Take the money and Run; YS - CCNH? Forum

[muskies970]

Sorry guys lawl skool is the worst decision don't go unless RUBY at Chicago. you'll be doomed

[Theopliske8711]

Sorry guys lawl skool is the worst decision don't go unless RUBY at Chicago. you'll be doomed

You're crossing from contrarian shtick to near full-on troll...

[A. Nony Mouse]

This board gets so irritating shitty when the topic of UG education or the possibility of other things to do in life besides being a lawyer comes up.

I know other options exist, I just don't think they require substantially less work or are substantially less risky

But they also don't cost $300k. And if you're going to compare other options at least be honest about it rather than throwing out "sub-50k for the rest of your life" bullshit.

(I mean, I actually agree that paying sticker isn't always a death sentence, but you're not helping your argument.)

[cotiger]

This board gets so irritating shitty when the topic of UG education or the possibility of other things to do in life besides being a lawyer comes up.

I know other options exist, I just don't think they require substantially less work or are substantially less risky

Oh. Well if you're just looking for the most risk-less way to make a large amount of money, idk.. Not something I've ever really thought about explicitly.

[muskies970]

This board gets so irritating shitty when the topic of UG education or the possibility of other things to do in life besides being a lawyer comes up.

I know other options exist, I just don't think they require substantially less work or are substantially less risky

Oh. Well if you're just looking for the most risk-less way to make a large amount of money, idk.. Not something I've ever really thought about explicitly.

DF's original point is that money was all that matters, I don't see a less risky way of making a lot of it then sticker debt at a T14, sure it'll suck up front and there's a chance of it not working out. but overall seems like a pretty decent shot compared to anything else. with a fallback IBR payment if things don't go well.

Or one can settle for ~50-75k salary (who knows maybe it'll go up closer to 100k eventually)
with no risk involved.

[thisiswater]

I'm an 0L with a stupid degree from a not-fancy college and, in my experience and the experience of most of the people I know, this is just not true. There is still plenty of options without law school. (And yes, before you ask, I make significantly more than 50k a year and work somewhere between 45 and 50 hours a week)

Such as...

I'm a paralegal at a private equity firm. If I stay here, at some point I will be senior paralegal. Even without a title change, I will continue to get my yearly raise and my benefits become more and more generous as time goes on. If I leave my current company for someplace with more legal staff there would be more options for promotions.

On a sidenote- If you are an 0L and you are unconvinced about your law school options, please please PLEASE register with a couple of recruiting/staffing agencies and see what's out there. CList is trash, LinkedIn jobs get spammed like crazy, but there are jobs out there and if you feel unsure then you should at least explore it. Lots of companies, including mine, only hire through those types of agencies

[muskies970]

I'm an 0L with a stupid degree from a not-fancy college and, in my experience and the experience of most of the people I know, this is just not true. There is still plenty of options without law school. (And yes, before you ask, I make significantly more than 50k a year and work somewhere between 45 and 50 hours a week)

Such as...

I'm a paralegal at a private equity firm. If I stay here, at some point I will be senior paralegal. Even without a title change, I will continue to get my yearly raise and my benefits become more and more generous as time goes on. If I leave my current company for someplace with more legal staff there would be more options for promotions.

On a sidenote- If you are an 0L and you are unconvinced about your law school options, please please PLEASE register with a couple of recruiting/staffing agencies and see what's out there. CList is trash, LinkedIn jobs get spammed like crazy, but there are jobs out there and if you feel unsure then you should at least explore it. Lots of companies, including mine, only hire through those types of agencies

How many hours do you work as a paralegal? What are the salary increases? Is the work enjoyable? Is there more competition as you rise higher in the ranks?

[thisiswater]

I'm an 0L with a stupid degree from a not-fancy college and, in my experience and the experience of most of the people I know, this is just not true. There is still plenty of options without law school. (And yes, before you ask, I make significantly more than 50k a year and work somewhere between 45 and 50 hours a week)

Such as...

I'm a paralegal at a private equity firm. If I stay here, at some point I will be senior paralegal. Even without a title change, I will continue to get my yearly raise and my benefits become more and more generous as time goes on. If I leave my current company for someplace with more legal staff there would be more options for promotions.

On a sidenote- If you are an 0L and you are unconvinced about your law school options, please please PLEASE register with a couple of recruiting/staffing agencies and see what's out there. CList is trash, LinkedIn jobs get spammed like crazy, but there are jobs out there and if you feel unsure then you should at least explore it. Lots of companies, including mine, only hire through those types of agencies

How many hours do you work as a paralegal? What are the salary increases? Is the work enjoyable? Is there more competition as you rise higher in the ranks?

It's 8-5, 8-4 on Fridays. Occasionally I work late or come in early although that's usually an hour at most. A really heavy week with closings happening might balloon up to 50 hours but that would be rare. It has been 5% for the past 3 years. Yeah, I like my job a lot. It is a job so it isn't perfect but I like it. No, not especially.

[didntgo89072014]

This board gets so irritating shitty when the topic of UG education or the possibility of other things to do in life besides being a lawyer comes up.

I know other options exist, I just don't think they require substantially less work or are substantially less risky

Oh. Well if you're just looking for the most risk-less way to make a large amount of money, idk.. Not something I've ever really thought about explicitly.

DF's original point is that money was all that matters, I don't see a less risky way of making a lot of it then sticker debt at a T14, sure it'll suck up front and there's a chance of it not working out. but overall seems like a pretty decent shot compared to anything else. with a fallback IBR payment if things don't go well.

Or one can settle for ~50-75k salary (who knows maybe it'll go up closer to 100k eventually)
with no risk involved.

Are you kidding me? You must be trolling.

For stable career prospects with lots of room to grow to 100k and beyond, How about:
Strategy consulting
Economics consulting
Investment banking
Risk management and analytics
IT consulting
UX designer
Mobile developer
Software developer
Corporate finance
Portfolio management
Product design
Product management
Financial adviser
Insurance sales
Brokerage sales
Venture capital
Private equity
Hedge fund

This represents maybe 30% of available career paths for smart, ambitious people. If the best you can imagine for a college grad is 300k debt and a 3 year opportunity cost for a good shot at a 4 year stint in big law you must have no imagination whatsoever.

[muskies970]

It's 8-5, 8-4 on Fridays. Occasionally I work late or come in early Although that's usually an hour at most. It has been 5% for the past 3 years. Yeah, I like my job a lot. It is a job so it isn't perfect but I like it. No, not especially.

That sounds nothing like any other paralegal I've talked to, but I'm happy for you. Maybe we should all drop out of law school and be paralegals?

And to be clear, the highest 10% of paralegals make $75,000.

[SemperLegal]

This board gets so irritating shitty when the topic of UG education or the possibility of other things to do in life besides being a lawyer comes up.

I know other options exist, I just don't think they require substantially less work or are substantially less risky

Oh. Well if you're just looking for the most risk-less way to make a large amount of money, idk.. Not something I've ever really thought about explicitly.

DF's original point is that money was all that matters, I don't see a less risky way of making a lot of it then sticker debt at a T14, sure it'll suck up front and there's a chance of it not working out. but overall seems like a pretty decent shot compared to anything else. with a fallback IBR payment if things don't go well.

Or one can settle for ~50-75k salary (who knows maybe it'll go up closer to 100k eventually)
with no risk involved.

Biglaw = 160k ($125k after taxes)
Average student payments per year are $22,318.56 (with no deduction due to phaseout)
Net value per year $103k

Even worse
Average salary while in law school=$0
Value of three years of $60k a year after taxes net for present value= $154,000

So to compare:

W/law school= 50% chance of $103k a year for 3-5 years and then a likely downward bump to high five figures
w/o law school= $52k a year, with gradual raises over a life time and a NPV head start of $154k

[thisiswater]

It's 8-5, 8-4 on Fridays. Occasionally I work late or come in early Although that's usually an hour at most. It has been 5% for the past 3 years. Yeah, I like my job a lot. It is a job so it isn't perfect but I like it. No, not especially.

That sounds nothing like any other paralegal I've talked to, but I'm happy for you. Maybe we should all drop out of law school and be paralegals?

And to be clear, the highest 10% of paralegals make $75,000.

As I said, I am not a BigLaw paralegal. I am in house at a private equity firm. One of my coworkers moved over from biglaw and she always says her life there was hell

[Hipster but Athletic]

You guys are all fucking wankers. Muskies is right. Living poor for only ten years after law school is hardly a problem. He who wakes up and finds himself successful has not been asleep. You'll work for 40 years. Being rich from 34 onward is hardly a bad way to live.

[Holly Golightly]

It's 8-5, 8-4 on Fridays. Occasionally I work late or come in early Although that's usually an hour at most. It has been 5% for the past 3 years. Yeah, I like my job a lot. It is a job so it isn't perfect but I like it. No, not especially.

That sounds nothing like any other paralegal I've talked to, but I'm happy for you. Maybe we should all drop out of law school and be paralegals?

And to be clear, the highest 10% of paralegals make $75,000.

Median $47k in 2012, and in most states you don't need any type of certification/extra schooling, and can even do it with an associate's degree. And this includes "legal assistants."

http://www.bls.gov/ooh/legal/paralegals ... stants.htm

[Dafaq]

I'm a paralegal at a private equity firm. If I stay here, at some point I will be senior paralegal. Even without a title change, I will continue to get my yearly raise and my benefits become more and more generous as time goes on.

I assume you had to incur tuition debt (of some kind) to be a paralegal. Basically how long in school and how much? During my SA time I always wanted to ask but never did.

[Holly Golightly]

I'm a paralegal at a private equity firm. If I stay here, at some point I will be senior paralegal. Even without a title change, I will continue to get my yearly raise and my benefits become more and more generous as time goes on.

I assume you had to incur tuition debt (of some kind) to be a paralegal. Basically how long in school and how much? During my SA time I always wanted to ask but never did.

I was a paralegal with a random Bachelor's degree. You can do it with an associates if you can get somewhere to hire you. Only a few states require certification.

[Hipster but Athletic]

I'm a paralegal at a private equity firm. If I stay here, at some point I will be senior paralegal. Even without a title change, I will continue to get my yearly raise and my benefits become more and more generous as time goes on.

I assume you had to incur tuition debt (of some kind) to be a paralegal. Basically how long in school and how much? During my SA time I always wanted to ask but never did.

I was a paralegal with a random Bachelor's degree. You can do it with an associates if you can get somewhere to hire you. Only a few states require certification.

This is shitty advice. It's advice for being average. All the roads to success are uphill.

[muskies970]

It's 8-5, 8-4 on Fridays. Occasionally I work late or come in early Although that's usually an hour at most. It has been 5% for the past 3 years. Yeah, I like my job a lot. It is a job so it isn't perfect but I like it. No, not especially.

That sounds nothing like any other paralegal I've talked to, but I'm happy for you. Maybe we should all drop out of law school and be paralegals?

And to be clear, the highest 10% of paralegals make $75,000.

Median $47k in 2012, and in most states you don't need any type of certification/extra schooling, and can even do it with an associate's degree. And this includes "legal assistants."

http://www.bls.gov/ooh/legal/paralegals ... stants.htm

So after taxes in NYC you'll be brining home ~30k (and that's median paralegal so half are below).

Doesn't sound much different than DF, but at least after he pays off loans he'll have a higher salary...

[thisiswater]

I'm a paralegal at a private equity firm. If I stay here, at some point I will be senior paralegal. Even without a title change, I will continue to get my yearly raise and my benefits become more and more generous as time goes on.

I assume you had to incur tuition debt (of some kind) to be a paralegal. Basically how long in school and how much? During my SA time I always wanted to ask but never did.

I had to have a college degree but my company didn't need a paralegal certification. My college was paid for with a combo of parents and scholarships. I had basically no legal experience (some receptionist work during college) and I got the job through a staffing firm.

I am not in NYC

[A. Nony Mouse]

It's 8-5, 8-4 on Fridays. Occasionally I work late or come in early Although that's usually an hour at most. It has been 5% for the past 3 years. Yeah, I like my job a lot. It is a job so it isn't perfect but I like it. No, not especially.

That sounds nothing like any other paralegal I've talked to, but I'm happy for you. Maybe we should all drop out of law school and be paralegals?

And to be clear, the highest 10% of paralegals make $75,000.

Median $47k in 2012, and in most states you don't need any type of certification/extra schooling, and can even do it with an associate's degree. And this includes "legal assistants."

http://www.bls.gov/ooh/legal/paralegals ... stants.htm

So after taxes in NYC you'll be brining home ~30k (and that's median paralegal so half are below).

Doesn't sound much different than DF, but at least after he pays off loans he'll have a higher salary...

No one is saying that being a paralegal is the same as going to biglaw. Stop moving the fucking goalposts.

[muskies970]

For stable career prospects with lots of room to grow to 100k and beyond, How about:
Strategy consulting
Economics consulting
Investment banking
Risk management and analytics
IT consulting
UX designer
Mobile developer
Software developer
Corporate finance
Portfolio management
Product design
Product management
Financial adviser
Insurance sales
Brokerage sales
Venture capital
Private equity
Hedge fund

This represents maybe 30% of available career paths for smart, ambitious people. If the best you can imagine for a college grad is 300k debt and a 3 year opportunity cost for a good shot at a 4 year stint in big law you must have no imagination whatsoever.

But again in any of those jobs, just like in biglaw, if you want to be successful you'll have to be working 70+ hours a week easy...

[muskies970]

No one is saying that being a paralegal is the same as going to biglaw. Stop moving the fucking goalposts.

you're right, they're arguing it's better...

[thisiswater]

No one is saying that being a paralegal is the same as going to biglaw. Stop moving the fucking goalposts.

you're right, they're arguing it's better...

No, I'm arguing that your assertion on the last page that 50k for your entire career is the only other possibility without law school is bullshit. It's an option. There are lots of options if you look for them. Good careers with potential for growth that don't come with 200+ in loan debt to begin.

[A. Nony Mouse]

No one is saying that being a paralegal is the same as going to biglaw. Stop moving the fucking goalposts.

you're right, they're arguing it's better...

No. You said it was law school or sub-50k for life. Being a paralegal was an example of not going to law school, yet not making sub-50k for life. You're the one coming up with new arguments about making more money and being easier and whatever.

[Power_of_Facing]

For stable career prospects with lots of room to grow to 100k and beyond, How about:
Strategy consulting
Economics consulting
Investment banking
Risk management and analytics
IT consulting
UX designer
Mobile developer
Software developer
Corporate finance
Portfolio management
Product design
Product management
Financial adviser
Insurance sales
Brokerage sales
Venture capital
Private equity
Hedge fund

This represents maybe 30% of available career paths for smart, ambitious people. If the best you can imagine for a college grad is 300k debt and a 3 year opportunity cost for a good shot at a 4 year stint in big law you must have no imagination whatsoever.

But again in any of those jobs, just like in biglaw, if you want to be successful you'll have to be working 70+ hours a week easy...

Not true of software developers...