NY Firms No-Offering Forum

[beomoth33]

Back to K&E. At a minimum, I don’t buy the post about the affirmative action comment - there’s got to be only 1 or 2 black partners at K&E NY, if that.

[Anonymous User]

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[Anonymous User]

What are some examples of cluelessness about professional norms y'all are seeing? Not talking about racist, sexist etc. types of egregious comments and behavior.

A few things that I've seen -

Treating partners like they are friends. TBF, partners foster this but hoo boy they are in for a rude awakening once they start as associates.

Associate here. I could definitely imagine a degree of casual friendship that is inappropriate, but making friends with the partners in a professional “work friend” way is not only acceptable, but desirable. I have an excellent reputation with most of the partners in my office, including many that I’ve never worked with. I credit this in part to befriending them all socially (the other part is doing good quality work for the partners I do actually work with, which the other partners eventually hear about). This has afforded me a bunch of opportunities so far and I’m definitely treated as a “favorite” even by people I’ve never worked for directly.

When the partnership vote happens eventually, obviously the economic case comes first (including circumstance of the market and your practice at that time). But it is also largely a popularity contest, and as long as the key partners in your specific group support your case economically, it’s easy to get all the other partners on board if you’ve spent a decade making friends with them.

[TigerIsBack]

What are some examples of cluelessness about professional norms y'all are seeing? Not talking about racist, sexist etc. types of egregious comments and behavior.

A few things that I've seen -

Treating partners like they are friends. TBF, partners foster this but hoo boy they are in for a rude awakening once they start as associates.

Associate here. I could definitely imagine a degree of casual friendship that is inappropriate, but making friends with the partners in a professional “work friend” way is not only acceptable, but desirable. I have an excellent reputation with most of the partners in my office, including many that I’ve never worked with. I credit this in part to befriending them all socially (the other part is doing good quality work for the partners I do actually work with, which the other partners eventually hear about). This has afforded me a bunch of opportunities so far and I’m definitely treated as a “favorite” even by people I’ve never worked for directly.

When the partnership vote happens eventually, obviously the economic case comes first (including circumstance of the market and your practice at that time). But it is also largely a popularity contest, and as long as the key partners in your specific group support your case economically, it’s easy to get all the other partners on board if you’ve spent a decade making friends with them.

I'm guessing what they meant was being "too" friendly or casual with the partners. As a summer, you have to understand the power balance and that partners are often being extra friendly because they're equally trying to sell you on the firm so you come back and work for them in a year. SAs that assume they are actually friends with certain partners after a couple social functions and then making jokes that are actually insults (and that would be totally appropriate with your close friends) are not appropriate to a partner who you haven't known very long. Senior associates that have worked for these partners closely for 5+ years may be able to get away with this because they are probably actually friends and when you're in the trenches with people long enough some light hearted ribbing can occur in both directions but it feels uncomfortable watching SAs be too chummy with seniors and partners when you can see those people are clearly just laughing along to not make it even more awkward.

[Anonymous User]

Were these just rumors then?

[Anonymous User]

Were these just rumors then?

I think so. Everyone in the chicago office received offers today during a reception. No one has heard about these NY cold offers outside of from tls.

Master troll, whoever started this rumor.

[Anonymous User]

Someone posted about this earlier in the thread, but one KE NY summer did get fired during the last week (rather than no-offered) for celebrating Dobbs openly and harassing personal assistants. KE fired him so they could still report 100% return offers.

[Anonymous User]

Reportedly from K&E the summer prancing around about Dobbs was fired and there is a note at the security desk to not let them in

[Res Ipsa Loquitter]

Reportedly from K&E the summer prancing around about Dobbs was fired and there is a note at the security desk to not let them in

Is it confirmed that he pranced? Was there clearly a vertical, bouncy movement atypical to a normal gait?

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know which schools this Dobbs guys was from.

[Wild Card]

It is my understanding based on my personal knowedge or lack thereof, that the Dobbs bro was promoted to full share partner--not even fake partner.

[Anonymous User]

It is my understanding based on my personal knowedge or lack thereof, that the Dobbs bro was promoted to full share partner--not even fake partner.

Dobbs bro was Ballis all along

[sd1111111]

Reportedly from K&E the summer prancing around about Dobbs was fired and there is a note at the security desk to not let them in

Is it confirmed that he pranced? Was there clearly a vertical, bouncy movement atypical to a normal gait?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eCLp7zodUiI

[Anonymous User]

Reportedly from K&E the summer prancing around about Dobbs was fired and there is a note at the security desk to not let them in

Confirmed. I saw a picture of the note (which I found very amusing).

[Anonymous User]

One of them went around saying congratulations to female SA's post Dobbs and the other asked a black share partner if he was a diversity hire.

I always wonder how people like this managed to make it through college and a (presumably) good law school without realizing how bad this activity is

Kids who never were in a normal work environment sometimes lack the awareness of what's not OK at work. Also the 100% offer rate + common online refrain that you need to sexually harass someone to lose your offer has I think shifted the way people act. Maybe this will make me sound like a boomer but I've seen a lot of summers behave inappropriately for a work environment. I guess they'll eventually grow up and once the workload hits they won't have time to act up. But maybe scaring summers isn't so bad.

The thing is, college environments --and especially top colleges that most biglaw SA's went to-- are much more sensitive about this type of thing than many work environments. As someone who worked office jobs in Texas for many years, and then went to HYS much later in life (and recently), congratulating women about Dobbs and asking someone if they are a diversity hire is something that I would expect out of a Texas office much moreso than a top university campus. So I dont think the "i didnt know work culture thing" really tracks. Wearing sundresses or whatever, yeah i guess, but i think the young people just dont care rather than dont know.

How is going to HYS relevant at all to this? Also it’s YSC anyways.