Chances at U of Maryland

[Maxb031]

Hey everyone, so quick background.

Wasn’t a conventional student. Started college while in the military, bounced from brick and motor to online schools. Ended up getting injured overseas pretty seriously and grades took a nose dive while in Walter Reed.

Got out and became a cop in Maryland. Was enrolled at UMD, but ended up working on various investigative task forces and could no longer commute to class. Finished my last credits at UMGC where I subsequently graduated with a BS in political science. With a 2.2 gpa, absolutely embarrassing.

Fast forward 5 years. Ended up going to grad school at Florida State. Got an MS from their criminology program, 3.7 GPA and published thesis. LSAT score was 169. I plan on staying within my agency once I graduate law school, as it’s a major dept and I intend on promoting.

With a terrible undergrad GPA from a terrible school, does the rest offset it as a non traditional applicant applying for the night program at UMD? I also have two academic letters and a recommendation from a judge would I worked closely with that also adjuncts there. Thanks in advance for the honest advice everyone.

[The Lsat Airbender]

You need to find out your actual cumulative GPA- the one that LSAC calculates.

[Maxb031]

You need to find out your actual cumulative GPA- the one that LSAC calculates.

So I sat down, used 7sage and have come to my current cas GPA which is 1.97. Now, I’m going to start the process to try and have 4 F’s removed from my transcript which I got in one semester when I was in Walter Reed. The classes were while I was in Afghanistan, and when I was blown up it was touch and go for a while. To be honest, I completely disregarded those classes (honestly forgot about that semester until I just pulled the transcript, as I transferred institutions immediately after release). This was circa 2010 so there has been time in between.

In the event my request gets denied which is also very likely, is UMD, or UBalt a reach which my LSAT scores and the softs I have?

Also, UBalt has a concentration in criminal law which is definitely the route I’d be interested in. Seeing my goals as what they are, would UBalt be a better idea all around for me?

[Maxb031]

Anything? Lol I know it’s pretty bad.

[QContinuum]

It's going to be very hard to predict, because you're a "super" splitter. Your LSAT's far above Maryland's LSAT 75th (161) - congrats on the 169! At the same time, as you recognize, your LSAC GPA is unfortunately abysmal. You do have pretty much the most compelling explanation possible for your GPA, but law school admissions are still typically numbers-based.

So, I'd say you have a good shot, and I don't really know that anyone could offer you more certainty than that. There just aren't that many applicants like you, so there's really no good data to draw from.

As for getting the Fs "removed" from your transcript, I'd recommend looking at exactly what happens if they "remove" it. Even if your college "forgives" the Fs, they may still factor into your LSAC GPA. They will only be taken out of your LSAC GPA if the "forgiven" Fs are entirely wiped out (i.e., literally not displayed) from your transcript. So long as the Fs are still there - even if there's a line drawn through the F, even if the school no longer includes them in calculating the GPA shown on your transcript, even if the school notes "grade forgiven" etc. on your transcript - they will still be counted by LSAC. See https://www.lsac.org/applying-law-schoo ... marization

[Maxb031]

It's going to be very hard to predict, because you're a "super" splitter. Your LSAT's far above Maryland's LSAT 75th (161) - congrats on the 169! At the same time, as you recognize, your LSAC GPA is unfortunately abysmal. You do have pretty much the most compelling explanation possible for your GPA, but law school admissions are still typically numbers-based.

So, I'd say you have a good shot, and I don't really know that anyone could offer you more certainty than that. There just aren't that many applicants like you, so there's really no good data to draw from.

As for getting the Fs "removed" from your transcript, I'd recommend looking at exactly what happens if they "remove" it. Even if your college "forgives" the Fs, they may still factor into your LSAC GPA. They will only be taken out of your LSAC GPA if the "forgiven" Fs are entirely wiped out (i.e., literally not displayed) from your transcript. So long as the Fs are still there - even if there's a line drawn through the F, even if the school no longer includes them in calculating the GPA shown on your transcript, even if the school notes "grade forgiven" etc. on your transcript - they will still be counted by LSAC. See https://www.lsac.org/applying-law-schoo ... marization

Got ya. I am supposed to hear back Monday, so we will see what happens. Now I took the LSAT cold, with maybe 2- 3 weeks of study that was just using free apps. Would it behoove me to take the next 6 months or so and study my head off? Or will any increase in LSAT score not make much of a difference at this point since I’m such a massive splitter as is.

If retaking the LSAT is the call? Should I invest in one of the more expensive packages at 7Sage? Or stick with the basic one.

Thanks again for your response.

[QContinuum]

Good luck - fingers crossed you get good news on Monday!

In my view, your situation is one of the relatively rare ones we see on TLS where retaking the LSAT is unlikely to yield significant returns. UMD's LSAT 75th is 161. You're already well, well above that, with your 169. For your admissions chances to UMD specifically, I don't think it'd make a difference whether you have a 169 or a 175.

Perhaps a better question, though, is re: your goals out of law school. Are you 200% committed to staying at your agency after law school, to the point where you wouldn't really consider any alternatives? Would your agency transition you to a legal role after you're admitted to the bar, or would you continue doing what you're currently doing? If your agency would transition you to a legal role, how certain are you that they would do this - is it guaranteed, or is there any realistic chance that they might say, "sorry, we don't really need any more lawyers, you're welcome to stay with us in your old job, maybe with a slight pay bump due to your J.D."? I'm not asking these questions to be discouraging, but just want to make sure that attending UMD makes sense for you.

Because the alternative is, especially if you retake and get into the 17x range (which seems entirely doable for you), you could easily get into a T20 (with WUSTL all but guaranteed), with an outside shot at a T13. So I want to probe whether there'd be any value for you in trying to get into a T20/T13, or whether attending UMD really makes the most sense for you. I realize you're not the "traditional" K-JD applicant, so I don't want to reflexively promote the T20/T13 to you.