Full Ride @ Albany vs. Cardozo/Brooklyn Forum

[Sell Manilla]

In light of risk aversion, I'm hoping to land a conditional full ride at these schools rather than sticker @ T20.
I'm down with Gov work if I'm not a mindless lackey.

Leaning toward Albany due to cost of living. I've gone through countless older "Albany" threads, but there has been very little input from Albany students/grads discussing class rank & job placement.

I am aware that BigLaw should not be considered a viable option.
I have seen how low the median salaries are (which are prolly even worse if 100% reported accurately).
I am aware that local firms & the gov hire Albany grads, but have not been able to find any info on what class rank is required for what sorts of jobs.
I have extensively considered the myriad cons of conditional schollies, and realize that I can't bank on hitting it. I've decided that I'm more comfortable with risking one semester's tuition down the toilet than I am sticker @ T20 with the possibility of no job & royal fuck-edness.
I have also considered a solid partial scholly from a T2 school with less risky conditionality, but I just don't want tens of thousands in debt.

[grambo246]

I am not from Albany law, I just finished my 1L year elsewhere, but I have friends there. The word was basically everyone was fucked. The government in Albany is shut down/not hiring. I am in an unpaid internship in Connecticut right now and even government jobs here are tight. New York is ten times worse right now.

[testmachine45]

forget albany law. one firm in ny that hires a lot of albany law grads is milbank, but you have to be really talented and have an excuse for going to albany law such as being really poor and from the area.

[Sell Manilla]

Wow... earlier this afternoon my plan was to hit the conditionality @ Albany & land a decent local job. ... ... ::facepalm::

I know this is a lil' personal, but, grambo? Could you please ask if any of your friends are down to exchange e-mails or sign up for TLS & exchange PM's? I would love to communicate with one of them.

[zanda]

Doesn't answer your question, but it's not UAlbany. UAlbany refers to SUNY Albany. Albany Law is part of Union University.

[Sell Manilla]

^ Thanks. Edited accordingly.

[soaponarope]

My brother is an Albany alumnus... and I too am attending Albany law (class of 2013). I am not worried about the job market because I will eventually be working for my brother. That said, when my bro graduated from Albany he found a job rather quickly in a private firm (before he even passed the bar). The starting salary was a joke (45k), however, his job provided some strong incentives. Every year (so far) he received a raise of (5k). He also receives work from the public defenders office who are not able to take certain cases (which the state pays 75 an hour for) but the firm gets 2/3 of the pay which leaves him at 33 an hour (still not too bad).

Nonetheless, his salary is now at 65k a year, plus incentives: (gas, phone, bonuses, etc...) He loves his job, and doesn't even consider it to be "work"... though, his boss is the "shit" as he would describe, lol. He did forewarn me that he wanted to blow his head off during law school (everyone is so negative, saying there are no jobs, HUGE debt, cold winters, yada yada yada) but that's a bunch of BS negative nancy naysayers who really would like to scare the competition out of the field as much as possible.

Finally, my brother had some amazing internships that Albany provided. He worked for the DA one summer, interned in Manhattan, and pretty much ascertained the fact that Albany Law school has their region locked down. That is... you graduate, pass the bar, and you'll certainty find work.

Good luck in your endeavors.

[Sell Manilla]

... you graduate, pass the bar, and you'll certainty find work.

When did your brother graduate?

[AJRESQ]

There are a lot of Brooklyn and Cardozo grads doing document review. If you want to practice in NYC, I would (at the risk of sounding like a TLS shill) re-take the LSAT and get into a better school.

You'd be fine in a smaller market at a local school (like Philly), but not NYC... keep in mind your competition is the entire east coast. And then some.

[AJRESQ]

My brother is an Albany alumnus... and I too am attending Albany law (class of 2013). I am not worried about the job market because I will eventually be working for my brother. That said, when my bro graduated from Albany he found a job rather quickly in a private firm (before he even passed the bar). The starting salary was a joke (45k), however, his job provided some strong incentives. Every year (so far) he received a raise of (5k). He also receives work from the public defenders office who are not able to take certain cases (which the state pays 75 an hour for) but the firm gets 2/3 of the pay which leaves him at 33 an hour (still not too bad).

Nonetheless, his salary is now at 65k a year, plus incentives: (gas, phone, bonuses, etc...) He loves his job, and doesn't even consider it to be "work"... though, his boss is the "shit" as he would describe, lol. He did forewarn me that he wanted to blow his head off during law school (everyone is so negative, saying there are no jobs, HUGE debt, cold winters, yada yada yada) but that's a bunch of BS negative nancy naysayers who really would like to scare the competition out of the field as much as possible.

Finally, my brother had some amazing internships that Albany provided. He worked for the DA one summer, interned in Manhattan, and pretty much ascertained the fact that Albany Law school has their region locked down. That is... you graduate, pass the bar, and you'll certainty find work.

Good luck in your endeavors.

For whatever it's worth, most lawyer jobs have low salaries and incentives for realized revenue, business generation, etc. (realization = you can bill an hour, but if your rate sucks or the client doesn't pay, it was a waste. Your bonus is usually contingent on realizing your time). Biglaw has high salaries, but they only pay 10% business generation, plus it's tough to generate business when your rates are like $300 - $400 an hour.

Biglaw is great right out of school because you can make a dent in your student loans without a book, plus the connections are invaluable. That said, if you don't do biglaw right out of law school, you're not necessarily screwed. You just have to be willing to work HARD for the first few years. And not be socially retarded.

[A'nold]

Damn I can't stand hearing the same crap over and over again. Listen people, did you actually READ op's op? You guys are such freaking parrots. OP, your plan sounds fine.

[Sell Manilla]

^ Hehe, thanks A'nold... but I can't think it "sounds fine" until I gain a realistic view of the most recent graduating Albany class: who landed what jobs from what class rank etc.

I've heard conflicting reports, but the single most helpful post is the first one, from grambo. State Gov work seems to be Albany's major draw, & if that's not a viable option I have a hard time being optimistic.

If anyone is a RECENT Albany grad, or can put me in touch with one, I'd be much obliged.

[soaponarope]

^ Hehe, thanks A'nold... but I can't think it "sounds fine" until I gain a realistic view of the most recent graduating Albany class: who landed what jobs from what class rank etc.

I've heard conflicting reports, but the single most helpful post is the first one, from grambo. State Gov work seems to be Albany's major draw, & if that's not a viable option I have a hard time being optimistic.

If anyone is a RECENT Albany grad, or can put me in touch with one, I'd be much obliged.

My brother graduated in 2006. I recently spoke with him and... yea... he said "State Gov work is Albany's forte", however, my post was to illustrate "other" options that are viable to Albany grads.

[Sell Manilla]

@ soaponarope: I really appreciate you taking time to help me out. However, since your brother graduated before the crash, & you've already got a job lined up with him, your extremely positive outlook isn't rubbing off on me. Do either of you know anyone from this past graduating class? ... or know anyone who knows anyone?

Separate question: How many hours per week, avg, was your brother working @ 45K start, and how much is he working now for 65? [excluding the PD side project]

thanks again

[soaponarope]

@ soaponarope: I really appreciate you taking time to help me out. However, since your brother graduated before the crash, & you've already got a job lined up with him, your extremely positive outlook isn't rubbing off on me. Do either of you know anyone from this past graduating class? ... or know anyone who knows anyone?

Separate question: How many hours per week, avg, was your brother working @ 45K start, and how much is he working now for 65? [excluding the PD side project]

thanks again

I'll give him a call tomm for those specific questions, however, I do remember asking him how many hours a week he "worked".... his response was: "I don't work. I hang around court houses all day, and talk on the phone to clients"... He said he can come an go from the office when he wants, but so long as he's bringing in money everything is gravy. His boss is a really cool guy ( I met him) and is pretty laid back, sooooo.... dunno how other firms operate. My brother usually leaves the house around 9 a.m. and gets home around 6 p.m., but like I said, during his work day he's driving to diff court houses, or having a cocktail/lunch with a client, so it's not like it's 9 hours of continuous work. And, he always gets time off for the holidays...

That said, 3 years from now who knows what the economic climate will be like in Albany, though I'll ask him what it's like now... and, it's very much a fraternity there, i.e. Albany alums take care of their own.

[brick295]

I'm Albany law class of 2012. I have a scholarship that requires me to stay in the top half of the class. That was very easy to do.

Every attorney in this entire area went to Albany law. They call it "Smallbany" for a reason.

I have friends at duquesne and widener who could not even find a summer internship. Here, I don't know a single person who doesn't have a summer job. Career services here is great. I have numerous friends who work in NYC this summer - NY St Atty General's office,etc

[brick295]

One thing I learned while applying to law school is to not pay attention to 90% of the people online. They will all say the same thing about every school: Retake your LSAT or you will be homeless. They say every school sucks.

Use your own gut. Visit the schools and do your research and you'll be fine. There is no law school within around 100 miles of Albany law. Contrast that with wherever else you are applying if the schools have similar ranks. NYC, Philly, Boston, Pittsburgh, and most other cities have large amounts of highly ranked schools that you'll be competing with for jobs.

[Sell Manilla]

Hey brick, thank you so much for hopping in. I thought this thread was dead. Great timing, because I was having my first round of "ok, enough of this 'it won't happen to me' nonsense, quit before you start, self".

1) Do you mind me asking what % of tuition your scholly covered? If not full, do you know what they normally require to keep full schollies? Do you know students in that situation?

2) You say everyone can find summer work? What about after graduation? What about the amount of hours per week in Albany firms? How far south into the Hudson Valley does their reach extend before you're hopelessly competing with NYC school grads?