Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

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citrus2010
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Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby citrus2010 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:09 am

Drake offers low cost of living, plus I grew up in Iowa. I love the midwest.

Hamline still qualifies as midwest, but the Twin Cities offer a lot larger legal market than Des Moines.

Willamette is closer to home (Utah). West coast is more expensive, but still offers a decent legal market.

South Texas has a great reputation in Houston, which is an extremely large market. Cost of living is good, but it's not the safest place in the world for a family (I have two children).

All these schools are regional and I'm happy to live and practice in any of the three markets. So, which school, IF YOU HAD TO CHOOSE, would you attend? Assume equal tuition.

I know there are other options out there and the option of retaking the LSAT, but please choose one of the four and defend your reasoning. THANK YOU!

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baboon309
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby baboon309 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:19 am

citrus2010 wrote:Drake offers low cost of living, plus I grew up in Iowa. I love the midwest.

Hamline still qualifies as midwest, but the Twin Cities offer a lot larger legal market than Des Moines.

Willamette is closer to home (Utah). West coast is more expensive, but still offers a decent legal market.

South Texas has a great reputation in Houston, which is an extremely large market. Cost of living is good, but it's not the safest place in the world for a family (I have two children).

All these schools are regional and I'm happy to live and practice in any of the three markets. So, which school, IF YOU HAD TO CHOOSE, would you attend? Assume equal tuition.

I know there are other options out there and the option of retaking the LSAT, but please choose one of the four and defend your reasoning. THANK YOU!


Drake

citrus2010
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby citrus2010 » Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:20 am

Why?

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catharsis
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby catharsis » Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:27 am

EASILY South Texas- it's the only school you listed that places extremely well given its place amongst law schools in the nation. for what it's worth, Houston is a relatively safe city. South Texas is the oldest law school among the three in Houston and is very well respected (in Houston).

db004
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby db004 » Mon Feb 22, 2010 6:44 pm

Drake because it places extremely well in Iowa. It also has an amazing legal clinic and a great library. I believe the best way to evaluate a school is based off of their legal clinic's because this shows they actually put into work what they are teaching. Drake will find a place for every student in their legal clinic at some point in time in their education, a guarantee that I have yet to hear from another school.Everyone outside of Iowa will mock Des Moines but for those of us who have/do live her know that it is a great place to live. Oh and the 20 million dollar face lift on law school will pair beautifully with their excellent library and legal clinic.

max6868
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby max6868 » Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:07 pm

Hi, I really don't know anything at all about Drake, Hamline or Willamette, but I applied and was accepted to South Texas as well. I wanted to speak to your comment about Houston not being a city suitable for children. I grew up in Houston and lived there my whole life and I'm surprised to hear you say you think the whole city is dangerous! Yeah third ward is dangerous...but you won't be living there.
I lived in Bellaire and felt as safe as could be. South Texas is highly regarded in Houston and Houston is a great city for kids. I loved growing up there. I'm going to Pepperdine or Santa Clara in California now, but Texas would be a great place to study and practice law.

Sure areas of Houston are dangerous, but what big city doesn't have it patches of bad neighborhoods. Don't assume the whole city is a danger just because of what you hear of a few select areas of it. Plus Houston is SO damn big you could easily avoid it. They've got so many great family neighborhoods...go check it out..

Good luck with your decision!

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Aberzombie1892
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:10 pm

citrus2010 wrote:Drake offers low cost of living, plus I grew up in Iowa. I love the midwest.

Hamline still qualifies as midwest, but the Twin Cities offer a lot larger legal market than Des Moines.

Willamette is closer to home (Utah). West coast is more expensive, but still offers a decent legal market.

South Texas has a great reputation in Houston, which is an extremely large market. Cost of living is good, but it's not the safest place in the world for a family (I have two children).

All these schools are regional and I'm happy to live and practice in any of the three markets. So, which school, IF YOU HAD TO CHOOSE, would you attend? Assume equal tuition.

I know there are other options out there and the option of retaking the LSAT, but please choose one of the four and defend your reasoning. THANK YOU!


Williamette hit me with a fee waiver and I applied. They offered $15,000 but bumped it to a full ride when I said I was considering them.


On to your question. If all of them were equal, they are all somewhat interchangeable. They are all in the shadow of better schools. Go with geographical preferences.

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NU_Jet55
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby NU_Jet55 » Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:16 pm

Retake.

OP I know this is not what you want to hear, but I cannot in good conscience give you any other advice.

How has this not been said until the 8th post? What is happening to you TLS?

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rdcws000
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby rdcws000 » Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:53 pm

NU_Jet55 wrote:Retake.

OP I know this is not what you want to hear, but I cannot in good conscience give you any other advice.

How has this not been said until the 8th post? What is happening to you TLS?


Retake was not one of his/her options. He/she has clearly considered options and determined any of the 4 schools would be suitable to his/her goals. They even went as far as to ask that "retake" not be suggested.

The only feedback I would offer is that you should consider your family above all in the decision, since the 4 schools offer similar future prospects. Go where your spouse and kids wil be happy, it will make it alot easier on you.

That being said, I'm going to STCL, and Houston is a great city. I also have 2 kids and will be going PT. If I had to pick one for you, you would come to Houston.

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NU_Jet55
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby NU_Jet55 » Thu Jun 03, 2010 3:35 pm

rdcws000 wrote:Retake was not one of his/her options. He/she has clearly considered options and determined any of the 4 schools would be suitable to his/her goals. They even went as far as to ask that "retake" not be suggested.

Obviously I saw that...
NU_Jet55 wrote:OP I know this is not what you want to hear

But ITE, unless he has a full ride and a guaranteed job 3 yrs from now,
NU_Jet55 wrote:I cannot in good conscience give you any other advice

Podunk21
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby Podunk21 » Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:13 pm

Well, I dont really know much about three of those schools, but I can tell you that I just finished my 2L year at South Texas. I was worried (before I started school) that I would hate it here, but as it turns out, I am VERY happy with my decision to attend STCL. If all things were equal I would pick STCL again (if I had too). However, all things are not equal and I would probably go with the cheaper tuition (as you really do want to minimize your total debt).

On the other hand, if by going to Drak, etc. you dont pay as much as South Texas, but the cost of living is much higher, then I guess it doesnt matter (as it comes out in the wash).

As for Houston. Well, your right....its not safe. Most of the city is a dump and there is no Zoning. Due to the fact that you have children you may not want to live downtown (or close) to where the school is. If you were single, that would be different, but since your not, you may want to live further out. Depending on where you plan on living will determine how long it takes you to commute to school (assuming you decide to live somewhere further out).

I am married and have a little-one and live about 15-20 minutes from the law school. Living this far away (even though its not really that far) does have some disadvantages such as during rush hour, the traffic can be some of the worst....but as a law student, I am NEVER driving in rush hour (thank god). But, assuming we dont move after I graduate, I will have to start dealing with the rush hour traffic!!

Most of the people who tell you Houston is not a dump or that it is "safe," are crazy!! I mean, Houston is not Detroit and the Downtown has come a long way from where it use to be, but compared to every other major city in Texas, I would say Houston is the worst (save maybe San Antonio....but I still think I would take SA).

There are not "some bad places" or "some rough patches".....its the other way around - There are some "good places" that are hidden away inside the dump/sewer that is Houston.

Typically, the people that say "Houston is NOT a dump" and that they grew up in Houston and "loved it," are people that didnt "technically" live in Houston. They wont tell you this, but if you press them, you will get the answer. For example, a lot of people who live in Bellaire, TX say "I grew up in Houston and its a Great Place!!" Well, Bellaire is its own city that is within the city limits of Houston.

Just read the first paragraph here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellaire,_Texas

Bellaire is very nice and I like that area a lot. However, it is ONE SPOT that exists within the city of Houston. Basically, you had some moderately wealthy people who wanted to put some tight restrictions on their community, school district, etc. and create better zoning laws, etc. So, they incorporated the city of Bellaire and it is a very nice place. However, the kids who grew up in Bellaire and now are in Law School in Houston, dont really understand that what they know to be Houston....is not really Houston. I mean, unless you plan on moving here and buying a house in Bellaire....then its a moot point.

The other people that say these things usually live in League City, Friendswood, The Woodlands, Sugarland, Pearland, etc. All of these places are near Houston but are not Houston. They are all at least a 20 min drive w/o traffic from downtown (if not more).

Anyway, as for the school....there is no reason to be extremely fearful of the city. And the school itself (I think) is a great one. I feel like I am being prepared and I am happy to know that Houston is a very large market with lots of jobs available. Also, within the city of Houston, South Texas gets plenty of respect despite the fact that it shares the city with two other law schools (one of which I believe is ranked - Univ. of Houston). I would say that South Texas is one of the most popular "smaller law schools" in the state, or at least in Houston.

If you are in Texas and your not going to go to a ranked school.....South Texas is the place to be. (In terms of reputation).

At least...thats how I see it.

Hope this helps.

littlebit
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby littlebit » Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:27 pm

I grew up in inner city Houston - off of Wayside drive. I LOVE the city, never had any problems with crime or felt unsafe. As with any city, you just have to have good situational awareness. The schools (for your kids) were not the best and IMO that is why most people move out of the city.

max6868
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby max6868 » Fri Jun 04, 2010 7:05 pm

Ok, I said I grew up in Bellaire because no one would know what I meant if I said Meyerland or Marilyn Estates, which is like 7 minutes away from Bellaire. I lived 10 minutes from Westbury High School...not a good high school, but I still felt COMPLETELY safe. I went to high school in Bellaire, I went to middle school in Montrose, I worked in the Galleria Area, the Southwest area, I've worked pretty much all over. So, please do not tell me I didn't live in Houston. I've been all over Houston and I still maintain that is a great city.

My whole family lives in Houston, pretty much everyone I know lives in Houston. It's a great place to raise a family! But to each their own I guess...don't discount South Texas because of what a few people say about Houston though.

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worldtraveler
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Re: Drake, Hamline, Willamette, or South Texas?

Postby worldtraveler » Sat Jun 05, 2010 6:53 am

db004 wrote:Drake because it places extremely well in Iowa. It also has an amazing legal clinic and a great library. I believe the best way to evaluate a school is based off of their legal clinic's because this shows they actually put into work what they are teaching. Drake will find a place for every student in their legal clinic at some point in time in their education, a guarantee that I have yet to hear from another school.Everyone outside of Iowa will mock Des Moines but for those of us who have/do live her know that it is a great place to live. Oh and the 20 million dollar face lift on law school will pair beautifully with their excellent library and legal clinic.


No, it doesn't place extremely well in Iowa. I'm from there, and have a lot of friends who went to Drake. None of the graduated of Drake law that I know ( and this is about 15-20) have jobs. None. Some were near the top of their class and now working in daycares.

Clinics have absolutely nothing to do with getting you a job. It just means you get some practical experience, which you can get in internships anyway. The facelift just shows that they're charging you a lot of tuition money to have a pretty building.

Iowa just doesn't have a big legal market. If you want to practice in Iowa, you should go to U of Iowa. As a resident, it's actually not that hard to get in either. I don't normally bash lower ranked schools, but I think going to Drake is a bad call. There just aren't enough jobs in the area for the graduates, especially considering the level of debt a graduate has.




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