If I have to go to a T4... Cooley or Cal Western Forum

[rose711]

OP: please don't go to either of these schools.

[romothesavior]

OP, please read this article before you go to law school:

--LinkRemoved--

Long-story short, of the entire class of 2010, less than 50% of graduates got full-time, permanent J.D.-required jobs. This horrible statistic is bad, but is even worse for T4-bound people when you consider than most T14s are placing almost all of their grads into some type of job like this, and most T30s/T1s are placing far more than 50%. This means that for schools like Cooley and Cal Western, far far less than 50% of 2010 graduates wound up with a real, full-time lawyering job. I wouldn't be shocked if the number was sub-10% at a place like Cooley.

These are not good odds. Your odds of becoming a full-time lawyer from one of these schools is less than 50%, probably no higher than 25%. Your odds of getting a 6-figure salary are probably <5%. You should not spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a degree for those types of odds. Re-take and shoot for a better school, or re-evaluate your decision to go to law school.

[cubswin]

At least it’s not Thomas Jefferson.

Best reason to pick a law school ever.

that reminds me of that cleveland tourism video that went viral a few years ago... "at least we're not detroit"

TBF.... "at least we're not Detroit" is a hell of a slogan if you have ever actually been to Detroit.

That slogan really only tells us something about Detroit. Gary, Indiana can truthfully say "At least we aren't Detroit" but I'd still prefer to never set foot there.

[red_alertz]

Cal Western comparing to cooley is like havard comparing to American, there

[ndirish2010]

You'll prolly get into MSU, go there

+1

This is true. And they are realistically second to U of M in that godforsaken state... which is hemorrhaging population and money... but whatever.

Not really though. Midwestern T25s > MSU in Michigan, especially if you have some ties.

[firemed]

You'll prolly get into MSU, go there

+1

This is true. And they are realistically second to U of M in that godforsaken state... which is hemorrhaging population and money... but whatever.

Not really though. Midwestern T25s > MSU in Michigan, especially if you have some ties.

Touche. Though, if I graduated from ND... I wouldn't rate Michigan very highly in my job search. I mean, for $$$ I would go, but I would take $$$ from a firm in another state first.

I love some people in Michigan, there are some cool things to do, and there are parts of it that are amazingly beautiful... but economically that state is in a death spiral... and a lot of bad things go with that.

[bfaiken]

but borrowing that kind of money to go to a T4 really really scares me.. maybe i should take a year and retake the LAST

It should scare you. To be honest this shouldn't even be a question of what you should do. Retaking is the only legitimate course of action.

TITCR. Taking on any debt to go to either of the schools you mention is a financially terrible decision. You'd be better off working at Starbucks the next three years. I say that in all due respect - it's not an insult, I actually truly believe it would be more financially prudent to work at Starbucks for three years than to incur debt and go to a TTTT for three years. Spend the next year working, saving some $$, and studying your butt off for the LSAT. Raise your score just a few points and you should be able to get into a reasonable law school that has some ties to the local market and can offer you some $$.

[dr123]

You'll prolly get into MSU, go there

+1

This is true. And they are realistically second to U of M in that godforsaken state... which is hemorrhaging population and money... but whatever.

Not really though. Midwestern T25s > MSU in Michigan, especially if you have some ties.

Not many people are gunning for jobs in Michigan and most UM grad GTFO. However, Wayne State is more highly regarded in Detroit than MSU is

[Veyron]

Nice flame, Marty McFlame. Jeesh, kids these days - no creativity.

[tyro]

Nice flame, Marty McFlame. Jeesh, kids these days - no creativity.

<---- awaiting sooperepic flame by Veyron to get back at these noobcakes.

[XxSpyKEx]

My Cooley loans after 1L would be around 30K including COL.

Are you fucking crazy?!?

Know a guy from UG that went to Cooley, moved from San Diego to do so. Was super stoked, and convinced that Cooley wouldn't hold him back, that it really depended on the person [his work ethic (I never really thought he had any), personality (super flashy wanna be important Econ major), etc., would carry the day.] Last time I talked to him and his wife all they could say was the the experience has been "interesting," code for shitty. He is about the graduate, and while his FB info proudly posted that he was going to Cooley Law a few months ago, all mention of this has now been erased from his account. Almost 3 years and 100dredsK in debt and he is finally waking up the the miserable reality of his predicament. Hopefully he can get his job back at the bank he used to work for.

In a related story, I recall joking with my parents about Cooley law a few years ago, and then told them it’s the worst school in the nation. That weekend, my parent’s friends are over and they drop that their kid went to Cooley. So I ask them how much money he made. They said he made $45k /year and he had graduated a couple years ago. So then I asked whether he had a good scholarship, and they told me he paid full price . I had a difficult time restraining myself from laughing right then and there. But keep in mind this story is about a guy who graduated from Cooley around the boom (i.e. around 2006, I believe). I highly doubt he would have any form of legal employment coming out in today’s legal economy – actually, I know a guy who went to Cooley who has a pretty shocking story. I don’t want to post up details because it’s difficult to do so without pretty much outing who the guy is, but pretty much, guy did INCREDIBLY WELL at Cooley and still had a difficult time scraping up a job for nearly a year, and now he works in a smaller shitlaw firm. If this guy had that much difficulty scraping up shitlaw, just think about how the rest of Cooley’s class is faring ITE.

[romothesavior]

In a related story, I recall joking with my parents about Cooley law a few years ago, and then told them it’s the worst school in the nation. That weekend, my parent’s friends are over and they drop that their kid went to Cooley. So I ask them how much money he made. They said he made $45k /year and he had graduated a couple years ago. So then I asked whether he had a good scholarship, and they told me he paid full price . I had a difficult time restraining myself from laughing right then and there. But keep in mind this story is about a guy who graduated from Cooley around the boom (i.e. around 2006, I believe). I highly doubt he would have any form of legal employment coming out in today’s legal economy – actually, I know a guy who went to Cooley who has a pretty shocking story. I don’t want to post up details because it’s difficult to do so without pretty much outing who the guy is, but pretty much, guy did INCREDIBLY WELL at Cooley and still had a difficult time scraping up a job for nearly a year, and now he works in a smaller shitlaw firm. If this guy had that much difficulty scraping up shitlaw, just think about how the rest of Cooley’s class is faring ITE.

+1, I'm sure it is terrible. I would be absolutely shocked if >10% of their class ever works as a permanent, full-time attorney.

Also, who does the bolded?

[red_alertz]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

[romothesavior]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

No it's not. That's like saying cutting your arm off is the consensus over chopping your head off when "Don't do either!" is a viable option.

[gwuorbust]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

sorry, as of yet your misinformation doesn't count as consensus.

[red_alertz]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

No it's not. That's like saying cutting your arm off is the consensus over chopping your head off when "Don't do either!" is a viable option.

well yeah if OP doens't get anything form the other schools he's waiting on, consensus as cal western over cooley

[romothesavior]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

No it's not. That's like saying cutting your arm off is the consensus over chopping your head off when "Don't do either!" is a viable option.

well yeah if OP doens't get anything form the other schools he's waiting on, consensus as cal western over cooley

After re-reading this thread, I didn't see a single person tell OP to take Cal Western other than you (unless I missed one). Hardly what I would call a consensus.

The overwhelming consensus is neither. Re-take the LSAT, or save the $200,000.

[whymeohgodno]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

No it's not. That's like saying cutting your arm off is the consensus over chopping your head off when "Don't do either!" is a viable option.

TCR is the arm.

[red_alertz]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

No it's not. That's like saying cutting your arm off is the consensus over chopping your head off when "Don't do either!" is a viable option.

well yeah if OP doens't get anything form the other schools he's waiting on, consensus as cal western over cooley

After re-reading this thread, I didn't see a single person tell OP to take Cal Western other than you (unless I missed one). Hardly what I would call a consensus.

The overwhelming consensus is neither. Re-take the LSAT, or save the $200,000.

but based on the assumption that is said in the title of the thread, assuming OP has to go to a T4, which school? can we say cal western?

[crit_racer]

god dammit no one HAS to go to a T4 school. OP's premise of "If I have to..." is based on misinformation. We have all kindly informed her that she doesn't have to go to a T4, so that original question is null and void.

OP get back to us when you're deciding whether or not to take money at a T2 or pay sticker for a T1. Then we can tell you to retake again haha

[northwood]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

No it's not. That's like saying cutting your arm off is the consensus over chopping your head off when "Don't do either!" is a viable option.

TCR is the arm.

id go with the head. at least you know once its over you dont have to live with only one arm

[firemed]

god dammit no one HAS to go to a T4 school. OP's premise of "If I have to..." is based on misinformation. We have all kindly informed her that she doesn't have to go to a T4, so that original question is null and void.

OP get back to us when you're deciding whether or not to take money at a T2 or pay sticker for a T1. Then we can tell you to retake again haha

[esq]

any updates OP on ur waiting? seems the consensus is cal western

No it's not. That's like saying cutting your arm off is the consensus over chopping your head off when "Don't do either!" is a viable option.

TCR is the arm.

id go with the head. at least you know once its over you dont have to live with only one arm

+1, If its a choice between living like a freak of nature with one arm or certain death, I choose certain death.

[bk1]

but based on the assumption that is said in the title of the thread, assuming OP has to go to a T4, which school? can we say cal western?

If somebody has a gun to OP's head and is forcing them then Cal Western. But until I see proof of this being a life or death decision, nobody has to go to a T4.

[red_alertz]

but based on the assumption that is said in the title of the thread, assuming OP has to go to a T4, which school? can we say cal western?

If somebody has a gun to OP's head and is forcing them then Cal Western. But until I see proof of this being a life or death decision, nobody has to go to a T4.

simply an assumption based on the thread and what OP was asking about, strictly answering OPs original question, obviously it's helpful to bring in outside info, but between the two T4s, cal western is much better