What's the word on Penn? Forum

[PennBull]

What are Penn Law, its Profs, and its Students especially known for. I hear it is one of the biggest feeders of BigLaw, true? Does this mean most Penn students specialize in corporate law? What is Penn's reputation among law firms, academia, and TLSers?

Since nobody else wants to be helpful... I'm far from the best person to answer this, but I'll try to combine TLS stereotypes with my very limited observations (I don't go to Penn, though I have visited it). Feel free to disagree unless you go to Chicago, in which case YES YOU ARE ALL LIKE THAT.

• Urban campus in "University City", a really nice neighborhood sandwiched between the Fresh Prince part of Philly and the Ben Franklin part of Philly.
• There are some cool upscale restaurants and gastropubs in the area, along with all the typical street chains you'd expect.
• The campus can feel kind of sterile in places, but there are enough vagrants to make it feel like a Gotham City backlot.
• The law school has fairly well-rounded student body, leaning slightly nerdy if anything (laid-back and social nerdy, not Total Aspie like Chicago).
• It's "interdisciplinary", whatever the hell that means.
• Seriously, though, they do seem to love JD/MAs, JD/MBAs, JD/PhDs, and courses on "X and the Law".
• You can take 12 hours outside of the law school. That's fairly common in T14 land, but it's worth noting because Wharton is down the street.
• You'll get Ivy Cred with certain types of people, somewhere below Harvard and Yale but somewhere above Cornell.
• The law school is really pretty... it's four interconnected buildings arranged around a closed courtyard.
• There's a [goat] statue they're quite fond of. IMO, Badass [Goat] > Thomas Jefferson. YMMV.
• There's a security guard who knows what all the students look like, and will call you out if you aren't one.
• The campus bookstore is just a Barnes & Noble with red-and-blue signs instead of green signs. It's kind of weird.
• The NYC corporate placement is really solid, both because of the school's reputation and because of the easy commute for networking and interviews.
• People below a certain education level will forever confuse your school with the place up the road where they rape kids.

On the whole, I was pretty impressed by it. If you like cities, it's a good place to be. If you don't, it's probably not.
(EDIT: Turns out it's a goat, not a dragon. Oops.)

This is all absolutely credited.

The only thing I'd add is that Penn seems to have more of a relaxed atmosphere with lots of socializing.

[CardinalLaw]

What are Penn Law, its Profs, and its Students especially known for. I hear it is one of the biggest feeders of BigLaw, true? Does this mean most Penn students specialize in corporate law? What is Penn's reputation among law firms, academia, and TLSers?

Since nobody else wants to be helpful... I'm far from the best person to answer this, but I'll try to combine TLS stereotypes with my very limited observations (I don't go to Penn, though I have visited it). Feel free to disagree unless you go to Chicago, in which case YES YOU ARE ALL LIKE THAT.

• Urban campus in "University City", a really nice neighborhood sandwiched between the Fresh Prince part of Philly and the Ben Franklin part of Philly.
• There are some cool upscale restaurants and gastropubs in the area, along with all the typical street chains you'd expect.
• The campus can feel kind of sterile in places, but there are enough vagrants to make it feel like a Gotham City backlot.
• The law school has fairly well-rounded student body, leaning slightly nerdy if anything (laid-back and social nerdy, not Total Aspie like Chicago).
• It's "interdisciplinary", whatever the hell that means.
• Seriously, though, they do seem to love JD/MAs, JD/MBAs, JD/PhDs, and courses on "X and the Law".
• You can take 12 hours outside of the law school. That's fairly common in T14 land, but it's worth noting because Wharton is down the street.
• You'll get Ivy Cred with certain types of people, somewhere below Harvard and Yale but somewhere above Cornell.
• The law school is really pretty... it's four interconnected buildings arranged around a closed courtyard.
• There's a [goat] statue they're quite fond of. IMO, Badass [Goat] > Thomas Jefferson. YMMV.
• There's a security guard who knows what all the students look like, and will call you out if you aren't one.
• The campus bookstore is just a Barnes & Noble with red-and-blue signs instead of green signs. It's kind of weird.
• The NYC corporate placement is really solid, both because of the school's reputation and because of the easy commute for networking and interviews.
• People below a certain education level will forever confuse your school with the place up the road where they rape kids.

On the whole, I was pretty impressed by it. If you like cities, it's a good place to be. If you don't, it's probably not.
(EDIT: Turns out it's a goat, not a dragon. Oops.)

This is all absolutely credited.

The only thing I'd add is that Penn seems to have more of a relaxed atmosphere with lots of socializing.

+1 for Gus Johnson

[Tom Joad]

Hiring partners think Penn is the worst T14 school.

At least that is what USNews says.

Stats may indicate otherwise.

But we will see if that changes post-Sandusky.

[rickgrimes69]

Hiring partners think Penn is the worst T14 school.

At least that is what USNews says.

Stats may indicate otherwise.

But we will see if that changes post-Sandusky.

There is so much wrong with this statement.

[Lawyer1234]

.

[Borg]

It is good in general, and it is appropriately ranked somewhere between 7 and 9.

[Yukos]

Not to inadvertently bring up the "Penn is the same tier as NYU debate," but I think it's interesting to look at both their LST pages -- you get a good idea what defines them.

NYU has an 89% employment score, Penn 83%, slight edge to NYU.

Large firm score: Penn 58%, NYU 43%. You can say Penn's edge here is due to students self-selecting, but I think it's clear Penn is elite at placing students in biglaw.

Fed clerkships: NYU 11%, Penn 9%, I'd call that a draw.

Public service: NYU 25%, Penn 6%, huge edge to NYU.

Again, could be self-selection, could be NYU's reputation with PI orgs and/or could have to do with NYU's LRAP (I haven't looked at either one's LRAP).

Like I said, I think this is a good way to see Penn's strengths: good placement overall and awesome biglaw stats. It also clear if you do well there will be clerkship opportunities. If you don't want biglaw, however, you might want to consider other T10s.

[grimfan]

NYU has an 89% employment score, Penn 83%, slight edge to NYU.

Schools like NYU, UVA, and Columbia included a massive number of school-funded jobs in the "Long Term, JD-required" category, thus inflating their LST Employment Score.

[Yukos]

NYU has an 89% employment score, Penn 83%, slight edge to NYU.

Schools like NYU, UVA, and Columbia included a massive number of school-funded jobs in the "Long Term, JD-required" category, thus inflating their LST Employment Score.

True, if you subtract the difference between the two schools' school-funded rate, NYU and Penn have basically the same employment score. But the point of my post wasn't "NYU is clearly superior," it was just to look at Penn's relative strengths, since that's what the OP was asking about.

[skers]

really solid Biglaw placement, but it doesn't really have some defining factor, like "Chicago is nerdy," or "NYU is PI." Other than that, it's just an all-around solid school, a bit of an up and comer.

Best clerkship placement outside HYS. Best big law placement outside HYSC. I'd consider those pretty defining factors.

Best big law placement outside of HYSC? Usually I think you're completely on point, but isn't that taking one year of data and making it "the defining factor."

[chippa]

I just wouldn't let my kids visit

[zidane13]

I just wouldn't let me kids visit

Awesome first post.

[Just]

P generally ranks before MV, so why " BMVP"
On rankings by law firms, MV seems stand way ahead, why is this?

[Tom Joad]

On rankings by law firms, MV seems stand way ahead, why is this?

Class size could account for some of this. More alums ranking their old schools highly.

[wildcard174]

On rankings by law firms, MV seems stand way ahead, why is this?

Class size could account for some of this. More alums ranking their old schools highly.

Agreed. Also, Michigan Law alumns generally have a ton of school spirit. I can't really compare to UVA or Penn, but this might be a factor.

[PolySuyGuy]

Hiring partners think Penn is the worst T14 school.

At least that is what USNews says.

Stats may indicate otherwise.

But we will see if that changes post-Sandusky.

At first I didn't know how to respond to the bold statement.

Then I realize, maybe you know things. Unless you want to have child abuse guilt on your hands for the rest of your life, I suggest you contact law enforcement and let them know that not only was Jerry Sandusky at Penn State but also he did his evil at University of Pennsylvania. Please do that immediately. Then let us know how it went.

--ImageRemoved--

[Yukos]

Hiring partners think Penn is the worst T14 school.

At least that is what USNews says.

Stats may indicate otherwise.

But we will see if that changes post-Sandusky.

At first I didn't know how to respond to the bold statement.

Then I realize, maybe you know things. Unless you want to have child abuse guilt on your hands for the rest of your life, I suggest you contact law enforcement and let them know that not only was Jerry Sandusky at Penn State but also he did his evil at University of Pennsylvania. Please do that immediately. Then let us know how it went.

--ImageRemoved--

If there was abuse occurring at the State College branch, there's no reason to assume nothing was going on at Philadelphia branch. The Freeh Report makes it clear that the scandal touched all parts of the UPenn system.

[barneytrouble]

Hiring partners think Penn is the worst T14 school.

At least that is what USNews says.

Stats may indicate otherwise.

But we will see if that changes post-Sandusky.

At first I didn't know how to respond to the bold statement.

Then I realize, maybe you know things. Unless you want to have child abuse guilt on your hands for the rest of your life, I suggest you contact law enforcement and let them know that not only was Jerry Sandusky at Penn State but also he did his evil at University of Pennsylvania. Please do that immediately. Then let us know how it went.

--ImageRemoved--

If there was abuse occurring at the State College branch, there's no reason to assume nothing was going on at Philadelphia branch. The Freeh Report makes it clear that the scandal touched all parts of the UPenn system.

I was under the impression that none of the PSU football staff were involved with any of their satellite campuses. The fact that they didn't even let them adopt the same mascot, and went a step further to make it a goat, speaks volumes.

[Teflon_Jeff]

I just assumed this was an elaborate joke thread. It seems some people are conflating Penn and PSU.

Penn has it's own entire Football team, and no interaction whatsoever with Penn State, other than both being State schools in Pennsylvania.

http://www.pennathletics.com/

[Bronck]

I just assumed this was an elaborate joke thread. It seems some people are conflating Penn and PSU.

Penn has it's own entire Football team, and no interaction whatsoever with Penn State, other than both being State schools in Pennsylvania.

http://www.pennathletics.com/

Yeah, that's sort of the point. It's all a joke

[PennBull]

I just assumed this was an elaborate joke thread. It seems some people are conflating Penn and PSU.

Penn has it's own entire Football team, and no interaction whatsoever with Penn State, other than both being State schools in Pennsylvania.

http://www.pennathletics.com/

Yeah, that's sort of the point. It's all a joke

I think you missed the joke he was making.

[Bronck]

I just assumed this was an elaborate joke thread. It seems some people are conflating Penn and PSU.

Penn has it's own entire Football team, and no interaction whatsoever with Penn State, other than both being State schools in Pennsylvania.

http://www.pennathletics.com/

Yeah, that's sort of the point. It's all a joke

I think you missed the joke he was making.

I actually didn't read the second line of the post, so that would account for me missing it.

[Tom Joad]

Penn Athletics,

THATS THE JOKE.

[barneytrouble]

Penn Athletics,

THATS THE JOKE.

I honestly couldn't believe that "http://www.pennathletics.com/" didn't redirect to a 404 page.

[letsdoit]

Their reputation is hurting with this whole Joe Paterno scandal.

Outstanding trolling, two thumbs way, way up.

unquestionably my favorite TLS comment of the day.