Columbia vs. NYU vs. Berkeley Forum

[orangered]

More troublingly, Berkeley's OCI success rates are about 20-25% weaker than CN. This means that even if one buys the argument that more Boalt students are skipping OCI to do public interest, among those students who want to work for a big firm, it's considerably more difficult. Every Berkeley student on TLS will probably tell you that everyone got a good job, or that strike-outs actually just get gigs outside of OCI, ect., but there's hard data showing 65-70% success rates at Berkeley (compared to 92% this year at CLS).

I'm curious. Do you have a source for Berkeley's OCI success rate?

[cavalier1138]

Thanks for the lively discussion everyone. So it really seems like the culture and vibe aspect is more or less manufactured and probably shouldn't play in such a huge role.

However, could anyone speak on my (perhaps unfounded) concern for life after BigLaw? I know that my future career will result from what I make of it and has more to do with my level of involvement in a variety of interests, but does Columbia offer the same networking opportunities as NYU in nonprofit work?

Actually, I'm curious now, because you keep mentioning biglaw as a sort of temporary occupation that you (at least from reading your posts) seem to feel obligated to pursue. Do you actually want to go in to biglaw? Or are you more interested in pursuing PI/government work?

If it's the latter, it will change some of the answers here.

[dabigchina]

Not OP, but in a similar position. Can anyone comment on Columbia's student body? Met people from other schools who were extremely against Columbia. Lots of stories of how people only had like 1-2 friends

I've heard terrible things about the admin from students there

This. The admin seems to think their only job is to make our lives more miserable and creating new hoops to jump through (making 1Ls come 3 weeks earlier to sit in on a useless P/F class, adding 40 hours of pro bono to graduate)

[jbagelboy]

Not OP, but in a similar position. Can anyone comment on Columbia's student body? Met people from other schools who were extremely against Columbia. Lots of stories of how people only had like 1-2 friends

I've heard terrible things about the admin from students there

This. The admin seems to think their only job is to make our lives more miserable and creating new hoops to jump through (making 1Ls come 3 weeks earlier to sit in on a useless P/F class, adding 40 hours of pro bono to graduate)

I think legal methods actually makes the early 1L experience less stressful because it eases you into how to do law school w/o any academic consequences

Also its basically like a three week party

[jbagelboy]

Since you want NY Biglaw, NYU and CLS offer the same shot and you should go with whichever one is cheaper.

Cal offers way better chances for CA generally and Bay Area specifically. Think hard about where you want your first job to be.

It does not offer "way better" chances for CA generally.

[rpupkin]

Since you want NY Biglaw, NYU and CLS offer the same shot and you should go with whichever one is cheaper.

Cal offers way better chances for CA generally and Bay Area specifically. Think hard about where you want your first job to be.

It does not offer "way better" chances for CA generally.

Agreed. I'd say that CLS and Berkeley are roughly equivalent for SoCal, with Berkeley having an edge (but not a "way better" edge) in SF/SV.

[jbagelboy]

More troublingly, Berkeley's OCI success rates are about 20-25% weaker than CN. This means that even if one buys the argument that more Boalt students are skipping OCI to do public interest, among those students who want to work for a big firm, it's considerably more difficult. Every Berkeley student on TLS will probably tell you that everyone got a good job, or that strike-outs actually just get gigs outside of OCI, ect., but there's hard data showing 65-70% success rates at Berkeley (compared to 92% this year at CLS).

I'm curious. Do you have a source for Berkeley's OCI success rate?

There's tons of publicly available information for 2013-2015. Here's one example: https://www.law.berkeley.edu/files/care ... tation.pdf. Roughly 60% of all 2Ls received at least one offer out of 85% participating in OCI (EIW), meaning ~70% success among those who sought jobs in 2014. In 2013, it was similar (around 67% I believe).

[dabigchina]

More troublingly, Berkeley's OCI success rates are about 20-25% weaker than CN. This means that even if one buys the argument that more Boalt students are skipping OCI to do public interest, among those students who want to work for a big firm, it's considerably more difficult. Every Berkeley student on TLS will probably tell you that everyone got a good job, or that strike-outs actually just get gigs outside of OCI, ect., but there's hard data showing 65-70% success rates at Berkeley (compared to 92% this year at CLS).

I'm curious. Do you have a source for Berkeley's OCI success rate?

There's tons of publicly available information for 2013-2015. Here's one example: https://www.law.berkeley.edu/files/care ... tation.pdf. Roughly 60% of all 2Ls received at least one offer out of 85% participating in OCI (EIW), meaning ~70% success among those who sought jobs in 2014. In 2013, it was similar (around 67% I believe).

I'd be curious what their CA callback/offer ratio is. CLS's is pretty low.

[jbagelboy]

More troublingly, Berkeley's OCI success rates are about 20-25% weaker than CN. This means that even if one buys the argument that more Boalt students are skipping OCI to do public interest, among those students who want to work for a big firm, it's considerably more difficult. Every Berkeley student on TLS will probably tell you that everyone got a good job, or that strike-outs actually just get gigs outside of OCI, ect., but there's hard data showing 65-70% success rates at Berkeley (compared to 92% this year at CLS).

I'm curious. Do you have a source for Berkeley's OCI success rate?

There's tons of publicly available information for 2013-2015. Here's one example: https://www.law.berkeley.edu/files/care ... tation.pdf. Roughly 60% of all 2Ls received at least one offer out of 85% participating in OCI (EIW), meaning ~70% success among those who sought jobs in 2014. In 2013, it was similar (around 67% I believe).

I'd be curious what their CA callback/offer ratio is. CLS's is pretty low.

Cb->Offer is firm specific, not school specific. I'm confused what you mean by this or why it matters. S&C, for example, will offer nearly every callback at any school, whereas dpw will call back more people but offer only half or less thsn half at every school. What's important is that students are receiving at least one SA offer, not that the top students are receiving 15 offers.

[pleasehelpplease]

Thanks for the lively discussion everyone. So it really seems like the culture and vibe aspect is more or less manufactured and probably shouldn't play in such a huge role.

However, could anyone speak on my (perhaps unfounded) concern for life after BigLaw? I know that my future career will result from what I make of it and has more to do with my level of involvement in a variety of interests, but does Columbia offer the same networking opportunities as NYU in nonprofit work?

Actually, I'm curious now, because you keep mentioning biglaw as a sort of temporary occupation that you (at least from reading your posts) seem to feel obligated to pursue. Do you actually want to go in to biglaw? Or are you more interested in pursuing PI/government work?

If it's the latter, it will change some of the answers here.

That's the thing. I haven't been exposed to anything so it's hard to know where I want to end up. Most of what I know comes more from anecdotes that, while unreliable, is all I have to go on. I don't know if BigLaw will be for me, but I'd like to try it out and hopefully pay off my loans with it. Like most people, I value work-life balance and I'm wear of BigLaw and how crushing it is. So in order to set myself up for a career after the much talked about burnout, I'd like to choose the best school that affords me the opportunity to go to PI/Gov if needed. I have a particular niche that I would love to get involved with that I can PM you about.

[cavalier1138]

Thanks for the lively discussion everyone. So it really seems like the culture and vibe aspect is more or less manufactured and probably shouldn't play in such a huge role.

However, could anyone speak on my (perhaps unfounded) concern for life after BigLaw? I know that my future career will result from what I make of it and has more to do with my level of involvement in a variety of interests, but does Columbia offer the same networking opportunities as NYU in nonprofit work?

Actually, I'm curious now, because you keep mentioning biglaw as a sort of temporary occupation that you (at least from reading your posts) seem to feel obligated to pursue. Do you actually want to go in to biglaw? Or are you more interested in pursuing PI/government work?

If it's the latter, it will change some of the answers here.

That's the thing. I haven't been exposed to anything so it's hard to know where I want to end up. Most of what I know comes more from anecdotes that, while unreliable, is all I have to go on. I don't know if BigLaw will be for me, but I'd like to try it out and hopefully pay off my loans with it. Like most people, I value work-life balance and I'm wear of BigLaw and how crushing it is. So in order to set myself up for a career after the much talked about burnout, I'd like to choose the best school that affords me the opportunity to go to PI/Gov if needed. I have a particular niche that I would love to get involved with that I can PM you about.

Feel free to PM. Just be aware in advance that I'm a 0L, so anything I say is not based on first-hand experience.

[Tempo]

Since you want NY Biglaw, NYU and CLS offer the same shot and you should go with whichever one is cheaper.

Cal offers way better chances for CA generally and Bay Area specifically. Think hard about where you want your first job to be.

It does not offer "way better" chances for CA generally.

Agreed. I'd say that CLS and Berkeley are roughly equivalent for SoCal, with Berkeley having an edge (but not a "way better" edge) in SF/SV.

And does NYU fall below these two for SoCal?

[rpupkin]

Since you want NY Biglaw, NYU and CLS offer the same shot and you should go with whichever one is cheaper.

Cal offers way better chances for CA generally and Bay Area specifically. Think hard about where you want your first job to be.

It does not offer "way better" chances for CA generally.

Agreed. I'd say that CLS and Berkeley are roughly equivalent for SoCal, with Berkeley having an edge (but not a "way better" edge) in SF/SV.

And does NYU fall below these two for SoCal?

Maybe by a little. If my goal was LA big law, and if I was choosing between CLS and NYU at equal cost, I'd probably go to CLS. But the difference--if it exists--is fairly small.

[landshoes]

I feel like vibe is real, and fit is real, but it's personal and not something you can really pick up via implausible anecdotes.