William Mitchell V Florida International Forum

[t_flores08]

Ok, so I have a friend who is between two schools, and I am posting for her since she is not a TLS member. (The friend is not me, lol, I have already posted where I am going fall of 2010) Pretty much, she is between William Mitchell (with a full ride scholarship) and Florida International University (with $7500/ year and in-state tuition). I think they are same criteria to keep the schollys at both schools, more or less. She is not crazy about either option, but is set on going to law school this year, and is most likely not changing her mind about it.

- She really does not have a preference as to where she wants to live. She likes Miami, but does not want to stay here long term. Not too crazy about MN and would prefer not to work there (Has a slight preference of Miami/ South Florida over Minnesota, though).
- Don't think she has BigLaw aspirations.
- Has personal ties to both MN and South Florida.
- She is looking for the best overall education, as well as career prospects coming out of law school (between her two options).
- She does not mind taking out debt but prefers to avoid it for either school.
- She already negotiated with FIU for scholly money, and they are not looking to budge anymore.

All constructive thoughts are welcome. As I said, she prefers not to retake/ reapply, so if we can work with the options I have listed it would be great. Also, if students from either of the two schools can post their thoughts on the schools and give some insight, it would be greatly appreciated Thanks everyone.

[OnWisconsin]

Well you already stated that she's not hot on the idea of Minnesota. However I think WM would provide her with a better contact pool for employment (not Vault, but a good number or reputable Minnesota firms). Plus she has the bonus of emerging from school debt free as long as the requirements for scholly retention are reasonable.

But all that goes out the window if she has no desire to live in Minneapolis, as WM is super regional. Either one of these schools is most likely to net her a job within it's regional market. So have her take a good hard look at where she wants to live out a good portion of her life, not just the next 3 years.

[dougroberts]

I just finished my first year at WM, with a full scholarship. I agree that both schools are regional, so if she intends not to practice in either area then neither school is advisable.

That being said, it is very nice to graduate debt-free. Moreover, WM has more portability because it has alumni across the country and is much higher ranked (T2 vs. T4). Nevertheless, WM and FIU are regional.

I must say, however, that having a full tuition scholarship like I have is very nice in this economy as other students are in massive debt, even students at Univ. of Minn. are struggling to find jobs but have debt. It is worth considering the scholarships in this economy.

[krzyzewski]

Hmm... This senario seems a little fishy to me. Full ride at a T1 (Unofficially it's a T2 blah, blah, blah) but less than that a a TTTT?

Having said that, it seems like a clear choice to go to WM if she is 50/50 on where she'd like to live. However, she should think carefully about Minnesota in Jan/Feb/March before deciding to move here. I have lived here all my life and I think the winters are BRUTAL! If she's a Florida native and hasn't spent time in MN during the winter, it could really make the difference.

Why is she just down to those two? Stats?

[najumobi]

FIU seems like a sham of a law school. go with William Mitchell and the larger scholly package. also florida is supersaturated with law schools.

[dougroberts]

FIU seems like a sham of a law school. go with William Mitchell and the larger scholly package. also florida is supersaturated with law schools.

...and MN is not very saturated with law schools. Univ of Minn is top, followed by WM (Univ of St. Thomas and Hamline are not serious players in the law field in MN).

Thus, I think being second in the MN-market with no debt is a better option than in debt in FL.

[deadpanic]

Hmm... This senario seems a little fishy to me. Full ride at a T1 (Unofficially it's a T2 blah, blah, blah) but less than that a a TTTT?

It doesn't matter that WM is now a T2. They should both be viewed basically the same.

FIU is public, so in-state tuition is around 9,500K per year, so she has close to a full ride there.

I would tell her to pick her preference in region. Neither school is the dominant school in their respective regions.

[t_flores08]

Hmm... This senario seems a little fishy to me. Full ride at a T1 (Unofficially it's a T2 blah, blah, blah) but less than that a a TTTT?

Having said that, it seems like a clear choice to go to WM if she is 50/50 on where she'd like to live. However, she should think carefully about Minnesota in Jan/Feb/March before deciding to move here. I have lived here all my life and I think the winters are BRUTAL! If she's a Florida native and hasn't spent time in MN during the winter, it could really make the difference.

Why is she just down to those two? Stats?

Yea, my friend has about a 3.3 and i want to say 155-158 LSAT (don't quote me here, may be higher). She is originally from MN, but moved to South Florida for undergrad. I was also confused when she told me she told me she got the Full scholly at WM and FIU wouldnt match. She had gotten into a few other schools, but did not receive any money from the majority of them. Like she got into U Miami, but it was at sticker (which is a little pricy, imho), as well as Penn State and a few other schools. Any other thoughts or advice? She is hoping to make her decision asap and is hoping for as much info as possible.

[t_flores08]

Oh, and thanks to everyone who gave some input.

[Informative]

Seriously, she shouldn't go to either school. I don't mean that because they are bad. I mean that because they will both only place locally (not even regionally). Florida International will help you get employed in the surrounding areas of Florida, but that is about it. If you don't want to work in Florida after graduation, do not go to school there. The same is true for William Mitchell. You aren't going to get a job outside of Minnesota with a WM degree. Even the recent jump from Tier 4 to Tier 2 does not make it any better than FIU. I have a hard time being convinced that it is any different than it was a year or so ago when it was considered 4th tier. Nothing has changed at the school and law firm placement hasn't changed either. If anything, the market has only gotten worse for grads of these types of schools.

Your friend should go to school at a school in the state she wants to work, or not go at all. I would advise retaking the LSAT and re-evaluating where she wants to end up.

[dougroberts]

Seriously, she shouldn't go to either school. I don't mean that because they are bad. I mean that because they will both only place locally (not even regionally). Florida International will help you get employed in the surrounding areas of Florida, but that is about it. If you don't want to work in Florida after graduation, do not go to school there. The same is true for William Mitchell. You aren't going to get a job outside of Minnesota with a WM degree. Even the recent jump from Tier 4 to Tier 2 does not make it any better than FIU. I have a hard time being convinced that it is any different than it was a year or so ago when it was considered 4th tier. Nothing has changed at the school and law firm placement hasn't changed either. If anything, the market has only gotten worse for grads of these types of schools.

Your friend should go to school at a school in the state she wants to work, or not go at all. I would advise retaking the LSAT and re-evaluating where she wants to end up.

For the most part this is true, except for the rankings argument. WM has placed more emphasis on recruiting better students and its clinics continue to be very well recognized. If you don't know anything about the MN market, WM is well-regarded in state. There are more WM graduates on the highest MN state courts and federal courts than Univ. of Minn. graduates for example. Moreover, WM graduates are generally favored in corporate settings as well (I interned in the Legal Dept. at a Fortune 50 company).

Again, WM and FIU are regional so there is slim chances you can port your degree out-state, or at least not immediately. Only go to WM if you want to practice in MN; do not go to FIU if you want to practice in FL. I think you need to figure out where you want to practice before you commit 3 years, even if it is fully covered by scholarships.