GW 30k vs Fordham 15k vs Emory 60k Forum

[flem]

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

wut?

Please see Northwestern, UVA, and Michigan. Even GeorgeTTTown is a significant jump in employment prospects.

[GokartMozart315]

to be honest i feel far luckier than interested in a retake.

Well if you're feeling lucky then that changes everything.

haha was just riffing off some earlier comment...but good one

[GokartMozart315]

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

wut?

Please see Northwestern, UVA, and Michigan. Even GeorgeTTTown is a significant jump in employment prospects.

wut? he didn't get in...i'm unlikely to get a 175, and even if i somehow did it clearly isn't much worth the effort. would surmise that gw and northwestern with adjusted class ranking that i'd end up with would likely give me equal shots in dc

[CanadianWolf]

OP: If you've accumulated enough money to pay cash for your time at either GWU or Fordham, then it must be through an inheritance since someone as young as you are who has saved $250,000 in after-tax dollars through earnings probably wouldn't be so willing to throw it away on misinformed dreams.

[Wily]

OP, I'm in similar situation as you, but with a 2.7 GPA/168. With my GPA, the returns for my retaking are truly diminishing, since my only chance at a T14 is Northwestern and I won't get in unless I have 176+. I'm still retaking in June anyway. With your 3.4 GPA, though, you have a shot at a number of T14 schools if you retake, or at least more money from these three schools. I would strongly recommend you retake in June, and reevaluate your situation based on what score you get.

[descartesb4thehorse]

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

wut?

Please see Northwestern, UVA, and Michigan. Even GeorgeTTTown is a significant jump in employment prospects.

wut? he didn't get in...i'm unlikely to get a 175, and even if i somehow did it clearly isn't much worth the effort. would surmise that gw and northwestern with adjusted class ranking that i'd end up with would likely give me equal shots in dc

171/3.4 in at Mich and NU and probably could've pulled more of the lower T14 with ED, and GULC without. 4 points isn't that hard. But lol at you assuming you should have gotten GULC with both numbers below median. Flame for that.

[flem]

wut? he didn't get in...i'm unlikely to get a 175, and even if i somehow did it clearly isn't much worth the effort. would surmise that gw and northwestern with adjusted class ranking that i'd end up with would likely give me equal shots in dc

Those are just 4 schools off the top of my head that your GPA won't lock you out of. A 171+ and a wise use of ED would double your biglaw shot, at the very least.

[Tiago Splitter]

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

wut?

Please see Northwestern, UVA, and Michigan. Even GeorgeTTTown is a significant jump in employment prospects.

wut? he didn't get in...i'm unlikely to get a 175, and even if i somehow did it clearly isn't much worth the effort. would surmise that gw and northwestern with adjusted class ranking that i'd end up with would likely give me equal shots in dc

Damn this guy is clueless.

OP, just go to George Washington since you want DC.

[GokartMozart315]

OP: If you've accumulated enough money to pay cash for your time at either GWU or Fordham, then it must be through an inheritance since someone as young as you are who has saved $250,000 in after-tax dollars through earnings probably wouldn't be so willing to throw it away on misinformed dreams.

you're right, and if i somehow had a way to accumulate that kind of money i'd be wise to reconsider attending law school at all

[GokartMozart315]

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

wut?

Please see Northwestern, UVA, and Michigan. Even GeorgeTTTown is a significant jump in employment prospects.

wut? he didn't get in...i'm unlikely to get a 175, and even if i somehow did it clearly isn't much worth the effort. would surmise that gw and northwestern with adjusted class ranking that i'd end up with would likely give me equal shots in dc

Damn this guy is clueless.

OP, just go to George Washington since you want DC.

ok ok that was dumb. at the same time, you hear that about every school other than HYS, and it's obviously not true. plenty of horror stories everywhere.

not going to bother defending my decision to pick among these law schools; to those of you who got into t14, or can just spend as many years as you want trying to retake the lsat and get into some great law school (yet can't seem to pay for your tuition?) good for you, but i'm 25 and am not going to start real life as an associate at 30.

even if you think these schools all suck relatively, please hold your noses and help me pick among them, or don't bother posting in my thread. i'm trying to leave money out of it; i'm not interested in your financial advice, but your experience among law schools. thanks to those who have helped

[Robespierre]

OP - Your goals are mismatched to your qualifications. "Biglaw, clerkship or agency" are lofty goals at any time, and especially in the middle of a recession when biglaw firms and gov't agencies are very tight with hiring. Meanwhile, you've got 3.4/167 which are good but not lofty stats.

The one thing you can change about that is your LSAT score. Retake, get 170+, and it's a whole different picture.

If you're not willing to retake, then just go with GW; it's in one of your target markets unlike Emory and it's offering more $ than Fordham. The chances of hitting your goals from GW are only about 35%. But if you get something less desirable, that's not the end of the world with no debt.

[Samara]

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

A) Your GPA is a full three-tenths higher than mine. That makes a big difference.

B) You don't need a 175 to get my cycle. You only really need a 170, maybe 172. That's totally doable.

C) I applied ED to NU and got it. If I would have applied ED to GULC or UVa, I would have gotten those. With an ED, I may have gotten Mich or Penn. And if I wanted to ride my waitlists, I'm sure I could have a few T14s to choose from.

TL;DR: Retake -> ED to UVa -> ??? -> Profit

[flem]

C) I applied ED to NU and got it.

Off topic - since you ED'd to Northwestern and got it, does that mean you got the full ride with your numbers?

Or were you just rolled into the RD pool and applied ED initially.

[Samara]

C) I applied ED to NU and got it.

Off topic - since you ED'd to Northwestern and got it, does that mean you got the full ride with your numbers?

Or were you just rolled into the RD pool and applied ED initially.

haha, yeah, to clarify, I was rolled into RD, but accepted in the first batches. No scholly for me. But NU did say they give preference to held EDers over RDers, all else equivalent.

[timbs4339]

but i'm 25 and am not going to start real life as an associate at 30.

Although you say that you know that you have a low chance of not getting biglaw, you seem to still believe that you will be an associate. It is not certain and probably will not happen from those schools.

[Ruxin1]

cmon it's not like im considering brooklyn and florida coastal...a little reality guys...

Here's a little reality, bro. No, GW and Fordham aren't UDC and NYLS, but it's still brutal at T25 schools. There's a huge difference between T25 and T14. But I guess if you won't have debt (which makes the scholarships irrelevant) and refuse to retake, decide if you want DC or NYC more and pick between Fordham and GW accordingly.

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

Last time I looked doubling the chance is much better.

[GokartMozart315]

cmon it's not like im considering brooklyn and florida coastal...a little reality guys...

Here's a little reality, bro. No, GW and Fordham aren't UDC and NYLS, but it's still brutal at T25 schools. There's a huge difference between T25 and T14. But I guess if you won't have debt (which makes the scholarships irrelevant) and refuse to retake, decide if you want DC or NYC more and pick between Fordham and GW accordingly.

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

Last time I looked doubling the chance is much better.

i just have trouble believing the evidence presented. but even if i'm glaringly wrong, a retake just isn't an option. going to law school this fall, just a question of which one

[rad lulz]

i just have trouble believing the evidence presented.

Why?

[Ruxin1]

i just have trouble believing the evidence presented.

Why?

Special-Snowflake/Bergers Disorder most likely

[top30man]

i just have trouble believing the evidence presented.

Why?

Special-Snowflake/Bergers Disorder most likely

Likely. Facts > Antecdotal evidence 100 times out of 100

[timbs4339]

i just have trouble believing the evidence presented.

Why?

Special-Snowflake/Bergers Disorder most likely

It's a huge leap from the common wisdom to the idea that a top 25 or 30 law school can have such crappy job prospects, especially given all the brainwashing that goes on in this country about how higher education is always the answer and education debt is good debt. This is especially pronounced among the middle and upper-middle classes (I assume OP is the latter). People don't view education as a risky financial investment or law schools as companies trying to market a product.

That may be different in five or ten years, but it's been only a few years since the scamblog movement started to go mainstream.

[GokartMozart315]

i just have trouble believing the evidence presented.

Why?

Special-Snowflake/Bergers Disorder most likely

It's a huge leap from the common wisdom to the idea that a top 25 or 30 law school can have such crappy job prospects, especially given all the brainwashing that goes on in this country about how higher education is always the answer and education debt is good debt. This is especially pronounced among the middle and upper-middle classes (I assume OP is the latter). People don't view education as a risky financial investment or law schools as companies trying to market a product.

That may be different in five or ten years, but it's been only a few years since the scamblog movement started to go mainstream.

this is exactly correct. looking at the numbers on law school transparency and the schools themselves, and comparing to the alumni of these schools that i know who are recent grads, the picture isn't rosy but it isn't terrible. on the other hand, i have you guys telling me that if i'm not getting a 3.9 at HYS i'll end up in a soup kitchen, and then calling me crazy for not believing a bunch of keyboard jockeys on a forum. i spend time on ford mustang forums for gods sake and have yet to deal with more hostile and uninformative forum posters.

also debt has little to do with this evaluation: wherever the money's coming from, the education is either worth what it charges or it isn't. it's interesting that people who have to borrow for law school suddenly say the choice of school and scholarships don't matter if i don't have to borrow, like just because my parents aren't broke and/or selfish they're billionaires and this money means nothing? don't understand this. my parents put other things aside to put me through school, and the better i steward those funds the happier everybody is.

let's play a game: every one of you who suggested i'm crazy for having any optimism at these schools, please post where you're attending/attended law school. if you have put your money where your mouth is, or rather not put it where it isn't, i'll take what you say seriously. if not, then just admit you don't really take your own advice.

i'm still going to law school this fall because i don't have a choice, but it's not worth more time trying to drive that point home so i won't. as i've said, i'm choosing among specific options which i've laid out, and sitting on my ass studying for the lsats for another year isn't one of them

[rad lulz]

this is exactly correct. looking at the numbers on law school transparency and the schools themselves, and comparing to the alumni of these schools that i know who are recent grads, the picture isn't rosy but it isn't terrible. on the other hand, i have you guys telling me that if i'm not getting a 3.9 at HYS i'll end up in a soup kitchen, and then calling me crazy for not believing a bunch of keyboard jockeys on a forum. i spend time on ford mustang forums for gods sake and have yet to deal with more hostile and uninformative forum posters.

Dawg people are just saying that you should retake if you are srs about biglaw/clerkship. Because there's a 2/3 times you will be disappointed. Optimism won't change that. Also, don't ask for advice, then complain when you receive it.

let's play a game: every one of you who suggested i'm crazy for having any optimism at these schools, post where you're attending/attended law school. if you have put your money where your mouth is, or rather not put it where it isn't, i'll take what you say seriously.

This is sublime idiocy.

[Ruxin1]

cmon it's not like im considering brooklyn and florida coastal...a little reality guys...

Here's a little reality, bro. No, GW and Fordham aren't UDC and NYLS, but it's still brutal at T25 schools. There's a huge difference between T25 and T14. But I guess if you won't have debt (which makes the scholarships irrelevant) and refuse to retake, decide if you want DC or NYC more and pick between Fordham and GW accordingly.

damn samara that's quite the reality, though it really reinforces my decision to pick a school this cycle. with a 175 and a similar gpa you still couldn't pull schools that would be much better for my goals

[/quote]

^ This what we were replying to...

This stemmed from you saying the school Samara is attending: Northwestern, was not double the chance to get BigLaw 52.1% NLJ

To which we said that is double that of GW, Fordham, Emory.

GW: 17.76%
Fordham: 19.58%
Emory: 12.44%

I apologize for being incorrect, Samara will have greater than double the chances for BigLaw as you will from these schools. This is the evidence, anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

[GokartMozart315]

sorry for overreactin', you guys are trying to give me the best advice as you see it, i appreciate that.

i'm not serious about biglaw and clerkships so much as getting the best legal career i can with the options i have, which are the schools i've been admitted to. i know i have no chance of improving my lsats and even if i did, i don't have the ability to wait for another law school cycle.

it seems to me that 1. fordham offers the strongest chances at biglaw, and 2. gw offers the strongest ability to apply for both ny and dc. it also seems that 3. given that i want to work in those two markets, emory would be an unwise decision. would you agree with those assessments?

also, would you say that gaining the dc career prospects that gw has is worth losing fordham's excellent edge in the ny market, or that the fordham edge is worth more? i'm weighing non-legal factors in the background as i deal with the issue of where i actually want to live, but would love thoughts on those questions