T14 - How much debt would you accept to go Forum

[FSK]

Just to shoot out some arbitrary numbers for what I'd feel comfortable with:
$220k at YHS
$180k at CCN
$160k at P
$150k at VB
$120k at MDNCG

You've basically quantiifed small percentage increases in chances at biglaw + fed clerk (and the preftiege of biglaw + fedclerk you can get).

I'm skeptical that small increases are worth 10-30k.

[ymmv]

Given how different the reasons to go to Yale vs. Stanford or HLS often are, I'm skeptical of them even being lumped in the same price bracket to begin with.

[Yea All Right]

So only attend a T14 if you get a full ride? Lol ooooooook. Your mileage may vary indeed.

There is years' (of debt repayment) worth of mileage between "full ride" and "close to a full ride."

Ok true but I still stand by my statement, imo close to full ride is > 75% and < 100%

[star fox]

It's just a personal matter of how risk-averse you are. Splitters gotta do what a splitter's gotta do which is take on big debt or don't go. I'm not even sure how credited 'just take a full ride at a strong regional' is in those instances. You're still only improving one median at the expense of the other. If you can look at the job prospects and say you're willing to do it, then do what works for you.

If you have a 3.9 then going at sticker is objectively stupid. Re-take.

[MidwestLifer]

As a potential K-JD with some fairly hirable degrees/skills, I'm only going to go this cycle if my total debt load is less than $60k (accounting for 2L SA money). Otherwise I'll happily take the break and build up some savings and experience.

[Tiago Splitter]

As a potential K-JD with some fairly hirable degrees/skills, I'm only going to go this cycle if my total debt load is less than $60k (accounting for 2L SA money). Otherwise I'll happily take the break and build up some savings and experience.

(3.9/178)

Please don't be one of those assholes who counts on 30k of SA money.

[star fox]

TCR

(LSDAS GPA: 3.9)

Don't need a 3.9 to get a full ride at a regional flagship.

Not in a lot of regions. Sure, if your region is Minnesota then great, but what happens if your region is Los Angeles? You're much better off not going than taking the 3/4 offer from Loyola.

When you have a mediocre GPA like mine and plan to start in Biglaw you either need to pony up some cash or pick a new career. Heading to the shithole state flagship shouldn't be an option. Telling someone with biglaw goals to take the full ride at Alabama over 100k at Penn is just terrible advice, the kind of garbage people read that pushes back the whole anti-law school movement.

All this time I just thought you were a Spurs fan. I don't know why I never made that connection.

[star fox]

TCR

(LSDAS GPA: 3.9)

Don't need a 3.9 to get a full ride at a regional flagship.

Not in a lot of regions. Sure, if your region is Minnesota then great, but what happens if your region is Los Angeles? You're much better off not going than taking the 3/4 offer from Loyola.

When you have a mediocre GPA like mine and plan to start in Biglaw you either need to pony up some cash or pick a new career. Heading to the shithole state flagship shouldn't be an option. Telling someone with biglaw goals to take the full ride at Alabama over 100k at Penn is just terrible advice, the kind of garbage people read that pushes back the whole anti-law school movement.

All this time I just thought you were a Spurs fan. I don't know why I never made that connection.

[MidwestLifer]

I understand that taxes/rent/wasting money is a thing, so I promise I won't.

[Yea All Right]

Please don't be one of those assholes who counts on 30k of SA money.

Hahah I was just going to say the same thing.

[Yea All Right]

All this time I just thought you were a Spurs fan. I don't know why I never made that connection.

Woah whattt. I think I figured it out once but forgot until now. Guessing he's both lol.

[gnomgnomuch]

This is all entirely subjective.

I'd kill to live in Cali and go to Berk/Stanford, so I'd pay 150k for B and sticker for S, but I don't want to live in Ithaca or Chicago, so I'd better be under 100k for Cornell and 150/120 for Chicago and NU respectively to even consider it. Others might have the exact opposite of what I have.

For me:
HYS - Sticker or close to it.
C- 175k would be pushing it.
NYU/C/B - 150k
The lower t-14's - really not more than a 100k -120k depending on the school.


But again, these are the numbers I would be comfortable with, others might see 150k for B and go "are you insane, it's not worth more than 100k in debt."

[kevgogators]

Sticker at Golden Gate Law

[FSK]

This is all entirely subjective.

I'd kill to live in Cali and go to Berk/Stanford, so I'd pay 150k for B and sticker for S, but I don't want to live in Ithaca or Chicago, so I'd better be under 100k for Cornell and 150/120 for Chicago and NU respectively to even consider it. Others might have the exact opposite of what I have.

For me:
HYS - Sticker or close to it.
C- 175k would be pushing it.
NYU/C/B - 150k
The lower t-14's - really not more than a 100k -120k depending on the school.


But again, these are the numbers I would be comfortable with, others might see 150k for B and go "are you insane, it's not worth more than 100k in debt."

This makes sense to me. You've taken real, quantifiable preferences - placing into LA/SF/PA - and said you'll pay a premium for that.

[nordi]

One problem with the way you're all viewing this is that it doesn't seem to account for the fact that it's easier to be in the top 40 percent of the class at Duke or Cornell than at Columbia or Harvard. By some amount, I think that's likely true. My options from Michigan include the most prestigious firms in the country because I am near the top of my class. I think there's a good chance that I wouldn't be looking at the same options had I ended up at Yale or Harvard (although the public interest options would likely be better). It's hard to know if there's a real difference when so few people have gone to multiple schools, but I think you're over pricing the difference.

Having said that, I will be keeping my debt under $120,000, and I think it would frustrate me if it were in the $200,000 range. The vast majority of people who go into big law make it three years or so. By the time you're likely to be seriously thinking about moving on, it would be nice to have the debt paid off. I figure I can rid myself of $50,000 per year (half salary and bonus post tax, depending on local), so the $120,000 seems manageable.

[Mal Reynolds]

One problem with the way you're all viewing this is that it doesn't seem to account for the fact that it's easier to be in the top 40 percent of the class at Duke or Cornell than at Columbia or Harvard. By some amount, I think that's likely true. My options from Michigan include the most prestigious firms in the country because I am near the top of my class. I think there's a good chance that I wouldn't be looking at the same options had I ended up at Yale or Harvard (although the public interest options would likely be better). It's hard to know if there's a real difference when so few people have gone to multiple schools, but I think you're over pricing the difference.

Having said that, I will be keeping my debt under $120,000, and I think it would frustrate me if it were in the $200,000 range. The vast majority of people who go into big law make it three years or so. By the time you're likely to be seriously thinking about moving on, it would be nice to have the debt paid off. I figure I can rid myself of $50,000 per year (half salary and bonus post tax, depending on local), so the $120,000 seems manageable.

Lol no

[twenty]

basically just a thread to post debt numbers.

at some level, a 27-year old who's just been promoted to manager at starbucks who holds a 3.1 GPA in british literature from a meh undergrad but managed to pull off a 172 is in a much different position than a finance bro with a 3.8 from cornell who is thinking about a career change.

in the former, ED UVA or NU at sticker is pretty much the only opportunity the person has of getting the fuck out of post-graduation cyclical poverty, while in the latter the bro can probably hit 110k+ in a couple years. it doesn't make sense for a person like that to take a huge debt-cock when the status quo provides the same/better opportunities.

but it's not just a matter of potential increases, it's also a matter of risk/lost opportunity. starbucks bro has a maximum of three years of his life to lose in exchange for law school. worst case scenario, he goes back to managing a starbucks while making some minimal PAYE payment for the next 20 years. he might eventually get fucked by a tax bomb, but whatever.

meanwhile, finance bro easily misses out on 160k+ in lost salary, but also forecloses on his ability to get an MBA and continue in finance. it's a lot tougher to get back into finance once you've been out for three years than it would be going to starbucks, so finance bro may not even get the same job he had before, worst case scenario. even in a best case scenario where he gets biglaw, he'll be making substantially less money than if he'd stuck it out in finance because most of his salary goes to sallie.