. Forum

[sundance95]

As a UVAer, I can +1 the above comments re UVA. I won't dispute that Chicago is a better school in terms of employment prospects, particularly in academia. But I've interviewed with a number of Chicago alum, and when I answer "How did you like your first year?" they look at me like I'm fucking insane.

[guinness1547]

But I've interviewed with a number of Chicago alum, and when I answer "How did you like your first year?" they look at me like I'm fucking insane.

What do you mean?

[Mal Reynolds]

But I've interviewed with a number of Chicago alum, and when I answer "How did you like your first year?" they look at me like I'm fucking insane.

What do you mean?

DAT rigor. Also Real Madrid sucks.

[BruceWayne]

To throw another UVAer's perspective into the mix. 1L at UVA isn't anything special. It's intense as hell; people just like to dress the school up to be more laid back than it really is. Frankly Duke UVA should be a decision made based off of scholarship money, class size preference, Durham vs. CVille, and whether you're cool with graded LRW or not. Firms view them as being the same. It's going to come down to your grades.

[DaleCooper]

What do you mean?

They sell these at the University of Chicago Law School.

They're being about 15% ironic. Maybe.

[Real Madrid]

But I've interviewed with a number of Chicago alum, and when I answer "How did you like your first year?" they look at me like I'm fucking insane.

What do you mean?

DAT rigor. Also Real Madrid sucks.

I think Walgreens is having a sale on Preperation H if you want to stock up and get over your butthurt. It'd probably be healthier than stalking all of my posts.

[sundance95]

U still seem upset. Want 2 talk about it?

[Real Madrid]

U still seem upset. Want 2 talk about it?

What r u, a 13-year-old girl?

Besides, I'm busy watching Rick Santorun speak at the RNC.

[sundance95]

U still seem upset. Want 2 talk about it?

What r u, a 13-year-old girl?

Besides, I'm busy watching Rick Santorun speak at the RNC.

y u tso mad if ur watching such a preftigious American share his wisdom?

[Mal Reynolds]

U still seem upset. Want 2 talk about it?

What r u, a 13-year-old girl?

Besides, I'm busy watching Rick Santorun speak at the RNC.

Nevermind, you're awesome.

[AllDangle]

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[Mr. Frodo]

They are peer schools, but you are basically a lock at UVA and unlikely to be admitted at Duke, so I'd ED UVA.

OP has a marginally better chance of acceptance at UVA ED. However, chances aren't great at either school (165/3.88).

Any input on why some say my numbers are a "lock" at UVA via ED, and others say my chances aren't too great? I've encountered both of these responses in "What are my chances?" threads.

You're getting mixed responses becuase some people think they understand the UVA ED formula, when really they don't. Basically, you are a lock at UVA if you: Apply ED before late October and you are above the 75th percentile of either their accepted LSAT (171) or GPA (3.94). UVA likes to accept ppl ED who meet that criateria becuase 1) it allows them to basically handpick people in order to get exactly the median stats they want and 2) save scholarship money for people who would otherwise probably go to Columbia, Chicago or NYU. The key is that you have to be over one of the 75th percentiles though in order for the formula to work. They take one reverse splitter with a super high GPA, another splitter with a super high LSAT and it "equals out" to them taking a candidate with say a 179/3.98 and a candidate with a 165/3.25.

OP, you aren't above either 75th percentile so you are not a "lock" at UVA ED, but other posters are correct in that you have a much better shot at being admitted ED to UVA becuase UVA has been more willing to dip for people applying ED than Duke has.

Generally the same sort of idea for Penn, correct?

[AllDangle]

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[AllDangle]

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[DaleCooper]

In terms of biglaw placement, are they too close to even debate? Or does one have a fairly clear advantage here? Really looking for some input on this.

They are too close to debate. Neither one has a clear advantage over the other. In some years, Virginia does better in hiring. In some years, Duke does better in hiring. Both can get you just about any job you want if you meet the other requirements, but neither one can guarantee you anything just because you went there. Both have strong alumni networks... Virginia's is slightly bigger, but Duke's is slightly more mafia-like. There really, really isn't a difference.

(When I had to decide between NYU, Virginia, and Duke, literally every lawyer I talked to over the age of 28 said there was no real difference outside of NYC and I should just figure out where I wanted to live for three years. Lawyers under the age of 28 all said their school was better than the other two, unless they went to a different school, in which case they said it didn't matter. TLS loves to make ridiculous distinctions - I suspect they overrate CCN for virtually everything except preftigious NYC BigLaw, and underrate Georgetown for everything except DC BigLaw, for example - but even here I'd be surprised if you found anyone who actually thinks it matters whether you end up at Virginia or Duke.)

Also, is there a market where one school does remarkably better than the other?

Yes; Richmond and Charlotte, respectively.

I imagine UVA does better in D.C.

Not really, no. UVA places more into DC because more people there want DC.* That can be a double-edged sword, depending on the economy when you graduate. There's really no way to predict, but the effects will be small either way. Nobody's going to hire you because you went to one over the other. And, frankly, four-hours-to-DC isn't that much different from two-hours-to-DC when talking about networking. Duke in DC more or less negates what advantage UVA does have in that regard.

*From what I've heard anecdotally, about 35-50% of Virginia students in a given year want DC. A lot of smart people who already live in DC and want to be lawyers there tend to live in Arlington or Alexandria for a year before school so they can go to UVA for cheap. So many, in fact, that Dugas has bragged in interviews that they can meet their in-state quota without actually taking a hit on their US News ranking. That's something that most other state schools can only dream of. Meanwhile, only about 20% of a typical Duke class wants DC. Both the '10 and '11 grads I talked to and the career services/public interest people say they haven't had trouble placing people there ITE unless the Duke student in question is bottom-third and has no other helpful skills or resume lines. And even then, they've found something elsewhere for the 2-3 people who fit that description. It could all be one elaborate lie, I guess, but if so it's really amazing how many people they got in on it. Both are great schools with no obvious placement dangers (like, say, Georgetown graduating 400 students a year who want DC). I really don't think there's a bad decision to make here.

but where do they both sit in regards to NYC and secondary markets like Atlanta

NYC loves both. Atlanta loves both. Decent grades and good interviewing at either gets you either. Terrible grades and bad interviewing will screw you at both.