Graduation = Worst Day of my life. Forum

[jbagelboy]

Nobody else cares where anybody else went to law school.

HTH

+1

[jp1447]

0Ls should really consider debt load and if law school is worth it.

OP, seriously, the general tone of the advice is terrible --- If only I went to **Yale**...

While debt sucks, if you couldn't get your debt down with a 4.0 and 167 and enjoy yourself at UVA (or another top law school), that's on you. And even if not, you got a well-paying job. If you don't like that job, suck it up for a couple years and make a switch. Simple as that.

0L's, I got to add: this is what happens when you focus on trying to BE somebody rather than DOing something. Passions should guide your decisions and not some never-ending quest to collect stamps. "My dream was to clerk" is a pretty sad and disturbing dream.

0Ls, If you take the LSAT and don't get into Yale, don't let three years go by and focus on "if onlys." Instead, think about what you like and how to get there. If you fall short, the wheels keep spinning. You have 50 years still to go. Try to be happy. It's not over.

[jingosaur]

Lets set this straight: it's not a debt thing, it's a prestige thing. UVA has the least prestige out of the T-14 which is something that people coming in need to know.

Words can't describe how bad I feel for you. Hopefully you are at a V15 so you can feel more prestigious.

[A. Nony Mouse]

0L's, I got to add: this is what happens when you focus on trying to BE somebody rather than DOing something. Passions should guide your decisions and not some never-ending quest to collect stamps. "My dream was to clerk" is a pretty sad and disturbing dream.

Nah, there are lots of good reasons to want to clerk that aren't about collecting stamps. The biggest problem is that clerking is 1 (maybe 2) years out of your life, so you need also to have a dream for after. But wanting to clerk isn't necessarily sad and disturbing.

[jp1447]

You right Mouse, perhaps I got a little hung up on the "dream" part. Clerking is great and valuable. It should be a goal and pursued with vigor.

Perhaps I got hung up on the vernacular, but the point I was trying to make for the youngsters about to embark relates to something more serious. I remember at Duke a lot of kids were depressed about LR and clerking. It's important and can be great, but I think all this hyperfocus can set some people up for pretty serious emotional fall out. I have no solution, so I chose a poor catch-phrase.

[A. Nony Mouse]

No, I know what you mean, and I agree that there is way too much emphasis on collecting brass rings in this profession, overall. People have to figure out that satisfaction from the brass rings doesn't sustain you.

[nealric]

You right Mouse, perhaps I got a little hung up on the "dream" part. Clerking is great and valuable. It should be a goal and pursued with vigor.

Perhaps I got hung up on the vernacular, but the point I was trying to make for the youngsters about to embark relates to something more serious. I remember at Duke a lot of kids were depressed about LR and clerking. It's important and can be great, but I think all this hyperfocus can set some people up for pretty serious emotional fall out. I have no solution, so I chose a poor catch-phrase.

I don't get the obsession with clerking. You get paid 1/3 what you do at the firm in exchange for being a judge's personal slave. I understand that it's considered a nice resume item and a prerequisite for certain sub specialties, but it's hardly worth obsessing over. If you really want to clerk, most firms have an ex-partner judge who will take associates. My old firm just told associates to let the hiring partner know if they wanted to clerk and he would get them set up.

[A. Nony Mouse]

It was a really great learning experience for me - I learned a ton about writing and analysis from an incredibly smart person. Admittedly that doesn't always happen, but that's the ideal. It was kind of like a super intense apprenticeship.

And that's absolutely not the way that most clerking hiring happens, though obviously it can.

That said, I agree the OP shouldn't be pining over it as some heart-breaking loss (especially since he had as good odds as anyone, going to UVA, and could still go ahead and clerk in future if it's that important).

[magicmagic]

Graduated from UVA today, and I can unambiguously say it was the worst decision of my life. I had a 4.05/167 and if I had just been patient and retaken the LSAT I could have had H/S/CLS --> If I would have done something unicorny maybe even Yale would have been in play. Now, I just have a boatload of debt and a miserable biglaw job ahead of me. I am depressed and have started taking medication.

If I could go back, I would have done four years in the marines, and kept retaking the LSAT 'til I got the score I wanted. I would've eventually gotten my 173, and HYS would'a been basically free with G.I. Bill

I say this as a tale of cautionary tale to you 0L's out there: really plan things out as much as you can before going law school. This is a profession that disproportionately rewards those who get off to the best start (e.g. Yale/law review/ prior w/e).

As for me, I may as well be posting in the Vale, cuz my personal happiness is about 2/10.

How much debt did you graduate with?

This is gonna get me screamed at -- 60k. Look, I know there are people in MUCH worse scenarios. But please try to understand that I am not comparing myself to other people (either better or worse), I'm comparing myself to what I objectively know I could have been. Plus, this is not a "hindsight 20/20" moment, b/c deferring law school for the military was something I was actively considering, but going straight to law school just seemed like the path of least resistance.

And to get done with the whole HYS vs. UVA debate: sure, UVA is fine -- but if I had gotten a better LSAT score I'd be debt free (e.g. two less years of biglaw).


The point of this thread is don't go to law school until you've put up all your chips: clearly, I should have retaken the LSAT, and while I ended up "well" I still feel gyped.

You could pay that off in 1-2 years with big law. And you'll have a T10 JD forever. You know that right.

You clearly have goals. Make them happen. There are people on this site who were duped into six-figure debt from a TTT. That's a real tragedy. Your situation is not.

[20160810]

I don't really get the premise of this thread. You would be working for a large law firm for about $160,000 one way or the next in all likelihood.

[20160810]

Nobody else cares where anybody else went to law school.

HTH

+1

Stong point, Paolo

[TFALAWL]

Hey Guys!

I would like to apologize for making this thread (though I don't necessarily regret making it as there have been many thoughtful comments).

Being focused on bar review has managed to change my thoughts and give me perspective.

A healthy amount of anti-climactic feelings are probably normal at graduation, but I overreacted. What I said should not have been shared to the whole world, as it is actually insulting to others who are in worse positions (and objectively, I need to work on gratitude for being in a good position).

To those who had nice things to say: Thank you

To those who didn't: totally valid -- I was being whiney and deserved a good 'ole slap.

I'll delete this thread once I feel that this message has been sufficiently conveyed.

[jbagelboy]

Hey Guys!

I would like to apologize for making this thread (though I don't necessarily regret making it as there have been many thoughtful comments).

Being focused on bar review has managed to change my thoughts and give me perspective.

A healthy amount of anti-climactic feelings are probably normal at graduation, but I overreacted. What I said should not have been shared to the whole world, as it is actually insulting to others who are in worse positions (and objectively, I need to work on gratitude for being in a good position).

To those who had nice things to say: Thank you

To those who didn't: totally valid -- I was being whiney and deserved a good 'ole slap.

I'll delete this thread once I feel that this message has been sufficiently conveyed.

Nice tar tho

[TFALAWL]

Hey Guys!

I would like to apologize for making this thread (though I don't necessarily regret making it as there have been many thoughtful comments).

Being focused on bar review has managed to change my thoughts and give me perspective.

A healthy amount of anti-climactic feelings are probably normal at graduation, but I overreacted. What I said should not have been shared to the whole world, as it is actually insulting to others who are in worse positions (and objectively, I need to work on gratitude for being in a good position).

To those who had nice things to say: Thank you

To those who didn't: totally valid -- I was being whiney and deserved a good 'ole slap.

I'll delete this thread once I feel that this message has been sufficiently conveyed.

Nice tar tho

Lol, I just realized that actually. But that was not my intention. My apologies are sincere. I take ownership of my stupidity in making this thread.

[TFALAWL]

Hey Guys!

I would like to apologize for making this thread (though I don't necessarily regret making it as there have been many thoughtful comments).

Being focused on bar review has managed to change my thoughts and give me perspective.

A healthy amount of anti-climactic feelings are probably normal at graduation, but I overreacted. What I said should not have been shared to the whole world, as it is actually insulting to others who are in worse positions (and objectively, I need to work on gratitude for being in a good position).

To those who had nice things to say: Thank you

To those who didn't: totally valid -- I was being whiney and deserved a good 'ole slap.

I'll delete this thread once I feel that this message has been sufficiently conveyed.

Nice tar tho

Wait JBAGS you referring to TAR as on "avatar" or technical assistance request. I assumed the latter until i realized that yes, my avatar is new

[jbagelboy]

Hey Guys!

I would like to apologize for making this thread (though I don't necessarily regret making it as there have been many thoughtful comments).

Being focused on bar review has managed to change my thoughts and give me perspective.

A healthy amount of anti-climactic feelings are probably normal at graduation, but I overreacted. What I said should not have been shared to the whole world, as it is actually insulting to others who are in worse positions (and objectively, I need to work on gratitude for being in a good position).

To those who had nice things to say: Thank you

To those who didn't: totally valid -- I was being whiney and deserved a good 'ole slap.

I'll delete this thread once I feel that this message has been sufficiently conveyed.

Nice tar tho

Wait JBAGS you referring to TAR as on "avatar" or technical assistance request. I assumed the latter until i realized that yes, my avatar is new

I meant avatar

[TFALAWL]

I would also like to personally apologize to any men/women in uniform who may have taken offense to my remarks considering the military. To provide context, I was offered an NROTC scholarship for the USMC in college, and I do regret not taking it. However, that does not excuse my ignorance with respect to the hardships faced by men/women in uniform.

I will add an apology to people with much higher debt loads: my whining undervalues what they've accomplished, and that is just not right.

I feel complete and total remorse, regarding how my words may have hurt others. I understand i need to work on myself (and I am), but I'm not going to bring other people down with me at times when I am having a bad day.

While graduation may not have been what I wished it were (due to my own emotional problems), I am proud of every one of my classmates for their accomplishments (and I hope to someday be proud of mine.

Peace be with you all.

[WokeUpInACar]

NY to 180 changing lives and perspectives out here

[mathis1490]

NY to 180 changing lives and perspectives out here

Preach

[TFALAWL]

NY to 180 changing lives and perspectives out here

Preach

180.

[kaysta]

I didnt read past page 1 here but--

Yeah, I don't think this would be the best cautionary tale for these boards. UVA is a great school with great job outcomes. I'm not sure what difference you think HYS would have made here, especially since UVA is known for good clerk and government placement.

Well. UVA, like all T14 schools, can get you into clerkships and government if things go the right way for you. But there's no question that HYS (and particularly YS) give you a better shot at that kind of thing.

Having said that, I think that OP (and many others on this board) have an unrealistic view of how easy it is to just "Clerk--->DOJ" right out of law school at HYS. Most HYS grads who end up in DOJ work for a few years at a firm first.

yeah, and I dont get why all this despair and gloom here
OP if law school + solid job lined up is enough to throw you into major depressive episode, there is no way you would've survived the marines.

[kaysta]

oh look, I see others have already pointed out the whining/lack of military material here, fine

[UnicornHunter]

OP is right about one thing: GI Bill is pretty sweet.

high five

[haus]

OP is right about one thing: GI Bill is pretty sweet.

high five

Being an old geezer, I have to admit I am envious of those with the newer improved GI Bill.

[ScottRiqui]

OP is right about one thing: GI Bill is pretty sweet.

high five

Being an old geezer, I have to admit I am envious of those with the newer improved GI Bill.

Old geezer here, too, but I'm glad I stayed in long enough to get my Montgomery GI Bill converted to the Post-9/11 version. I remember when they told us about the GI Bill in boot camp - "You only pay in $100/month for 12 months, and when you use the benefits, they could be worth as much as $25,000!"

Now, it's "You don't have to pay in anything except time, and you'd better bring a wheelbarrow for all the cash we're going to throw at you."