Deleted Post Forum

[rpupkin]

USNWR will release the 2017 ranking during the second or third week of March. Expect some major shake-ups this year.

You're freakin me out man lol. I'm confused, how would you know this? Do you work for US News?

I do not work for US News, but I have a couple of connections on the inside.

Any word on movement of H and S? I'm trying to decide between the two and the USNews ranking will most likely end up determining which one I pick. I don't think I could bear the shame of depositing at Stanford only to have it fall below Harvard in the rankings.

It appears that the top 3 won't change (i.e., SLS and HLS will remain tied), but I haven't fully confirmed that. I have long worried about SLS falling a bit. It's only a matter of time before its lack of Ivy League status will hurt it relative to its more prestigious peers. For now, though, SLS appears to be hanging tough.

[cantorb]

USNWR will release the 2017 ranking during the second or third week of March. Expect some major shake-ups this year.

You're freakin me out man lol. I'm confused, how would you know this? Do you work for US News?

I do not work for US News, but I have a couple of connections on the inside.

Any word on movement of H and S? I'm trying to decide between the two and the USNews ranking will most likely end up determining which one I pick. I don't think I could bear the shame of depositing at Stanford only to have it fall below Harvard in the rankings.

It appears that the top 3 won't change (i.e., SLS and HLS will remain tied), but I haven't fully confirmed that. I have long worried about SLS falling a bit. It's only a matter of time before its lack of Ivy League status will hurt it relative to its more prestigious peers. For now, though, SLS appears to be hanging tough.

I would be very surprised if Stanford remained tied with Harvard, considering that not did its LSAT/GPA numbers fall but also its yield and acceptance rates (acceptance went up).

[KiltedKicker]

Any word on movement of H and S? I'm trying to decide between the two and the USNews ranking will most likely end up determining which one I pick. I don't think I could bear the shame of depositing at Stanford only to have it fall below Harvard in the rankings.

Stanford and Harvard are such drastically different schools in so many ways. Size, location, specialties, culture to name a couple of the main ones. And yet, they both have incredible employment stats and a pretty equal prestige as top 3 schools. Employers aren't going to give a shit if the school you attended is 2 or 3, and if they do personally that's not someone I would really want to work for. It seems to me that there are considerations that will ultimately impact you far, far more than which is 2 and which is 3.

...but then again I'm a somewhat borderline candidate hoping to get into Stanford, so you should definitely pick Harvard

[urbanist11]

I know it's hard to detect sarcasm on the Internet... But come on now you guys

[WinterComing]

I know it's hard to detect sarcasm on the Internet... But come on now you guys

+180

[rpupkin]

I would be very surprised if Stanford remained tied with Harvard, considering that not did its LSAT/GPA numbers fall but also its yield and acceptance rates (acceptance went up).

There are many factors that dictate USNWR ranking. You're focusing on just a couple of them. Always remember: it's the big picture that matters, not the individual details.

[cantorb]

I would be very surprised if Stanford remained tied with Harvard, considering that not did its LSAT/GPA numbers fall but also its yield and acceptance rates (acceptance went up).

There are many factors that dictate USNWR ranking. You're focusing on just a couple of them. Always remember: it's the big picture that matters, not the individual details.

True, but there is a generally accepted breakdown of how much each factor counts, and those 4 all combined equal a pretty high percentage.

[Emperor of Ice-Cream]

Michigan is dropping down to GULC's level in terms of placement, which is not going to do it any favors.

It's always a bad idea to listen to 0Ls. Within the t14, rankings don't matter as much as your resume, personality, and experience (if you bid smart at OCI, grades don't even matter as much as these things, IME). Go where you have to pay the least.

Also, Michigan's placement for c/o 2015 and 2016 was very good. In my section of 80, maybe 5-10 people who wanted a job at OCI didn't get one. My sense is that at least 75% of people who wanted BL got it, but we'll see when the numbers come out.

[rpupkin]

Michigan is dropping down to GULC's level in terms of placement, which is not going to do it any favors.

It's always a bad idea to listen to 0Ls. Within the t14, rankings don't matter as much as your resume, personality, and experience (if you bid smart at OCI, grades don't even matter as much as these things, IME). Go where you have to pay the least.

Also, Michigan's placement for c/o 2015 and 2016 was very good. In my section of 80, maybe 5-10 people who wanted a job at OCI didn't get one. My sense is that at least 75% of people who wanted BL got it, but we'll see when the numbers come out.

Although I more or less agree with your first paragraph, I've learned to be wary of anecdotes like the one you shared in the second paragraph. When GULC's employment numbers started declining a few years ago, TLS was full of posts from GULC students stating that pretty much everyone who wants big law at GULC gets it. I don't think the students were lying or being intentionally misleading, but their anecdata wasn't as representative as they believed.

[Biglaw1990]

.

[Biglaw1990]

.

[RedWhite&Blonde]

USNWR will release the 2017 ranking during the second or third week of March. Expect some major shake-ups this year.

You're freakin me out man lol. I'm confused, how would you know this? Do you work for US News?

I do not work for US News, but I have a couple of connections on the inside.

Any word on movement of H and S? I'm trying to decide between the two and the USNews ranking will most likely end up determining which one I pick. I don't think I could bear the shame of depositing at Stanford only to have it fall below Harvard in the rankings.

Stanford's Class of 2018 LSAT median is the same as Columbia's, and Columbia has a better BL%. You do the math.

Also I can confirm rpupkin's post. Penn will be a lot closer to where it should be after this year's rankings come out.

You mean higher or lower?

[rpupkin]

That is correct. Penn will be #6, considering its exceptional Biglaw placement.

Exceptional big law placement is the most significant factor in the USNWR rankings. It explains why Cornell is ranked #1 and YLS is ranked #13.

[pterodactyls]

Just want to throw it out there that the 2017 pokemon rankings were recently released:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... it=pokemon

[WinterComing]

Just want to throw it out there that the 2017 pokemon rankings were recently released:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... it=pokemon

As a current magazine editor, I feel confident in saying that when USNWR goes out of business in a few years, rankings-obsessed 0Ls will be forced to make their law school decisions based solely on your Pokemon thread.

[Winter is Coming]

Love rpupkin on these threads.

ETA: Hey WinterComing nice username.

[Biglaw1990]

.

[jbagelboy]

Just want to throw it out there that the 2017 pokemon rankings were recently released:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... it=pokemon

As a current magazine editor, I feel confident in saying that when USNWR goes out of business in a few years, rankings-obsessed 0Ls will be forced to make their law school decisions based solely on your Pokemon thread.

thank you.

no offense, but as you probably know, commercial magazine survey rankings are such epic bullshit. I don't understand why people continue to make such important choices based on tiny deviations in the list of one of them.

[GreenEggs]

USNWR will release the 2017 ranking during the second or third week of March. Expect some major shake-ups this year.

Why?

I can't get specific at this point, but I'll drop some hints after I confirm a couple of the more intriguing leaks.

CLS falls to 6 NYU moves up to tie with Chi. CLS becomes the butt of T5 jokes.

[WinterComing]

thank you.

no offense, but as you probably know, commercial magazine survey rankings are such epic bullshit. I don't understand why people continue to make such important choices based on tiny deviations in the list of one of them.

Well, sure, but is it the magazine's fault for making the list or the people's fault for putting too much stock in it? As you probably know, it's the second that perpetuates the first. And just so we're clear, US News and World Report is no longer a printed news magazine. It's just in the rankings business.

Also, you may or may not know that there used to be a similarly powerful and problematic ranking of creative writing MFA programs put out by Poets & Writers magazine. Eventually, the colleges on the list revolted, together publishing an open letter criticizing the methodology. After that, the magazine stopped ranking schools.

Obviously, the situation with law schools is quite different, with much higher stakes for both the students and the institutions, but couldn't they do the same?

[fliptrip]

^^of course, but sorting is human nature. For instance, I know shit about MFA programs or rankings, but I am pretty sure that Iowa has an excellent one or the best one or something like that. So even if USNWR goes poof tomorrow, we will still be arguing about whether Penn belongs in the same conversation with [insert schools here].

[ms9]

The last two releases have been

March 10th
March 11th

I've been fortunate enough to get them a day before the last 4 years and will have them a day before again, this year. And we are having the "Predict the Top 25" again this year, again with prizes:

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3#p9175663

[duck]

everything


will



change

[rpupkin]

everything


will



change

Well, everything won't change, but some some things definitely will. I was able to confirm this afternoon that there will be a major shift for one of the schools ranked between 7 and 11. This will be a sub-tier-shattering change. Also, a school currently ranked in the 20s is about to drop like a stone. We're looking at an unprecedented free fall.

Hang on tight.

[WinterComing]

^^of course, but sorting is human nature. For instance, I know shit about MFA programs or rankings, but I am pretty sure that Iowa has an excellent one or the best one or something like that. So even if USNWR goes poof tomorrow, we will still be arguing about whether Penn belongs in the same conversation with [insert schools here].

The reputation of Iowa's MFA program is a lot like the lay prestige of Harvard (and Iowa's inclusion in Girls was pretty similar to Harvard's in Legally Blonde). But I think that's something a little different than the USNWR rankings. I agree with you 100 percent that people will rank schools regardless, but perhaps they'll do it based on stuff that really matters. Probably not.