Aspiring Sports Agent Going to Law School Forum

[FedFan123]

Hello everyone,

So I have used this website for the past few months as a resource, and I have now registered to get some much needed help. I believe that my situation is a little different than the norm, so if you could take this into consideration when answering then I would really appreciate that.

-The schools you are considering-NYU (50k scholarship), Virginia (no offer yet), Duke (60k), Northwestern (60k), Cornell (no offer yet), Washington University in St. Louis (120k scholarship), and University of Southern California (135k). Still haven't heard a word back from Harvard even though I applied in September, and also on the waitlists at Chicago and Columbia. I have withdrawn from all of my other accepted schools.

-The total Cost of Attendance (COA) of each. COA = cost of tuition + fees + books + cost of living (COL) + accumulated interest - scholarships. Here is a helpful calculator.

-How you will be financing your COA, i.e. loans, family, or savings---I come from a family that is well off with two BigLaw parents who are very happy for me to be going to law school, so they will be covering my expenses that are not covered by scholarship money. I will not be taking out loans.

-Where you are from and where you want to work, and other places where you have significant ties (if any)---I am from South Florida and I am very tired of the state of Florida, so I will definitely be looking to live somewhere else. I need to live somewhere with strong college athletics and professional sports (especially baseball and basketball since those are the sports I want to represent athletes in) so I am thinking out west in California or up north like Chicago, Boston, or New York.

-Your general career goals--------Becoming a sports agent is the end goal. For those of you that aren't aware of what that entails, it basically means I want to negotiate contracts and endorsement deals for professional athletes and also help them with any other legal/financial matters such as arbitration, mediation, etc.

-Your LSAT/GPA numbers -------173 and 3.70

-How many times you have taken the LSAT-----once


Considering my rather unique career goals, what school do you think would be best for me? As a sports agent, I will be trying to sell myself to college athletes as to why I would be the best choice for them as an agent. I will of course be selling myself to the athlete as well as their parents who normally play a significant role in choosing an agent. For this reason, I believe that lay prestige is a much more important factor for me than it normally would be for most 0L's. Out of all of my schools I have been accepted to, I would think that Duke has the best lay prestige (think Drew Rosenhaus) and of course Harvard would have the best of all if I were lucky enough to go there.

Since I won't be taking out loans, money obviously isn't the biggest factor here. Of course I want to lighten the burden on my parents as much as possible, but they are insisting on covering the cost of law school, so that is pretty hard to turn down.

I also wouldn't be totally against doing BigLaw for a couple years straight out of law school in order to build up finances and connections, but my dream is to be a sports agent and I want to achieve that goal as soon as possible out of law school.

Please let me hear your thoughts and whether or not you need any other information. One other thing I'm interested in is do you think I can negotiate with any of these schools? My offers from the T14 are pretty comparable and I don't know how much they would care about my offers from those non-T14 schools. Thank you very much in advance!

[PDaddy]

NYU>USC>>Duke >Northwestern

[bandenjamin]

--LinkRemoved--

Don't go to law school.

[Paul Campos]

I think you may be overrating lay prestige relative to law school prestige as a factor in your decision. I ran your situation past Metta World Peace (fka as Ron Artest), and he gave me an interesting glimpse into how professional athletes go about selecting agents. This is a pretty close paraphrase of his comments:

"The top NBA stars are all very sensitive to annual changes in the law school rankings when choosing their agents. I remember getting into an argument last year with Carmelo Anthony about whether GULC's relatively poor big law score was a product of self-selection into government and PI, and a few weeks ago I saw Kevin Durant and Ricky Rubio nearly came to blows over a disagreement regarding the significance of UVA's school-funded job percentage.

"Also, keep in mind that the quality of the rest of the agent's resume counts as well. A couple of years ago LeBron was almost convinced to switch to new representation, but when he saw the guy's resume he was turned off by his time at Latham, which according to King James 'isn't really a V10.' So he went with a SullCrom guy instead. I guess you could say the first guy got Lathamed!"

HTH

[FedFan123]

I've read that article before. That's one person's opinion, but I am definitely going to law school and I know that I have some strong options.

[PDaddy]

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Two ... agent.html

Don't go to law school.

I STRONGLY disagree with this. If you can stand to get your law degree and it makes financial sense for you, then get it!

A JD isn't necessary to become a sports agent, but many of the most successful ones (ex. Lee Steinberg and Scott Boras) have gone to law school.

The fact that something CAN be done a certain way doesn't mean that it's THE BEST way to do it. In LSAT-speak, the fact that something is "sufficient" to establish a career as a sports agent - in this case, foregoing law school and pursuing certification - doesn't mean that it is THE ONLY sufficient condition or THE BEST one.

By the same token, law school is certainly "sufficient" to open the door to a career as a sports agent even if it isn't "necessary", and it will allow OP to keep his options open by broadening and strengthening his skill-set.

An agent formally educated in law school will have certain advantages over one who is simply "certified", starting with potential networks established during school, summer associate positions, and even that first big law position. Moreover, career flexibility is important; what if a guy skips law school only to discover that he sucks as an agent?

Anyone who loves the sports business may want to transition into the league or team executive offices or become a labor consultant, etc. that person may also decide that he wants to return to traditional practice areas, or go into the entertainment side.

[Nova]

A Day in the Life of a Sports Lawyer:

8:30: Wake up in king-size bed to full view of Miami skyline. Soak in outdoor Jacuzzi while reviewing client’s latest endorsement deal on your iPad.

9:30: Call pasty lawyer for the sports drink company. Talk about how much client enjoys Powerade. Throw out a seven-figure number. Lawyer meekly assents.

10:00: Roll through town in brand-new Gallardo (a gift from an NASCAR driver who shall not be named). Take a call from the distraught parents of a first-round draft pick. In flyover country twang, they explain their son’s in a little trouble with the police.

10:15: Arrive at your downtown office. There’s white marble and a two-story fountain in the lobby. Ask cute, perky assistant with dirty blonde hair to get you the name of a local judge. Assistant wonders why you’re asking her to get local judge’s number, since in 2017 everyone has the numbers in their GoogleGlass.

11:00: Call with local judge who happens to be a season ticket holder. After you explain the situation, he signs an order for your client’s release as long as you keep him away from farm animals.

12:30: Lunch with Rival Sports Lawyer where you discuss competing views on the profession. He thinks clients are just meat to be grinded out. You think each client is a special snowflake.

2:00: Check fantasy sports league. You’re number one. Fondly reminisce how being champ of your fantasy football league in college and leading your team to victory at the UVA softball tournament B division (two years in a row!) first brought you to the attention of Big Time Sports Law Firm.

3:45: Trip to Dolphins training camp to negotiate new contract. Although you switched to soccer in elementary school because your Mom said “tackle football” was too dangerous, you can tell just from watching a few minutes of practice that your client’s an integral part of the team’s offensive scheme. This and a withering barrage of statistics wring another $3 million out of the GM.

5:00: Call with frantic GMs from three different MLB teams. There’s a six player trade they need done before the trade deadline at midnight. You think this rush of adrenaline must be what it’s like to pitch game 7 on three days of rest. You do a line of coke because Miami.

9:30: Deal of the century is done. Everyone calls you with congrats. Sexy blonde ESPN correspondent calls you to do a private interview.

10:00: Arrive at South Beach club wearing sharp suit with open collar. Walk past stunned club goers. Table in the VIP section with various professional athletes. They express admiration at what you do.

11:35: Spot a former Heat dancer who you helped secure a modeling contract at favorable terms. She glides over to you, looks deeply into your eyes, and whispers seductively “take advantage of three year federal deferment programs by calling us at 1-800-SHW-MUNY.”

8:45 AM: Wake up in a cold sweat with an unpaid student loan bill stuck to your forehead. You have an hour to get to Pinecrest to cover a $350 home closing. Before leaving, you check your fantasy sports standings. You’re third, behind a junior DA and the guy who picks players based on how many endorsement deals they have.

[FedFan123]

Paul Campos,

Really? I'm on here looking for valuable advice and I really don't appreciate being mocked. Thanks anyways...

[woosah]

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Two ... agent.html

Don't go to law school.

That is a ridiculous conclusion to base off of the article that you just linked. Here are two direct quotes from it:

There’s no doubt that law school is a plus if you want to become an agent or land a job in sports. I scanned the bios of the top 10 agents and found that eight had attended law school.

If you want to become an agent, law school is not a must but will definitely help your cause and give you some credibility with players and their families.

Those two quotes come from an agent who is not a lawyer and who says:

When I’m asked by a prospective client if I’m a lawyer, I proudly say no.

So I think it's fair to believe he's not biased in favor of going to law school. (If anything, he'd be the opposite.)

[cinephile]

Paul Campos,

Really? I'm on here looking for valuable advice and I really don't appreciate being mocked. Thanks anyways...

There's only one good reason to go to law school - to become a lawyer. If you have other career goals in mind, then you can and should make them a reality without a law degree. You are more likely than not going to end up disappointed and in debt and people are trying to save you from yourself.

[FedFan123]

So far I feel like the only person that has taken me seriously is PDaddy. Nova, while what you posted was funny, it really doesn't help me in the slightest. I'm not going to change my career goals because of what people on TLS say, so please don't even try. I've wanted to be a sports agent for a very long time, I've gotten into a handful of T14 law schools, and I am serious about making this happen.

I just want to be answered in a respectful manner, so I really appreciate your comments PDaddy. Would you care to elaborate on why you have the schools ordered as such? You seem to have a strong understanding of the subject.

Also, just want to say that I'm not trying to offend anyone, I just want to be treated with respect and courtesy.

[FedFan123]

Cinephile,

Did you even read my first post? I'm not going to graduate with any debt and I said that I wouldn't be averse to working BigLaw after law school for a while.... Jesus Christ, I try being as respectful as possible in all of my posts and just want some information. If you are just going to tell me to not go to law school, then please just don't respond...

[Nova]

Id just go to NYU if I were you. Since loans are not an issue, may as well go to the best school with the best transactional law prospects.

[Paul Campos]

OK actual advice:

(1) The prestige (lay or otherwise) of your law degree will probably have zero relevance to whether you manage to make a career out of being a sports agent. I actually know a little about this because a relative of mine is married to a big deal athlete. Most successful agents (and there aren't many) are either former fairly high level athletes themselves or fantastic salesmen or some combination of the two.

(2) If you're truly committed to this you should take into account whether you're going to be going to the same school as some potential clients. That's how several of the most prominent agents got their foot in the door.

(3) The chances are about 50 times greater that you're going to end up trying to make it in big law and then on the post big law track rather than as a sports agent, so you had better be more than OK with that. Otherwise go get an MBA or something. Going to law school to do something other than to try to make a career as a lawyer is an invariably terrible idea.

[snagglepuss]

I think you may be overrating lay prestige relative to law school prestige as a factor in your decision. I ran your situation past Metta World Peace (fka as Ron Artest), and he gave me an interesting glimpse into how professional athletes go about selecting agents. This is a pretty close paraphrase of his comments:

"The top NBA stars are all very sensitive to annual changes in the law school rankings when choosing their agents. I remember getting into an argument last year with Carmelo Anthony about whether GULC's relatively poor big law score was a product of self-selection into government and PI, and a few weeks ago I saw Kevin Durant and Ricky Rubio nearly came to blows over a disagreement regarding the significance of UVA's school-funded job percentage.

"Also, keep in mind that the quality of the rest of the agent's resume counts as well. A couple of years ago LeBron was almost convinced to switch to new representation, but when he saw the guy's resume he was turned off by his time at Latham, which according to King James 'isn't really a V10.' So he went with a SullCrom guy instead. I guess you could say the first guy got Lathamed!"

HTH

This was pretty 180. Well played, PC.

[FedFan123]

Ok thanks for the input. I do sincerely appreciate it. Going off your second point Paul, that is one of the reasons why I was looking at Duke Law. I want to become a certified agent for the NBA and MLB, and obviously Duke has one of the best basketball programs in the country (let's forget about Mercer for a minute here). I think being near that program would be an extremely valuable asset.

I do think that lay prestige is important, but maybe that is just my opinion. Being able to tell a kid and their parents that I went to Duke Law (everyone knows Duke) might be the difference maker.

I also know that this is an extremely competitive field, I am not delusional. But I do think that I have the right mindset, personality, and set of qualities to make it happen. I also think law school will make it even more likely to happen. I do realize how difficult it will be though, but I am willing to work my hardest to make it happen. If you have a dream you should go for it shouldn't you?

[PDaddy]

The reason I ordered the schools as I did is simple: the sports and entertainment businesses are very unique in that careers in those sectors are established as much by who you know as what you know.

That informs two major considerations: Biglaw prospects and geography. A third factor is specialty courses and clinics within the choice schools. When broken down that way it is easy to see that being in NY and attending NYU would be among the best choices one can make.

NYU has an extraordinarily large number of sports and entertainment and sports law courses (the businesses are similar and cross-pollinated, so more or less of one or the other shouldn't dissuade you). Secondly, NY is a major sports Mecca, with the sports leagues either centralized there or having major offices there. That presents more internship opportunities.

USC would be a close second for obvious reasons, and many people would suggest that, strictly considering the unique career goal you have, USC would offer the same opportunities as NYU. However, you need to consider overall job prospects, and that is where Duke and Northwestern should get really strong consideration.

While Duke's location isn't a major sports market, it is an elite school with strong big law prospects. The school also has a very well-run athletic department, which could present great internship opportunities.

I would advise any prospective law student aspiring a career in sports or entertainment to attend a school with at least decent big law prospects. Although USC has weaker big law prospects than the other three schools I ranked, it's entertainment and sports networks make it worthy of consideration.

And again, remember the number of sports and entertainment courses and clinics at each school. Northwestern probably has fewer than the other three.

TLS has an in-depth info page on this very topic, and it lists all of the schools that tend to have strong sports and entertainment law course listings, clinics, societies, etc.

TLS mentions other schools:

HYS, Columbia, Michigan, Penn, UCLA, Vanderbilt, Fordham, Miami, Tulane, Loyola (CA)...

http://www.top-law-schools.com/entertai ... hools.html

[FedFan123]

Thanks snagglepuss, extremely helpful.

[PDaddy]

I think you may be overrating lay prestige relative to law school prestige as a factor in your decision. I ran your situation past Metta World Peace (fka as Ron Artest), and he gave me an interesting glimpse into how professional athletes go about selecting agents. This is a pretty close paraphrase of his comments:

"The top NBA stars are all very sensitive to annual changes in the law school rankings when choosing their agents. I remember getting into an argument last year with Carmelo Anthony about whether GULC's relatively poor big law score was a product of self-selection into government and PI, and a few weeks ago I saw Kevin Durant and Ricky Rubio nearly came to blows over a disagreement regarding the significance of UVA's school-funded job percentage.

"Also, keep in mind that the quality of the rest of the agent's resume counts as well. A couple of years ago LeBron was almost convinced to switch to new representation, but when he saw the guy's resume he was turned off by his time at Latham, which according to King James 'isn't really a V10.' So he went with a SullCrom guy instead. I guess you could say the first guy got Lathamed!"

HTH

This was pretty 180. Well played, PC.

I get the point (er...joke), but this post fails to consider realistically that law students seek career flexibility, and that there are many paths to a successful sports business career. OP should approach this aspiration like he would any other: as one that could easily change while in law school or if he foregoes law school.

Again, consider the logic, Sufficient v. Necessary. OP could become a sports attorney -even a successful one - without going to law school, but that really isn't the relevant question here.

You could become a tax advisor without becoming a tax attorney, but that doesn't devalue a law degree attained with that and other goals in mind.

[FedFan123]

Thank you very much PDaddy. You've been awesome and that was exactly the kind of information and thought process that I was looking for. I also really appreciate you taking the time to actually write that all out, especially in a respectful manner without trying to mock me for what I want to do. I wasn't looking at NYU as much as I was Duke or Virginia, but I am going to have to give it more of a thought. If only I could get accepted to Harvard and then maybe this problem wouldn't even exist lol

[rad lulz]

d

[rad lulz]

d

[rad lulz]

d

[FedFan123]

I'm trying to stay respectful, but it's extremely difficult when the majority of the people on here come across as giant assholes. There I said it. There's no reason to keep posting on my thread with no purpose other than to congratulate someone for their stupid mockery of my question. Seriously, what the hell is wrong with most of you? Do you have friends in real life or people that actually like you? Because I find it hard to believe that anyone could tolerate you if you all act this way in real life.

[FedFan123]

Rad lulz, you're actually quite pathetic.