75K Chicago, Penn, Full @ NYU, 78-80k HLS. How To Leverage? Forum

[nunumaster]

.

[PrideandGlory1776]

Harvard

[Otunga]

NU with minimal debt is a solid choice for generic biglaw, provided that there's good reason to believe the accelerated program places comparably to the three year program.

I'd say that unless H offers you an excellent amount of aid, stick with NU.

As for NU vs NYU full ride, I'd go with NYU full ride, so I suppose you do have to hedge here.

[nunumaster]

Damn, won't get my package from HLS until Monday. Just called their office...

I really don't want to be out of $750 on a non refundable deposit...

[PrideandGlory1776]

Sorry misread didn't know you were in running for NYU full-ride. Harvard w/ $$$ > NYU Full Ride > NU AJD Full Ride. I'd say 140k AJD though is better than NYU at 100k or less though cause 1 year opportunity cost and well they place just about the same both over 50%+ get 500+ size firms though NYU perhaps with higher Vault Rankings due to NYC placement and slightly higher prestige. In any case if no loot at Harvard it's a toss up between NU 140k and Harvard if you get full ride at NYU or 100k+ that's a super tough call. In the meantime your going to be investing 2/3 years of your life how in the world can you justify not paying the $750 that would be irrational in the extreme - keep your options open and make the best decision when you have all the information at your disposal don't foreclose opportunities unnecessarily that'd be crazy.

[Otunga]

Sorry misread didn't know you were in running for NYU full-ride. Harvard w/ $$$ > NYU Full Ride > NU AJD Full Ride. I'd say 140k AJD though is better than NYU at 100k or less though cause 1 year opportunity cost and well they place just about the same both over 50%+ get 500+ size firms though NYU perhaps with higher Vault Rankings due to NYC placement and slightly higher prestige. In any case if no loot at Harvard it's a toss up between NU 140k and Harvard if you get full ride at NYU or 100k+ that's a super tough call. In the meantime your going to be investing 2/3 years of your life how in the world can you justify not paying the $750 that would be irrational in the extreme - keep your options open and make the best decision when you have all the information at your disposal don't foreclose opportunities unnecessarily that'd be crazy.

Completely agreed that he/she has to make the $750 deposit. Even if they have to take a private loan, it's well worth the investment.

[jbagelboy]

I say deposit at Northwestern, and stick with it unless Harvard offers more than $25K/year (or I guess if you get AnBryce).

You have to consider opportunity cost here. Assume a 65% chance OP would make ~$125,000 after taxes but assuming refund & including bonus in biglaw coming out of AJD rather than wasting away as a 3L at Harvard or NYU. Maybe 15% at $80K, 15% at $45K and 5% at 0 (unemployed) for other outcomes. So E(3L) = (0.65)(125000) + (0.15)(80000) + (0.15)(45000). Add this to the added debt at Harvard, subtracting 3L living expenses, and you have a more realistic figure. Do the same with NYU.

[Big Dog]

I say deposit at Northwestern, and stick with it unless Harvard offers more than $25K/year.

You have to consider opportunity cost here

Exactly. Moreover, if you try to withdraw from NULS (with the H financial aid package), they might throw more money at you just for temptation.....

[nunumaster]

I say deposit at Northwestern, and stick with it unless Harvard offers more than $25K/year.

You have to consider opportunity cost here

Exactly. Moreover, if you try to withdraw from NULS (with the H financial aid package), they might throw more money at you just for temptation.....

HLS is offering me roughly 27 k for 1L. Assuming I do PI my first year, my summer income would go down from my current levels, and my likely aid would go up to 30 k for 2L.

1L – 27 K
2L – 30 k
3L – 21 K

Total Grants HLS = 78 K

Also got my Chicago package today = only 75k

Think I can get Chicago up to 120K based on HLS/NU scholarship info?

Also, everyone who has voted, would you reconsider me depositing at NU now?

[paglababa]

I would personally take HLS at 78K over 140K at NU, but year that one extra year of being in LS is something to consider. I think NU will not set you up for as good a big law exit option as AnBryce or HLS.

[Otunga]

It's close OP but I'd choose H with that offer. However I think you'd be okay with the AJD from Northwestern as well.

[lwskl44]

It comes down to how likely you think you are to wind up taking the NU offer. Holding the offer would not be worth $750 if I were confident that I would not ultimately take the offer. You certainly don't need to hold onto the offer for negotiating leverage--your collection of generous offers in the T6 are plenty of leverage. This comes down to weighing an extra year of school against the permanent prestige bonus you'd gain from Harvard, etc.

[lawschool22]

I feel like a broken record today but we need your total COA. Try this: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=225195

[nunumaster]

In case anyone was wondering, I withdrew from NU. Just can't see my self attending with dat HLS grant package.


Is there anything I can do incase I don't get the AnBryce fully at NYU?

I have 75k at Penn and 75k at Chicago. Anyway I can try to get a fully at any of these schools using Harvard aid package as leverage? Maybe I can say I am a finalist for a full ride at NYU too? Should I wait to negotiate until 2 weeks from now (when I know about AnBryce and if I should even bother), or email Chicago + Penn today?

[jbagelboy]

In case anyone was wondering, I withdrew from NU. Just can't see my self attending with dat HLS grant package.


Is there anything I can do incase I don't get the AnBryce fully at NYU?

I have 75k at Penn and 75k at Chicago. Anyway I can try to get a fully at any of these schools using Harvard aid package as leverage? Maybe I can say I am a finalist for a full ride at NYU too? Should I wait to negotiate until 2 weeks from now (when I know about AnBryce and if I should even bother), or email Chicago + Penn today?

Penn might up you for Chicago, but not the other way around. Both will hear your Harvard package. Being a finalist for a full ride won't mean anything as of now.

Negotiate away. I think you have a lot of room to maneuver. However, that's a nice package from Harvard & as far as career flexibility is concerned no one would question a decision to attend.

[rayiner]

If you want business, why are you not doing an MBA?

People who go into big law trying to break into a business role generally do not succeed and end up resentful and unhappy. They also end up being miserable to work with for everyone else.

[nunumaster]

If you want business, why are you not doing an MBA?

People who go into big law trying to break into a business role generally do not succeed and end up resentful and unhappy. They also end up being miserable to work with for everyone else.

Multiple reasons:
I am interested in the intersection between business and law. I'm not saying I want to go to law school and then gun for banking.
I also thought it was easier to get a full ride to law school. Also, because I probably wouldn't get into the very best business schools.

Lets be clear: I am interested in law and not opposed to doing big law. That being said, people who think they will enjoy big law are seriously kidding themselves. But I digress.

Still need help in picking the best deal for school or strategy for negotiating Chitown up to a nice amount.

[jbagelboy]

If you want business, why are you not doing an MBA?

People who go into big law trying to break into a business role generally do not succeed and end up resentful and unhappy. They also end up being miserable to work with for everyone else.

Multiple reasons:
I am interested in the intersection between business and law. I'm not saying I want to go to law school and then gun for banking.
I also thought it was easier to get a full ride to law school. Also, because I probably wouldn't get into the very best business schools.

Lets be clear: I am interested in law and not opposed to doing big law. That being said, people who think they will enjoy big law are seriously kidding themselves. But I digress.

Still need help in picking the best deal for school or strategy for negotiating Chitown up to a nice amount.

If you got into HLS, Chicago, and Penn, you clearly have the grades for b-school. Did you just miss the boat on the recruiting cycle at your UG for ib/consulting?

[nunumaster]

I also thought it was easier to get a full ride to law school.

This this part is important that I highlight once again. So much easier getting a full ride based off of GPA/LSAT at lawschool, correct me if I'm wrong?

If you got into HLS, Chicago, and Penn, you clearly have the grades for b-school. Did you just miss the boat on the recruiting cycle at your UG for ib/consulting?

Yes, I missed that boat long ago, but I'm not sad about it. Analyst level ib sounds terrible.

Not going to biz school. I think NYU is my top choice right now, but would like a way to get Chicago or Penn to play ball for backup? If not, I think HLS is the best backup and will be nice in terms of keeping career options open (but that 150k in debt just burns).

[rayiner]

If you want business, why are you not doing an MBA?

People who go into big law trying to break into a business role generally do not succeed and end up resentful and unhappy. They also end up being miserable to work with for everyone else.

Multiple reasons:
I am interested in the intersection between business and law. I'm not saying I want to go to law school and then gun for banking.
I also thought it was easier to get a full ride to law school. Also, because I probably wouldn't get into the very best business schools.

Lets be clear: I am interested in law and not opposed to doing big law. That being said, people who think they will enjoy big law are seriously kidding themselves. But I digress.

Still need help in picking the best deal for school or strategy for negotiating Chitown up to a nice amount.

A Tuck MBA is much more prestigious than an HLS grad big lawyer trying to break over to the business side of the deal. And Big Law can be a grind, but (speaking for myself as a second year and not a 0L), you can enjoy it if you like being a lawyer. I'd rather be the guy someone calls when the company has a massive fuckup than the guy they call to optimize their capital structure. In my experience, the second most miserable people in the profession are the ones that are butthurt that they can't break over to the business side of a deal. And they're the first most annoying, because their bitterness is contagious. They feel compelled to cut down the job because they are jealous of the deal guys. The folks that went to law school as a default choice are miserable, but in a quiet silent way.

[hcrimson2014]

I say deposit at Northwestern, and stick with it unless Harvard offers more than $25K/year.

You have to consider opportunity cost here

Exactly. Moreover, if you try to withdraw from NULS (with the H financial aid package), they might throw more money at you just for temptation.....

HLS is offering me roughly 27 k for 1L. Assuming I do PI my first year, my summer income would go down from my current levels, and my likely aid would go up to 30 k for 2L.

1L – 27 K
2L – 30 k
3L – 21 K

Total Grants HLS = 78 K

Also got my Chicago package today = only 75k

Think I can get Chicago up to 120K based on HLS/NU scholarship info?

Also, everyone who has voted, would you reconsider me depositing at NU now?

If you don't mind me asking, when did you complete your aid application at HLS?

[IAFG]

Do HLS -> JD/MBA -> business

[rayiner]

Could've also done full ride NU + apply for Kellogg JD/MBA through their 1L admissions.

[hcrimson2014]

Do HLS -> JD/MBA -> business

But HBS -> MBA -> business would save you a whole year and $80,000 while giving you the same prospect.

[helmsleyB]

Do HLS -> JD/MBA -> business

But HBS -> MBA -> business would save you a whole year and $80,000 while giving you the same prospect.

Seconded^^^

UPDATED OP:
I'm looking for big law or better yet, break into a business role

3L here. Hoping to get out of law entirely (i.e. prolly break into business) after a short stint in biglaw, but I'm not too optimistic about the prospect. If you have a JD, employers want to put that to use. E.g. you can apply for consulting jobs out of law school, jump in at/around same level as an MBA, but the consulting firms will still encourage you to take the bar. The JD will pigeon-hole you a bit, bc once you've got it, chances are your greatest value to an employer will (appear to) be in legal work.
Just sayin, don't bank on that move being easy.

If you really want business, go for an MBA.
IMO JD/MBA is kind of a bet-hedging move. Can't think of a position that would require both degrees, but it prolly gives you more options if (read:when) law is boring you to death.

Of course, caveats apply if you already have a business background or an advanced degree in econ, or your mom manages a hedge fund, etc. etc.