecution you're working...

For electrical engineering, computer engineering, mechanical engineering, and computer science - BS in those fields is good enough, even BS in physics, for some position.

For most chemical engineering - BS in Chemical engineering / MS in Chemistry (or BS in Chemistry from top program)

For bio-chemical engineering, pharmaceuticals, and biotechnology - PhD in biology/chemistry/biochemistry or MS in bioengineering / MS in bio/chem/biochem from top program. A BS would be an uphill battle unless your degree is ultra-elite (like Stanford, MIT, etc)

pkt63 · Post by **pkt63** » Sat Jan 29, 2011 10:39 pm

Maybe try getting a job as a patent agent first, and then see how you like it? Also if oyu get a couple of years of work experience, perhaps you will be ready to go to law school after (if) UCSD and Cal Western merge. If that happens, it's gonna get a lot better fast, because UCSD will not get into law to be a 4th tier school, so you could be on the ground floor of a school that could, years down the road, be a T20, at least. Look at Rady. It's still unranked, but the word is that it is an awesome school and will be ranked highly once it is.

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