SMU or ASU? Forum

[DawgDays]

The lower number of apps has forced SMU to change the way they do some things, so hopefully they'll throw some money your way for a good GPA.

I truly hope so. Every other private school so far has tossed me at least 10 grand, although I'd prefer more from SMU.

[BigZuck]

To answer all of (basically) the same questions at once, the reason is that I have guaranteed help provided I begin this upcoming school year. So, in point of fact, I won't be taking on six figures of debt, especially if I get a decent scholarship.

How come your benefactor doesn't want to put you in the best possible position to succeed? Tell Magwitch over there that its in your best interest to retake and reapply and then put that money toward a school that gives you a realistic shot at fulfilling your career goals.

Boomers are the worst man, let me tell you.

[rickgrimes69]

Are you URM? Unfortunately, SMU tends to favor LSAT over GPA when it comes to scholarships.

I think that SMU probably gives you a slightly higher chance of what you want, but is also very expensive. It's going to come down to the cost difference, ultimately , and go with whichever is less expensive.

No, I'm whiter than a snowflake and considerably less fun to throw at your friends.

You just sound less fun in general

[Capitol A]

I was in a similar situation, except nothing was stopping me from re-taking (except impatience, which I imagine is the case for most people). I would have preferred to live in Dallas, but the cost of attendance at SMU was outrageous compared to ASU, particularly compared to in-state at ASU. I know you aren't in-state now, but it's pretty easy to establish residency.
If you are big law or bust, then neither of these schools is right for you.
ASU has served me extremely well, but it is true that you must be in the top 5-10% of the class if you want to make 6 figures. Hell, if you want to have a job lined up before you get your bar results.
ASU (sort of) dominates the Phoenix market, but that is very small market, despite being a relatively large city. Also, many students from across the country want to come here after graduation. I had a fairly large summer class in regional big law, and it was only 3% ASU students. That was a larger % than any other school, but I had summer classmates from Harvard, UVA, Vandy, and a few other much better schools.
So...I know this might not be much help, but thought I would tell you about my experience. I would never tell anyone not to go to ASU, but you have to do so knowing that it is a significant gamble. I was choosing between several of the schools you listed there, so if you want more specifics on my situation, or my decision making process, feel free to PM me.

[keviiiiiiiiiiiin]

Hey folks, relatively simple question that I'm sure will begin WWIII. I've narrowed down my acceptance choices to both ASU and SMU, and (believe) that I would be fine living in either area for the rest of my life; simply put, what's the best bang for my buck? As to why I've narrowed it down to those two, either/both are most attractive to me in terms of living there not only for three years, but also forever.

As an unhelpful endnote, I've yet to receive my actual packages from either school, so I'm not sure what the COA would be at either... Really, I'm most concerned about which one gives me the best realistic shot at biglaw.

Other acceptances:
UGA (go there currently)
Bama (visited and was somewhat underwhelmed)
Miami (23,000/yr)
William and Mary (12,000/yr)
Tulane (10,000/yr)

If your goal is Biglaw in AZ, UofA actually does better than ASU.

[MistakenGenius]

Post removed.

[Nova]

Retake for big law

[IgosduIkana]

Do you have any "ties" to Texas? If you're gunning for TX biglaw and aren't at a T14 or UT, not having any ties to the region is going to make things more difficult than they already will be.

Darkness nailed it. Exactly my thoughts. SMU does very well in Dallas, to the tune of about 14% biglaw. That said, I highly doubt your chances are that high without any ties. I'm surprised you've lived in the South so long not to understand how insular it is. Texans are naturally going to be more suspicious of you, and I would say it knocks your chances down probably by half. Yes, if you finish top 5-10%, you'll have a reasonable shot at Biglaw from either school. Your best option is probably UGA with the Georgia connections. That said, OP, I know you want to say its not feasible, but you should still retake. No one is going to hold a gun to your head and make you go now. You need to sit down with your benefactor and explain this to them. If you sit out, work a job to pay the bills, and study hard, we could be having a much better discussion. With a high enough LSAT, full ride to SMU and UT become options. Sitting out will literally give you a shot at your dream job. Is it really not economically feasible to save 200 grand for a year?

Are you saying that top 5-10 percent doesn't guarantee biglaw because you won't have ties?

[Tiago Splitter]

Do you have any "ties" to Texas? If you're gunning for TX biglaw and aren't at a T14 or UT, not having any ties to the region is going to make things more difficult than they already will be.

Darkness nailed it. Exactly my thoughts. SMU does very well in Dallas, to the tune of about 14% biglaw. That said, I highly doubt your chances are that high without any ties. I'm surprised you've lived in the South so long not to understand how insular it is. Texans are naturally going to be more suspicious of you, and I would say it knocks your chances down probably by half. Yes, if you finish top 5-10%, you'll have a reasonable shot at Biglaw from either school. Your best option is probably UGA with the Georgia connections. That said, OP, I know you want to say its not feasible, but you should still retake. No one is going to hold a gun to your head and make you go now. You need to sit down with your benefactor and explain this to them. If you sit out, work a job to pay the bills, and study hard, we could be having a much better discussion. With a high enough LSAT, full ride to SMU and UT become options. Sitting out will literally give you a shot at your dream job. Is it really not economically feasible to save 200 grand for a year?

Are you saying that top 5-10 percent doesn't guarantee biglaw because you won't have ties?

Even with ties no one is guaranteed biglaw from the top 10% if only 14% of the class gets it.

[rebexness]

To answer all of (basically) the same questions at once, the reason is that I have guaranteed help provided I begin this upcoming school year. So, in point of fact, I won't be taking on six figures of debt, especially if I get a decent scholarship.

If you can't/won't sit out a year, how about taking the June LSAT in hopes of getting a better score--> more money?

You wouldn't need more than 6-7 points to be looking at full at either UA/ASU. Maybe less, depending on GPA.

[Mack.Hambleton]

Rule number one: don't come on TLS and say you want biglaw while refusing to retake a 158

[IgosduIkana]

Even with ties no one is guaranteed biglaw from the top 10% if only 14% of the class gets it.

So, some people get it without being in the top 10%? Sorry, I just don't know how biglaw hiring works entirely. I always that if 15% were getting biglaw every year, then the top 10% would have access to it every year.

[rebexness]

Rule number one: don't come on TLS and say you want biglaw while refusing to retake a 158

Can you post anything besides "Retake?"

[Nova]

Even with ties no one is guaranteed biglaw from the top 10% if only 14% of the class gets it.

So, some people get it without being in the top 10%? Sorry, I just don't know how biglaw hiring works entirely. I always that if 15% were getting biglaw every year, then the top 10% would have access to it every year.

you have to take into account that

1. people with real connections
2. diversity hires
3. hot girls
4. really likeable people

will all take a piece of the pie with less than amazing grades

[IgosduIkana]

Even with ties no one is guaranteed biglaw from the top 10% if only 14% of the class gets it.

So, some people get it without being in the top 10%? Sorry, I just don't know how biglaw hiring works entirely. I always that if 15% were getting biglaw every year, then the top 10% would have access to it every year.

you have to take into account that

1. people with real connections
2. diversity hires
3. hot girls
4. really likeable people

will all take a piece of the pie with less than amazing grades

poop. Well, on the plus side I fit into two of those categories. I knew I should've been born a hot girl..

[kalvano]

Do you have any "ties" to Texas? If you're gunning for TX biglaw and aren't at a T14 or UT, not having any ties to the region is going to make things more difficult than they already will be.

Darkness nailed it. Exactly my thoughts. SMU does very well in Dallas, to the tune of about 14% biglaw. That said, I highly doubt your chances are that high without any ties. I'm surprised you've lived in the South so long not to understand how insular it is. Texans are naturally going to be more suspicious of you, and I would say it knocks your chances down probably by half. Yes, if you finish top 5-10%, you'll have a reasonable shot at Biglaw from either school. Your best option is probably UGA with the Georgia connections. That said, OP, I know you want to say its not feasible, but you should still retake. No one is going to hold a gun to your head and make you go now. You need to sit down with your benefactor and explain this to them. If you sit out, work a job to pay the bills, and study hard, we could be having a much better discussion. With a high enough LSAT, full ride to SMU and UT become options. Sitting out will literally give you a shot at your dream job. Is it really not economically feasible to save 200 grand for a year?

Are you saying that top 5-10 percent doesn't guarantee biglaw because you won't have ties?

Even with ties no one is guaranteed biglaw from the top 10% if only 14% of the class gets it.

Top 10% at SMU means Biglaw (or the equivalent salary / type of firm) is yours to lose.

[Mack.Hambleton]

Rule number one: don't come on TLS and say you want biglaw while refusing to retake a 158

Can you post anything besides "Retake?"

maybe you should retake whats ur lsat scrub

[saintsfan200]

I'd wager there are decent odds your benefactor will still help you out, if you tell them in advance that you're going to sit out a cycle, and why that is a good decision. Even if, they don't agree with you, they should understand that your decision is based on supposed logic, and you're not just sitting out because you're lazy.

You also need to consider: might going without this financial support a year later with a higher LSAT be better than going now with lower LSAT? A 4.0 with a 165 will likely get you a T14.

[sublime]

..

[BigZuck]

Even with ties no one is guaranteed biglaw from the top 10% if only 14% of the class gets it.

So, some people get it without being in the top 10%? Sorry, I just don't know how biglaw hiring works entirely. I always that if 15% were getting biglaw every year, then the top 10% would have access to it every year.

you have to take into account that

1. people with real connections
2. diversity hires
3. hot girls
4. really likeable people

will all take a piece of the pie with less than amazing grades

The 1LSA hot girl bump blew my mind. I knew about the others, but had no idea the hot girl bump was like that.

It didn't fully blow my mind cuz men but +1

[MistakenGenius]

Post removed.