Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
pre-law
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Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby pre-law » Sun Dec 19, 2010 4:15 pm

Out-of-state 1L student at Arizona State and just finished the first semester. I'm happy to take any questions you have about the law school!

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jeremydc
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby jeremydc » Sun Dec 19, 2010 4:17 pm

Stats? Why Arizona State? Other schools you have been accepted to? Regrets (honestly)?

pre-law
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby pre-law » Sun Dec 19, 2010 4:43 pm

Stats were 3.6 and 161 LSAT.

Other than ASU, I was considering Loyola (Los Angeles) and the University of San Diego. I wanted to go somewhere warm for law school since I knew I eventually wanted to settle and start my career in a place that had nice weather.

I chose ASU over Loyola and USD for a few reasons. First, ASU offered the best financial package among the three. ASU offered a guaranteed half-ride scholarship for my first year and an opportunity to earn in-state residency for my second and third years which would be the same financially as if I had the half-ride scholarship all 3 years. Loyola and USD offered half-ride scholarships as well but they were to be awarded on a yearly basis if I achieved a top 30% ranking in my class. I didn't doubt my ability to get in the top 30% of the class at those schools but it was risky gamble because the tuition is very high (higher than even ASU's out of state tuition).

Another reason I chose ASU is because it is on a large campus and as a student there you have access to all of the amenities and resources afforded to all students. Loyola , by contrast, is just the law school. For example, at ASU I have access to the student rec center right there on campus whereas if I went to Loyola I would have to find a rec center somewhere else away from campus. That is just one example, but overall I thought the quality of life would be much higher at ASU than the other schools which was important since law school can be stressful.

Third, the Phoenix market is A LOT less saturated than the Los Angeles and San Diego markets. Phoenix is the 5th largest city in the country and other than Phoenix Law (4th tier), ASU is the only law school in the Phoenix metropolitan area. By contrast, if you go to Loyola or USD and work in Los Angeles or San Diego, you'll probably find yourself competing with Stanford, Berkeley, UCLA, USC, UC Davis, UC Hastings grads on a consistent basis along with other similarly ranked schools such as Pepperdine. Not to mention that Los Angeles and San Diego are highly desirable places to work so Loyola and USD grads are also faced with competition from Ivy League law school grads coming to the West Coast. If a Stanford or Ivy League law school grad is coming to Phoenix its probably because they have some tie to the area such as they grew up there or went to college there or something. I felt this was something I had to consider when choosing a law school given the current state of the legal job market.

dccoope
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby dccoope » Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:23 am

Has the school said anything recently to current students about the timeline of moving the law school to the downtown campus? I think that campus makes much more sense and would be so much nicer than Tempe.

pre-law
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby pre-law » Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:38 am

dccoope wrote:Has the school said anything recently to current students about the timeline of moving the law school to the downtown campus? I think that campus makes much more sense and would be so much nicer than Tempe.


This is the latest I have heard

http://law.asu.edu/LinkClick.aspx?filet ... &tabid=803

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TexasLaw
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby TexasLaw » Tue Dec 21, 2010 6:33 pm

Here's a few questions..

*Any idea how employment prospects are for current 2L/3L's? Any idea how OCI has gone?
*Are there alot of people from out of state? How do u like Phoenix?
*How social is your class? Lots of participation in bar review/intermurals/other events?
*Hows the gym there?

pre-law
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby pre-law » Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:12 pm

TexasLaw wrote:Here's a few questions..

*Any idea how employment prospects are for current 2L/3L's? Any idea how OCI has gone?
*Are there alot of people from out of state? How do u like Phoenix?
*How social is your class? Lots of participation in bar review/intermurals/other events?
*Hows the gym there?



* I've asked this same question to current 2Ls and 3Ls and this is what they've told me but don't take it as gospel since they're not the Career Services Office and they represent a small sample. That said, if you're in the top 10% of the class you should be able to land a job with one of the big law firms in Phoenix. If you're between 10-50%, you shouldn't have trouble finding a paying law job during the summer or after graduation. The bottom half of the class, you really have to network since your grades aren't stellar and there are less legal job opportunities give the current state of the market.

In terms of judicial clerkships, the Arizona Court of Appeals and Arizona Supreme Court seem to love taking ASU grads as law clerks. Combined they take about 12-14 ASU grads as law clerks per year. Of the 5 Justices on the Arizona Supreme Court, 2 of them are ASU law grads (one is Chief Justice), and another teaches Civil Procedure at the law school. ASU sends about 3-4 graduates per year to clerk for federal judges (U.S. District Court, Bankruptcy Court, U.S. Court of Appeals for the 9th Circuit).


* About half of the 190 person 1L class are out-of-state residents. Out-of-state institutions range pretty widely from Yale, Dartmouth, and Stanford to the University of Georgia, University of Washington, and Michigan State to the University of St Thomas and Truman State.

Phoenix is great so far. The cost of living is very low compared to other places with warm weather ie California. Also, the roads, highways, landscaping in the area look brand new compared to other areas I've lived (Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle). There's a few obvious downers about Phoenix. First, it is really hot during the summer time (Between 100 and 115 everyday). Once you survive the summers though you're in good shape. I just left Arizona to go home for break and it was 65 degrees and sunny; not many places are like that in late December. Second, it takes some time getting used to not seeing as many trees and lakes and other natural water sources if you've lived in areas like Seattle and San Francisco like I have. Phoenix's terrain and landscape is more along the lines of mountains, palm trees, and if you venture beyond the surrounding cities, desert.


* My class is pretty social. We have a weekly bar review that draws about 50-70 students per outing; though this number obviously decreases as Finals approach. Students in my class have regularly thrown parties at their house and invited all of the 1Ls. These have been well-attended as well (around 70 students each time). Also we have had 1L intramural flag football and basketball teams. I participated on the football team. We competed against the MBA students' team, graduate engineering students' team, and other various undergrad teams.


*The rec center is pretty nice, the facilities and equipment are new, and it has just about any activity/sport you're in to. Fortunately for the law students, ASU is the largest campus in the country in terms of enrollment so in order to serve the large population of undergrads, ASU has to provide a ton of amenities and resources; all of which we have access to.

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PolarBear
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby PolarBear » Wed Dec 22, 2010 4:57 am

dccoope wrote:Has the school said anything recently to current students about the timeline of moving the law school to the downtown campus? I think that campus makes much more sense and would be so much nicer than Tempe.


Hey there!
I go to Arizona State University as an undergraduate, and the latest I have heard is that ASU is in the planning stages of privatizing the law school by getting off the state funds, and transitioning to a plot of land in downtown Phoenix. I believe they are securing the land in downtown Phoenix currently, and it will be near the UA Cancer center as well as the undergraduate downtown Phoenix campus (consisting of the nursing and journalism schools). Overall, I do believe the shift would be beneficial but it IS a work in progress. Unfortunately, it isn't final by any means; an example is the ASU/UA medical center. ASU had a partnership with UA for the medical facilities in downtown Phoenix but they just recently pulled out of the partnership citing financial concerns. Therefore, I presume until the law school becomes fully privatized (which means costs will increase and the size of your class will also increase) they will not move forward due to lack of funding. A supporting factor of the move is ASUs commitment towards gradually get off the state funding, and the law school is going to be the guinea pig of the move.

In October it was merely an idea tossed around, but in November the mayor of Phoenix made a speech stating that they were taking the talks to the next levels. I believe downtown Phoenix really wants this move. It's part of a shift to make downtown Phoenix more of an active scene, and it is succeeding slowly with an increase of development in the area (see CityScape, the new development from which the mayor made this speech). Obviously, they have a ways to go before implementing this plan, but it does seem as though it will go through and will be beneficial for the law school.

The speech Phil Gordon (the Mayor) made: http://downtownvoices.org/2010/11/13/ma ... ix-speech/

MSUPHL
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby MSUPHL » Wed Dec 22, 2010 3:54 pm

pre-law wrote:
TexasLaw wrote:
* About half of the 190 person 1L class are out-of-state residents. Out-of-state institutions range pretty widely from Yale, Dartmouth, and Stanford to the University of Georgia, University of Washington, and Michigan State to the University of St Thomas and Truman State.


why hello there, do i know you?

And to anyone in this thread, you are not making a good decision about going to law school unless you go to ASU. If I had gotten a 180 I still would have come here. The weather, the people, the food, the sun, the cost of living, the bars, the climate, the distance to SD/LV/LA, the cost of tuition, the size/legal market of phoenix combined with the lack of competition, etc...

nonprofit-prophet
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby nonprofit-prophet » Wed Dec 22, 2010 4:01 pm

MSUPHL wrote:
pre-law wrote:
TexasLaw wrote:
* About half of the 190 person 1L class are out-of-state residents. Out-of-state institutions range pretty widely from Yale, Dartmouth, and Stanford to the University of Georgia, University of Washington, and Michigan State to the University of St Thomas and Truman State.


why hello there, do i know you?

And to anyone in this thread, you are not making a good decision about going to law school unless you go to ASU. If I had gotten a 180 I still would have come here. The weather, the people, the food, the sun, the cost of living, the bars, the climate, the distance to SD/LV/LA, the cost of tuition, the size/legal market of phoenix combined with the lack of competition, etc...


lol

CanadianWolf
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Dec 22, 2010 4:08 pm

Will the law school still be part of ASU after it is privatized ?

Sciencekid
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby Sciencekid » Wed Dec 22, 2010 5:58 pm

this information is great, thanks so much for your answers. I am applying to ASU in the next couple weeks here and hopefully I'll see you there next year!

MSUPHL
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby MSUPHL » Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:07 pm

nonprofit-prophet wrote:
MSUPHL wrote:
pre-law wrote:
TexasLaw wrote:
* About half of the 190 person 1L class are out-of-state residents. Out-of-state institutions range pretty widely from Yale, Dartmouth, and Stanford to the University of Georgia, University of Washington, and Michigan State to the University of St Thomas and Truman State.


why hello there, do i know you?

And to anyone in this thread, you are not making a good decision about going to law school unless you go to ASU. If I had gotten a 180 I still would have come here. The weather, the people, the food, the sun, the cost of living, the bars, the climate, the distance to SD/LV/LA, the cost of tuition, the size/legal market of phoenix combined with the lack of competition, etc...


lol


an overstatement i guess lol. but for me, it is true.

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PolarBear
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby PolarBear » Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:11 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:Will the law school still be part of ASU after it is privatized ?

Yes it will. Basically, ASU is following in the footsteps of the University of Virginia, University of Michigan, etc. in dropping public funding for their law school and taking up a privatized approach.

Everything stays the same for the most part, the professors are still employed by ASU, you have access to all the ASU resources, but there will be an increase (slight) in class size as well as a (slight) increase in tuition. In a nutshell, the ASU Law School would just gradually become self-sufficient funded by donations and tuition through the ASU Foundation.

This could be a very good thing for the law school because education isn't the highest priority in Arizona, and therefore public schools don't receive the best funding. Judging by past precedents (Michigan, Virginia as noted above) the shift has been positive because it allows the schools to accrue more funding for their programs (assuming enough alumni donate to the school, of course!) which means better professors, resources, and more than likely an increase in ranking (whether that matters to you, I do not know).

All in all, I would look at this change as a beneficial shift for the law school, especially if they secure the downtown Phoenix location. The resources there are abundant, the light rail system finished recently, and the location is superb and growing.

Article for further information: http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepubli ... ition.html

pre-law
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby pre-law » Thu Dec 23, 2010 6:59 am

MSUPHL wrote:why hello there, do i know you?




Yes, see you Facebook haha

KamronK
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby KamronK » Fri Dec 24, 2010 8:53 pm

pre-law wrote:
TexasLaw wrote:Here's a few questions..

*Any idea how employment prospects are for current 2L/3L's? Any idea how OCI has gone?
*Are there alot of people from out of state? How do u like Phoenix?
*How social is your class? Lots of participation in bar review/intermurals/other events?
*Hows the gym there?



* I've asked this same question to current 2Ls and 3Ls and this is what they've told me but don't take it as gospel since they're not the Career Services Office and they represent a small sample. That said, if you're in the top 10% of the class you should be able to land a job with one of the big law firms in Phoenix. If you're between 10-50%, you shouldn't have trouble finding a paying law job during the summer or after graduation. The bottom half of the class, you really have to network since your grades aren't stellar and there are less legal job opportunities give the current state of the market.

In terms of judicial clerkships, the Arizona Court of Appeals and Arizona Supreme Court seem to love taking ASU grads as law clerks. Combined they take about 12-14 ASU grads as law clerks per year. Of the 5 Justices on the Arizona Supreme Court, 2 of them are ASU law grads (one is Chief Justice), and another teaches Civil Procedure at the law school. ASU sends about 3-4 graduates per year to clerk for federal judges (U.S. District Court, Bankruptcy Court, U.S. Court of Appeals for the 9th Circuit).


* About half of the 190 person 1L class are out-of-state residents. Out-of-state institutions range pretty widely from Yale, Dartmouth, and Stanford to the University of Georgia, University of Washington, and Michigan State to the University of St Thomas and Truman State.

Phoenix is great so far. The cost of living is very low compared to other places with warm weather ie California. Also, the roads, highways, landscaping in the area look brand new compared to other areas I've lived (Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle). There's a few obvious downers about Phoenix. First, it is really hot during the summer time (Between 100 and 115 everyday). Once you survive the summers though you're in good shape. I just left Arizona to go home for break and it was 65 degrees and sunny; not many places are like that in late December. Second, it takes some time getting used to not seeing as many trees and lakes and other natural water sources if you've lived in areas like Seattle and San Francisco like I have. Phoenix's terrain and landscape is more along the lines of mountains, palm trees, and if you venture beyond the surrounding cities, desert.


* My class is pretty social. We have a weekly bar review that draws about 50-70 students per outing; though this number obviously decreases as Finals approach. Students in my class have regularly thrown parties at their house and invited all of the 1Ls. These have been well-attended as well (around 70 students each time). Also we have had 1L intramural flag football and basketball teams. I participated on the football team. We competed against the MBA students' team, graduate engineering students' team, and other various undergrad teams.


*The rec center is pretty nice, the facilities and equipment are new, and it has just about any activity/sport you're in to. Fortunately for the law students, ASU is the largest campus in the country in terms of enrollment so in order to serve the large population of undergrads, ASU has to provide a ton of amenities and resources; all of which we have access to.


I find this funny because I work at the Student Recreation Complex. Haha...I'm not a law student yet, but can answer any questions about ASU.

JonSanchez2009
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby JonSanchez2009 » Tue Feb 08, 2011 8:16 pm

Anyone looking for roommates? I'm relocating from Alaska. I figured finding someone from here is just as sketch as randos from Craigs list. I don't really want to have to furnish an entire apartment on my own.

I'm 24. Male. I'm really boring. I like to do a lot of outdoors stuff, but might have to re-adjust cause you can't exactly go cross country skiing or backpacking in Arizona. I'm clean/tidy (that's a lie, but everyone says that when looking for roommates).

athenian
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby athenian » Tue Mar 01, 2011 5:17 pm

Thanks for taking questions. I'm curious as to how mobile an ASU diploma is. Specifically, do I stand a realistic chance of working in California post graduation?

paragliderwoods
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby paragliderwoods » Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:10 pm

Where do most law students live who are not living/relocating with a family? Tempe/Scottsdale/Chandler?? Any specific apartment complexes?

Thanks!

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NiccoloA
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby NiccoloA » Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:20 pm

pre-law wrote:Stats were 3.6 and 161 LSAT.

Other than ASU, I was considering Loyola (Los Angeles) and the University of San Diego. I wanted to go somewhere warm for law school since I knew I eventually wanted to settle and start my career in a place that had nice weather.

I chose ASU over Loyola and USD for a few reasons. First, ASU offered the best financial package among the three. ASU offered a guaranteed half-ride scholarship for my first year and an opportunity to earn in-state residency for my second and third years which would be the same financially as if I had the half-ride scholarship all 3 years. Loyola and USD offered half-ride scholarships as well but they were to be awarded on a yearly basis if I achieved a top 30% ranking in my class. I didn't doubt my ability to get in the top 30% of the class at those schools but it was risky gamble because the tuition is very high (higher than even ASU's out of state tuition).

Another reason I chose ASU is because it is on a large campus and as a student there you have access to all of the amenities and resources afforded to all students. Loyola , by contrast, is just the law school. For example, at ASU I have access to the student rec center right there on campus whereas if I went to Loyola I would have to find a rec center somewhere else away from campus. That is just one example, but overall I thought the quality of life would be much higher at ASU than the other schools which was important since law school can be stressful.

Third, the Phoenix market is A LOT less saturated than the Los Angeles and San Diego markets. Phoenix is the 5th largest city in the country and other than Phoenix Law (4th tier), ASU is the only law school in the Phoenix metropolitan area. By contrast, if you go to Loyola or USD and work in Los Angeles or San Diego, you'll probably find yourself competing with Stanford, Berkeley, UCLA, USC, UC Davis, UC Hastings grads on a consistent basis along with other similarly ranked schools such as Pepperdine. Not to mention that Los Angeles and San Diego are highly desirable places to work so Loyola and USD grads are also faced with competition from Ivy League law school grads coming to the West Coast. If a Stanford or Ivy League law school grad is coming to Phoenix its probably because they have some tie to the area such as they grew up there or went to college there or something. I felt this was something I had to consider when choosing a law school given the current state of the legal job market.


I feel the same way. For me, weather and location is really high in my considerations. Top 3 aspects I'm looking for. If I got 180 on my LSAT, I wouldn't be caught dead living north of Virginia - and even Virginia.

I've lived in cold weather my entire life and I'm simply not willing to live in it for 3 more years after undergraduates.

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azbio
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby azbio » Thu Mar 10, 2011 5:10 pm

Anyone looking for roommates? I'm relocating from Alaska. I figured finding someone from here is just as sketch as randos from Craigs list. I don't really want to have to furnish an entire apartment on my own.

I'm 24. Male. I'm really boring. I like to do a lot of outdoors stuff, but might have to re-adjust cause you can't exactly go cross country skiing or backpacking in Arizona. I'm clean/tidy (that's a lie, but everyone says that when looking for roommates).


I'm not looking for a roommate, but just to let you know- there is some great backpacking to be done in Arizona. I've only gone cross-country skiing here once, so I couldn't tell you much about that. The superstition mountains are desert mountains, but they have their own unique beauty and are very close to the Valley. I've backpacked through there many times and had a lot of fun.

For more trails around AZ, I recommend this site: http://www.toddshikingguide.com/Hikes/Hikes.htm

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sully
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby sully » Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:45 pm

Can any current ASU law students comment on the law facilities (i.e. library and classrooms)?

pre-law
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby pre-law » Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:35 am

athenian wrote:Thanks for taking questions. I'm curious as to how mobile an ASU diploma is. Specifically, do I stand a realistic chance of working in California post graduation?


ASU's mobility is probably limited to the Southwest (AZ, CO, NV, UT, NM) for recent graduates. CA is possible depending on where in CA you want to work and depending on your grades. Working in a mid-size level firm or higher in LA, SF, or SD right after graduation would be tough without any geographical and professional connections to the area.

I'm from CA and I would like to return eventually but I'm more than comfortable beginning my career in Phoenix after I graduate.
Last edited by pre-law on Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

pre-law
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby pre-law » Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:38 am

sully wrote:Can any current ASU law students comment on the law facilities (i.e. library and classrooms)?


The law facilities are probably ASU's weakest attribute. The dean of admissions, Shelli Soto, has also admitted this.

The classrooms and main facility are outdated and it almost seems as if you are walking around in the 1970s inside the building. I know the Dean of the law school is planning on eventually moving the school to Phoenix; though a date hasn't been set and it probably wouldn't be for another few years.

The law school's library, on the other hand, is a beautiful facility and has won awards.
http://www.law.asu.edu/library/RossBlak ... lding.aspx
Last edited by pre-law on Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Arizona State 1L Taking Questions

Postby Lawquacious » Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:43 am

Wow: half-ride with a 161/3.6? Is that for first year only and zero after that? I was offered 20k for first year (which I think is close to half), 15k for second year, and none for third year with a 166/3.5. I imagine your scholly is also phased-out in a similar way (though maybe to zero after first year); they seem to phase most of their schollys across the three years.

Did you consider U of AZ? If so how did you end up coming to the ASU choice? if not, why not?

What is 1L job placement like? I'm sure most ppl are taking volunteer positions, but are ppl struggling to get even volunteer positions? What is your apprx. class rank, and do you personally have something lined up? Thx.




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