UT Austin or University of Houston? Forum

[ScottRiqui]

Still, I'd rank the Texas schools like this:

UT: Go if you get in, but you won't get in.
SMU: Probably your best shot.
UH, Baylor: I wouldn't go to either, but I'm on the fence given your GI benefits.
Texas Tech, STCL: Don't bother.

Thanks, that's what I'm thinking too, since it sounds like the strength of UH's IP program isn't enough to overcome its low overall ranking. I'd really like to live and work in the DFW area (that's where I grew up and lived prior to joining the Navy), so SMU looks good.

Cost is a wash for any of the Texas schools, since the GI Bill would cover absolutely everything at any of them.

At this point, the question is whether I can get into a non-Texas school that's better than SMU by a wide-enough margin to make the much higher cost worthwhile, considering that SMU is in the area where I'd want to live/work after school.

[JazzOne]

Still, I'd rank the Texas schools like this:

UT: Go if you get in, but you won't get in.
SMU: Probably your best shot.
UH, Baylor: I wouldn't go to either, but I'm on the fence given your GI benefits.
Texas Tech, STCL: Don't bother.

Thanks, that's what I'm thinking too, since it sounds like the strength of UH's IP program isn't enough to overcome its low overall ranking. I'd really like to live and work in the DFW area (that's where I grew up and lived prior to joining the Navy), so SMU looks good.

Cost is a wash for any of the Texas schools, since the GI Bill would cover absolutely everything at any of them.

At this point, the question is whether I can get into a non-Texas school that's better than SMU by a wide-enough margin to make the much higher cost worthwhile, considering that SMU is in the area where I want to live/work.

If you want to work in Dallas, then SMU is a very good choice. For OOS options, you could try applying to Northwestern, Cornell, Georgetown, or Vanderbilt. I'll let others weigh in the relative strengths of those schools (and your chances at each). Don't discount Vandy though. I'm at UT, and Vandy is one of the few schools I still wish I had applied to.

I have a science background, and I think it's hard to break into IP. I don't know why everyone thinks it's so much easier. ITE, nothing's easy.

[FuManChusco]

Still, I'd rank the Texas schools like this:

UT: Go if you get in, but you won't get in.
SMU: Probably your best shot.
UH, Baylor: I wouldn't go to either, but I'm on the fence given your GI benefits.
Texas Tech, STCL: Don't bother.

Thanks, that's what I'm thinking too, since it sounds like the strength of UH's IP program isn't enough to overcome its low overall ranking. I'd really like to live and work in the DFW area (that's where I grew up and lived prior to joining the Navy), so SMU looks good.

Cost is a wash for any of the Texas schools, since the GI Bill would cover absolutely everything at any of them.

At this point, the question is whether I can get into a non-Texas school that's better than SMU by a wide-enough margin to make the much higher cost worthwhile, considering that SMU is in the area where I want to live/work.

If you want to work in Dallas, then SMU is a very good choice. You could try applying to Northwestern, Cornell, Georgetown, or Vanderbilt. I'll let others weigh in the relative strengths of those schools (and your chances at each). Don't discount Vandy though. I'm at UT, and Vandy is one of the few schools I still wish I had applied to. ITE, nothing's easy.
I have a science background, and I think it's hard to break into IP. I don't know why everyone thinks it's so much easier.

Listen to this man.

[Stringer Bell]

Regarding UT's GPA floor: The 3.5 floor does seem to be pretty legit, but how many of the 173+ people rejected were Texas residents? After that, how many 173+ Texas residents had a background like OP's? I agree there isn't much evidence for OP's case outside of a 179, 3.0 from a couple of years ago on LSN that was accepted. But there isn't exactly alot of evidence against it either.

[Stringer Bell]

Jazz, why do you advocate that SMU is worth going to but UH isn't?

[ScottRiqui]

I have a science background, and I think it's hard to break into IP. I don't know why everyone thinks it's so much easier.

Thanks again for your posts. I wasn't thinking that IP would be "easy" - I actually only started considering law school recently so I don't know much about the market in general, much less the markets for particular specialties. It sounds interesting though, and I think that an engineering B.S. and a physics M.S. might be a good starting point, background-wise.

[JazzOne]

Regarding UT's GPA floor: The 3.5 floor does seem to be pretty legit, but how many of the 173+ people rejected were Texas residents? After that, how many 173+ Texas residents had a background like OP's? I agree there isn't much evidence for OP's case outside of a 179, 3.0 from a couple of years ago on LSN that was accepted. But there isn't exactly alot of evidence against it either.

You're right that we don't have a lot of evidence for in-state applicants. However, that sophie chic got dinged at UT (OOS), and she has something like 3.6 1.74 (Ivy UG). My personal take is that UT is making a push to move up the rankings, and they have enough IS applicants to keep the numbers up. In fact, I read an interview with Dean Ingram, and if I recall correctly, she said the IS numbers might be even more competitive than OOS numbers because a lot of IS students want to go to UT, even if they have Harvard numbers. In fact, one of my friends on LR turned down a Harvard admission to come to UT. He posts on here as esc, but I haven't seen him on in a while.

[JazzOne]

I have a science background, and I think it's hard to break into IP. I don't know why everyone thinks it's so much easier.

Thanks again for your posts. I wasn't thinking that IP would be "easy" - I actually only started considering law school recently so I don't know much about the market in general, much less the markets for particular specialties. It sounds interesting though, and I think that an engineering B.S. and a physics M.S. might be a good starting point, background-wise.

Yes, it's certainly possible, and a graduate degree and work experience help a lot. There just seems to be a general attitude on this forum that IP law is secure. If that's true, it is contrary to my observations. The competition for IP jobs was pretty stiff at OCI this year, and I think I'm going to have to settle for general litigation. I'm a bit uncomfortable using the word "settle," however, because I am very, very excited about my job offer.

[JazzOne]

Jazz, why do you advocate that SMU is worth going to but UH isn't?

That's an interesting question. I guess my main reason is anecdotal. I know quite a few people who got biglaw offers out of SMU. Dallas biglaw hires a decent number of SMU grads. SMU is not ranked that much higher than UH, but SMU has a far better reputation (at least in my circle). I am not as knowledgeable about the Houston market as I am the Dallas market. Perhaps UH is fine for Houston; I'm really not sure.

I guess when it comes down to it, I don't really have an objective reason to favor SMU so much over UH. There's probably some sample bias going on since I just don't know many UH students. I have seen the SMU campus though, and I have worked and interviewed with some SMU law students, so I personally have a favorable impression of the school.

[ScottRiqui]

I have a science background, and I think it's hard to break into IP. I don't know why everyone thinks it's so much easier.

Thanks again for your posts. I wasn't thinking that IP would be "easy" - I actually only started considering law school recently so I don't know much about the market in general, much less the markets for particular specialties. It sounds interesting though, and I think that an engineering B.S. and a physics M.S. might be a good starting point, background-wise.

Yes, it's certainly possible, and a graduate degree and work experience help a lot. There just seems to be a general attitude on this forum that IP law is secure. If that's true, it is contrary to my observations. The competition for IP jobs was pretty stiff at OCI this year, and I think I'm going to have to settle for general litigation. I'm a bit uncomfortable using the word "settle," however, because I am very, very excited about my job offer.

I see where you're coming from, and appreciate your input. Like I said earlier, I really need to get my transcripts submitted and take an official LSAT to firm up my numbers. I'm just coming up on the end of my Navy career and trying to decide what I want to do when I "grow up".

Even if I end up going to law school, that probably won't be the end of my education. In addition to the GI Bill, I also have the Hazlewood Act, which pays for 150 credit hours' worth of tuition and fees at any Texas public university. I didn't mention that in this context because I believe I have to use up all of my GI Bill eligibility first, so the Hazlewood Act will have to wait for another degree.

[patrickd139]

Jazz, why do you advocate that SMU is worth going to but UH isn't?

That's an interesting question. I guess my main reason is anecdotal. I know quite a few people who got biglaw offers out of SMU. Dallas biglaw hires a decent number of SMU grads. SMU is not ranked that much higher than UH, but SMU has a far better reputation (at least in my circle). I am not as knowledgeable about the Houston market as I am the Dallas market. Perhaps UH is fine for Houston; I'm really not sure.

I guess when it comes down to it, I don't really have an objective reason to favor SMU so much over UH. There's probably some sample bias going on since I just don't know many UH students. I have seen the SMU campus though, and I have worked and interviewed with some SMU law students, so I personally have a favorable impression of the school.

To piggyback, a search for UofH and/or SMU threads should turn up several discussions on how SMU generally places very well in DFW biglaw, not so well in Houston, and how UofH places very well in Houston biglaw, and not so well in DFW. Mostly posters who went through the rosters of major biglaw firms and crunched the numbers.

It's probably self-selection for the most part, but there's no doubt that UofH and SMU are both very regional. With such huge markets respectively, I could understand how the reach of each school doesn't extend far past the regional limits.

[r6_philly]

I am going to offer another perspective.

With your WE and education, if you can't get big law, why invest in the 3 years of LS and get a job getting paid less than what you can make now? I have a CS background and long years of WE, and I know first hand you can get to $100-125k easily even with just a BS. And you have more degrees, which get you $150k if you work at it. If you go to UT and get IP big law, then it would afford you more earning potential, but if you go to the lower ranked schools you are probably not going to see that kind of money (even though some get it, it will be super competitive).

If you really want to get another degree because of the GI bill, see if you can get a MBA, and get into IT management which will most definitely make you more money than your lower ranked law school options.

Maybe you really really want to be a lawyer, but your GPA is holding you back. It's a shame, but rationally you may consider the more practical choices.

[Army2Law]

I'm 99% sure you can stack Hazelwood and the GI Bill, OP. I don't have Hazelwood, so I'm not sure, but that's what I've heard.

[ScottRiqui]

I'm 99% sure you can stack Hazelwood and the GI Bill, OP. I don't have Hazelwood, so I'm not sure, but that's what I've heard.

You could stack Hazlewood with the Montgomery GI Bill, but you can't stack the HA with the new Post-9/11 GI Bill. Since the new GI Bill pays the tuition and fees costs directly to the university, there would nothing for the GI Bill to pay if you used the HA to pay for tuition/fees.

[privatemf]

I'm 99% sure you can stack Hazelwood and the GI Bill, OP. I don't have Hazelwood, so I'm not sure, but that's what I've heard.

I don't believe you can stack the GI Bill with Hazelwood you have to submit your letter that you have used it up to the institutions. Post 9-11 is great and anyone should be good ecespecailly with the living allowance.

[jacketman03]

I'm 99% sure you can stack Hazelwood and the GI Bill, OP. I don't have Hazelwood, so I'm not sure, but that's what I've heard.

I don't believe you can stack the GI Bill with Hazelwood you have to submit your letter that you have used it up to the institutions. Post 9-11 is great and anyone should be good ecespecailly with the living allowance.

If you have less than 100% of the Post 9-11 GI Bill you can use Hazlewood to cover the gap.

Edit: I'm an idiot, I didn't realize that you had 100% of the Post 9-11, so no Hazlewood for you.

[crob20]

I'm 99% sure you can stack Hazelwood and the GI Bill, OP. I don't have Hazelwood, so I'm not sure, but that's what I've heard.

No, you cannot double dip Hazelwood with GI Bill.

[untar614]

I'm 99% sure you can stack Hazelwood and the GI Bill, OP. I don't have Hazelwood, so I'm not sure, but that's what I've heard.

No, you cannot double dip Hazelwood with GI Bill.

Strong necro on the first post of a 3-year-old account

[soj]

Please don't bump a 2-year-old thread.