Married with children Forum

[rbrown0824]

What, precisely, do you think we are jealous of?

Never said anyone was jealous in particular, but if someone was jealous a quick look at the quotation on their profile, in addition to the things they've said in this post would provide some valuable insight as to why... if he hasnt changed it already

[bjsesq]

What, precisely, do you think we are jealous of?

Never said anyone was jealous in particular, but if someone was jealous a quick look at the quotation on their profile, in addition to the things they've said in this post would provide some valuable insight as to why... if he hasnt changed it already

Yeah, that doesn't make any sense.

[anyriotgirl]

man these extenuating circumstances threads always deliver

[A. Nony Mouse]

What, precisely, do you think we are jealous of?

Never said anyone was jealous in particular, but if someone was jealous a quick look at the quotation on their profile, in addition to the things they've said in this post would provide some valuable insight as to why... if he hasnt changed it already

Am pretty sure that quote is a joke (if not a great one), making fun of the poster who originally made it (and was thrashed for it). A lot of people here answer a lot of questions. A lot of people asking questions aren't forthcoming with details that make a big difference for the answers, and it gets frustrating to go to the trouble of answering and then find out your advice isn't relevant for reasons you didn't know at the time. So sometimes people look at post histories. Post histories are public and it's not necessarily about hating.

[toothbrush]

Am I the only one that wishes OP would press enter more often when typing replies?

[timbs4339]

OP: Unfortunately, law schools do not give a crap how optimistic you are or what your sob story is, although they may tell you differently so they can get your federal loan money. They care about the numbers. C+F doesn't care about how optimistic you are or what your sob story is. They care about not admitting people who are at risk for defrauding clients or embarrassing the bar. I can tell you that your falsification charge is going to be taken extra seriously because it is considered to bear on your honesty. It doesn't matter if there's a 99% chance you'll never get so much as a traffic ticket for the rest of your natural born life, all C+F is going to see is that potential future headline: "Lawyer with prior fraud convictions defrauds client: Who are the idiots who let him practice?" That's what C+F does.

Even though you can find one story where a guy with more felonies was admitted, that's another state, another set of rules, and another C+F committee. Here's a guy who wasn't even convicted of a crime, but plagiarized news stories. Despite a long period of time in between the fraud and law school, letters of support from prominent people, and a lot of public interest work, he was denied from two state bars: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/28/busin ... .html?_r=0

So before you even apply to law school, you should go to the local bar association in the state in which you might want to practice. You need to ask for a referral to a C+F lawyer, sit down with that lawyer, disclose your criminal history, and ask them "in three years, assuming I pass the bar and have no other problems, what are my chances of being admitted to the practice of law in this state?" You need to do this before you apply because you are going to have greedy law schools who do not give a crap about you or your family accepting you with no scholarship money. They won't care whether you're likely to pass C+F, and unlike these posters, will be glad to indulge your optimism.

[NYSprague]

OP: Unfortunately, law schools do not give a crap how optimistic you are or what your sob story is, although they may tell you differently so they can get your federal loan money. They care about the numbers. C+F doesn't care about how optimistic you are or what your sob story is. They care about not admitting people who are at risk for defrauding clients or embarrassing the bar. I can tell you that your falsification charge is going to be taken extra seriously because it is considered to bear on your honesty. It doesn't matter if there's a 99% chance you'll never get so much as a traffic ticket for the rest of your natural born life, all C+F is going to see is that potential future headline: "Lawyer with prior fraud convictions defrauds client: Who are the idiots who let him practice?" That's what C+F does.

Even though you can find one story where a guy with more felonies was admitted, that's another state, another set of rules, and another C+F committee. Here's a guy who wasn't even convicted of a crime, but plagiarized news stories. Despite a long period of time in between the fraud and law school, letters of support from prominent people, and a lot of public interest work, he was denied from two state bars: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/28/busin ... .html?_r=0

So before you even apply to law school, you should go to the local bar association in the state in which you might want to practice. You need to ask for a referral to a C+F lawyer, sit down with that lawyer, disclose your criminal history, and ask them "in three years, assuming I pass the bar and have no other problems, what are my chances of being admitted to the practice of law in this state?" You need to do this before you apply because you are going to have greedy law schools who do not give a crap about you or your family accepting you with no scholarship money. They won't care whether you're likely to pass C+F, and unlike these posters, will be glad to indulge your optimism.

Yes, you need to talk to a lawyer ahead of applying. I checked the Ohio state bar association has a referral service. Call them.

[Clyde Frog]

What, precisely, do you think we are jealous of?

Never said anyone was jealous in particular, but if someone was jealous a quick look at the quotation on their profile, in addition to the things they've said in this post would provide some valuable insight as to why... if he hasnt changed it already

I assume that you think I'm racist because i put a ridiculous quote in my profile from a member that got bashed for it a while back. You can rest easy knowing that I'm not. In addition to not being racist, I also don't think being Darth Batman is the most important thing in life.

[Holly Golightly]

Am I the only one that wishes OP would press enter more often when typing replies?

Racist.

[bjsesq]

What, precisely, do you think we are jealous of?

Never said anyone was jealous in particular, but if someone was jealous a quick look at the quotation on their profile, in addition to the things they've said in this post would provide some valuable insight as to why... if he hasnt changed it already

I assume that you think I'm racist because i put a ridiculous quote in my profile from a member that got bashed for it a while back. You can rest easy knowing that I'm not. In addition to not being racist, I also don't think being Darth Batman is the most important thing in life.

99% certain he was referring to the virgin line in my quotes. Which is frequently used on this forum to describe me. Virgin.

[Clyde Frog]

What, precisely, do you think we are jealous of?

Never said anyone was jealous in particular, but if someone was jealous a quick look at the quotation on their profile, in addition to the things they've said in this post would provide some valuable insight as to why... if he hasnt changed it already

I assume that you think I'm racist because i put a ridiculous quote in my profile from a member that got bashed for it a while back. You can rest easy knowing that I'm not. In addition to not being racist, I also don't think being Darth Batman is the most important thing in life.

99% certain he was referring to the virgin line in my quotes. Which is frequently used on this forum to describe me. Virgin.

Why do I not have a ratfukr quote in my profile?

[NYSprague]

Here is the link with the referrals for different counties:
http://www.ohiolegalservices.org/progra ... programs-1

[Seraphym]

I like that you are optimistic OP. People make mistakes. It happens. It's great that you're doing everything you can to overcome them. With that said, I am going to gravitate more towards the semester issue you have going on. I agree with some of the other posters that your attitude may need to change on the matter, especially the severity of your .34 semester because I have a suspicion that many schools won't care whether or not you attended it for a semester or the entirety of four years.

Allow me to offer you an anecdote. From 2011 to 2013, I applied to many law schools within the Wisconsin-Minnesota-Illinois area. Really would have liked to apply out of the area, but my wife's job kind of prevented that. With many of these schools, we'd have to live apart. In 2008, my sophomore year of college, I was involved in an automobile accident in which I as rear-ended, absolutely stationary at the time, by an individual going about 60 miles an hour. He wasn't supposed to be driving because of a temporary disability, per Pennsylvania state law. Nearly every emergency medical professional that showed up that I shouldn't have walked away from it, but I did and with no injuries to boot.

I cannot say the same for my mental state. Anxiety attacks left and right. Night terrors where all I could see was that truck in my rear-view mirror. Needless to say, my 4.0 GPA from the year prior took a massive hit to .84 for the semester. Overall, it put me dangerously close to being on academic probation. All told, I finished my Bachelor's with a 3.56. However, I've had to explain this semester to every single school I applied to in that time and I can safely say that many of those committees, including University of Wisconsin - Madison, DID NOT seem comfortable with that until I boosted my LSAT score the following year. I received questions like "Why hadn't you simply withdrawn for the semester to pursue some post-trauma counseling?" The type of stuff that, to be honest, I don't think I had a good answer to because a semester withdrawal would have been the most prudent thing to do.

Now, that is an example of a junk semester in which I'd argue the only "crime" I committed was being too arrogant to see that I needed to spend that time out of school to get my crap together. I didn't cause the accident by virtue of anything other than being in the wrong place and at the wrong time. Your problems are more substantial. As another poster mentioned, they aren't a one time deal, you have an established history of that behavior. Unfortunately, the best indicator of future activity is what has occurred in the past. Furthermore, as another mentioned, you are pursuing a field with a plethora of controlled substance abuse. I would not be in the least bit surprised if you encounter much greater scrutiny in your application process than even I ever did with that type of semester. That's not to demoralize you. That's not to put yet another additional barrier in front of you. Keep fighting the good fight, keep pushing along.

However, I'm not confident that you understand just how good your addendum may have to be to move forward in any meaningful fashion. This is a seller's market. The consumers are a dime a dozen, although maybe not the extent they once were a few years ago, and many of them won't have the semester issue you do. Perhaps I am being a little too critical, but even less potentially have them for the same reasons you do. When writing it, my advice would be to potentially see if you can get an admissions officer to see if they are willing to proofread it. Preferably one that doesn't work on the admissions council, possibly even the same university you apply to, just to get a feel for what it should look like. Your circumstances are so extenuating that I don't think anyone on this forum can offer you that much help in this area otherwise.

Finally, I agree that you should probably pursue advice from someone familiar with Ohio's character and fitness standards, as well as any other states you want to look at, before jumping over the cliff. Before going further, I am going to openly state that I find myself of the "scam" belief so what follows may appear biased. Anyway, I implore that you browse the Vale of Tears. Listen to some of the stories of people who could not break into the legal field, for one reason or another, and ended up putting an additional scarlet letter onto their resume for non-legal sector jobs. These are people who often took the plunge and just lost the bet. You are one of the few people with extenuating circumstances that, with a little vigilant research, could find out whether there is even a bet to be had BEFORE going to to law school and adjust your goals accordingly. Take advantage of that. Even if you managed to earn something like a free ride, there is no telling whether or not this field is going to be worth pursuing until you have a better idea of whether or not you can pass the character and fitness standards. Maybe I missed something, but it seems like the best you've offered is a newspaper article of someone else making it. While helpful, there is simply too much that might have been going on in the periphery of that story to assume that all of that will be true for you.

[rbrown0824]

I like that you are optimistic OP. People make mistakes. It happens. It's great that you're doing everything you can to overcome them. With that said, I am going to gravitate more towards the semester issue you have going on. I agree with some of the other posters that your attitude may need to change on the matter, especially the severity of your .34 semester because I have a suspicion that many schools won't care whether or not you attended it for a semester or the entirety of four years.

Allow me to offer you an anecdote. From 2011 to 2013, I applied to many law schools within the Wisconsin-Minnesota-Illinois area. Really would have liked to apply out of the area, but my wife's job kind of prevented that. With many of these schools, we'd have to live apart. In 2008, my sophomore year of college, I was involved in an automobile accident in which I as rear-ended, absolutely stationary at the time, by an individual going about 60 miles an hour. He wasn't supposed to be driving because of a temporary disability, per Pennsylvania state law. Nearly every emergency medical professional that showed up that I shouldn't have walked away from it, but I did and with no injuries to boot.

I cannot say the same for my mental state. Anxiety attacks left and right. Night terrors where all I could see was that truck in my rear-view mirror. Needless to say, my 4.0 GPA from the year prior took a massive hit to .84 for the semester. Overall, it put me dangerously close to being on academic probation. All told, I finished my Bachelor's with a 3.56. However, I've had to explain this semester to every single school I applied to in that time and I can safely say that many of those committees, including University of Wisconsin - Madison, DID NOT seem comfortable with that until I boosted my LSAT score the following year. I received questions like "Why hadn't you simply withdrawn for the semester to pursue some post-trauma counseling?" The type of stuff that, to be honest, I don't think I had a good answer to because a semester withdrawal would have been the most prudent thing to do.

Now, that is an example of a junk semester in which I'd argue the only "crime" I committed was being too arrogant to see that I needed to spend that time out of school to get my crap together. I didn't cause the accident by virtue of anything other than being in the wrong place and at the wrong time. Your problems are more substantial. As another poster mentioned, they aren't a one time deal, you have an established history of that behavior. Unfortunately, the best indicator of future activity is what has occurred in the past. Furthermore, as another mentioned, you are pursuing a field with a plethora of controlled substance abuse. I would not be in the least bit surprised if you encounter much greater scrutiny in your application process than even I ever did with that type of semester. That's not to demoralize you. That's not to put yet another additional barrier in front of you. Keep fighting the good fight, keep pushing along.

However, I'm not confident that you understand just how good your addendum may have to be to move forward in any meaningful fashion. This is a seller's market. The consumers are a dime a dozen, although maybe not the extent they once were a few years ago, and many of them won't have the semester issue you do. Perhaps I am being a little too critical, but even less potentially have them for the same reasons you do. When writing it, my advice would be to potentially see if you can get an admissions officer to see if they are willing to proofread it. Preferably one that doesn't work on the admissions council, possibly even the same university you apply to, just to get a feel for what it should look like. Your circumstances are so extenuating that I don't think anyone on this forum can offer you that much help in this area otherwise.

Finally, I agree that you should probably pursue advice from someone familiar with Ohio's character and fitness standards, as well as any other states you want to look at, before jumping over the cliff. Before going further, I am going to openly state that I find myself of the "scam" belief so what follows may appear biased. Anyway, I implore that you browse the Vale of Tears. Listen to some of the stories of people who could not break into the legal field, for one reason or another, and ended up putting an additional scarlet letter onto their resume for non-legal sector jobs. These are people who often took the plunge and just lost the bet. You are one of the few people with extenuating circumstances that, with a little vigilant research, could find out whether there is even a bet to be had BEFORE going to to law school and adjust your goals accordingly. Take advantage of that. Even if you managed to earn something like a free ride, there is no telling whether or not this field is going to be worth pursuing until you have a better idea of whether or not you can pass the character and fitness standards. Maybe I missed something, but it seems like the best you've offered is a newspaper article of someone else making it. While helpful, there is simply too much that might have been going on in the periphery of that story to assume that all of that will be true for you.

I appreciate your advice and your honesty. What exactly should I be aiming to have an admissions officer read - my addendum or the entire application? If the application, how would you reccommend going about it since I think most are probably online? Do you think I should just cold call/email admissions officers? Sorry if I seem a little helpless, but that suggestion sounds like a pretty good idea so I'm just brainstorming how to flesh it out. Where can I find the Vale of tears? Thanks again!