After Grades - What did we learn?

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mallard
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby mallard » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:06 am

prezidentv8 wrote:Tight word limits on two finals FTL.


This just means you need to be a little bit more terse and focus on the important areas of the problem (something I'm not sure I did consistently; we'll see). The first step should be limiting the time you spend in issue, rule, and conclusion; only at the end should you limit your analysis.

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prezidentv8
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby prezidentv8 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:15 am

mallard wrote:
prezidentv8 wrote:Tight word limits on two finals FTL.


This just means you need to be a little bit more terse and focus on the important areas of the problem (something I'm not sure I did consistently; we'll see). The first step should be limiting the time you spend in issue, rule, and conclusion; only at the end should you limit your analysis.


I re-read one of my answers and it seems like I hit all the main points that I should have. It's just hard to tell how good your answer is when you've got only 2500 words and about a billion issues. There were definitely some strategic omissions made on my part, which is both reassuring (I knew enough to know that there were so many issues I had to omit some!) and concerning (What if I omitted the wrong stuff!? What if I didn't go into detail on the right stuff?!) - and oddly, gets back to my whole point about my "best best guess" from another thread.

Let me ask you something though - how do you actually know how to take these tests?!

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mallard
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby mallard » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:22 am

I mean, I'll stfu if I get my grades back and they're bad. I'm just aggregating what I've learned from people who have done very well and what my instincts are from doing a lot of PTs.

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prezidentv8
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby prezidentv8 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:24 am

Ah makes sense. I tried to do similar stuff to what you mentioned, but it only applied to my contracts exam. My other two had really tight word limits, so I tended to try and maximize analytical density. Not sure how good I was at that since I tend to be wordy.

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mallard
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby mallard » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:30 am

prezidentv8 wrote:Ah makes sense. I tried to do similar stuff to what you mentioned, but it only applied to my contracts exam. My other two had really tight word limits, so I tended to try and maximize analytical density. Not sure how good I was at that since I tend to be wordy.


That's the ideal. Usually what I hear is that with an extremely word-limited exam (like one of mine last semester where I think there were as many words in the hypo as we were allowed in the answer), you can hit all of the minor issues, or you can do a really good job on the major ones, and either of those will be a pretty solid exam. But like most things I'm sure this varies by professor.

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prezidentv8
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby prezidentv8 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 4:34 am

mallard wrote:
prezidentv8 wrote:Ah makes sense. I tried to do similar stuff to what you mentioned, but it only applied to my contracts exam. My other two had really tight word limits, so I tended to try and maximize analytical density. Not sure how good I was at that since I tend to be wordy.


That's the ideal. Usually what I hear is that with an extremely word-limited exam (like one of mine last semester where I think there were as many words in the hypo as we were allowed in the answer), you can hit all of the minor issues, or you can do a really good job on the major ones, and either of those will be a pretty solid exam. But like most things I'm sure this varies by professor.


I suppose I shall find out in a week or two.

BobSacamano
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby BobSacamano » Tue Jan 19, 2010 8:17 am

Sucks that if I had last year's Contracts exam from my professor, I would have rocked the essay. I totally nailed just about every major issue discussed in the sample response and most of the minor ones, too. Then I get to my exam and I spend five minutes in the middle of the test staring at the page blankly. There's almost something cruel about completely changing the structure of the essays after giving two basically identical practice exams during the semester. Save me, multiple choice!

Also, starting to wonder if I should do LEEWS this semester. On one hand, I was fine without it last semester (other than contracts). Also, I'm sort of poor. On the other hand, I'm kind of terrified that my exam performance in the fall was sort of a fluke and mostly the product of me knowing beforehand that exam oriented >>> class oriented.

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samiseaborn
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby samiseaborn » Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:36 am

prezidentv8 wrote:
Tight word limits on two finals FTL.


I thought that going into exams, but then the A I got was on a 3000 limit exam. I'm not usually a wordy person, but because it was a free-for all on the other exams, I just kept typing away. I'm interested to see if that's the complaint from the profs on my other exams now.

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superserial
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby superserial » Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:01 pm

keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.

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apper123
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby apper123 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:05 pm

superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


im not sure if you are joking or not (i think you're being serious), but this is what i did and will continue to do

although i do outline some classes where i think it makes sense (crim)

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Big Shrimpin
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby Big Shrimpin » Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:05 pm

superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


8) +1

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Kohinoor
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby Kohinoor » Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:17 pm

superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.

My strat was:
Read for class
Read for understanding
Do E&E
Read for outline
Make outline

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superserial
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby superserial » Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:18 pm

apper123 wrote:
superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


im not sure if you are joking or not (i think you're being serious), but this is what i did and will continue to do

although i do outline some classes where i think it makes sense (crim)


I'm actually serious. I used my class notes, supplements and other people's outlines instead of my own.

UVA1L
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby UVA1L » Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:18 pm

superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


My strategy was pretty much the exact opposite of this and I'm well above median so far (I have most of my grades back, but not all of them).

I focused on class notes, the casebook readings (not spending too much time on the useless facts of course), and only occasionally turned to supplements.

I almost exclusively used practice exams for hypo practice. I tried using E&Es a bit but found them redundant at best and misleading at worst.

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macattaq
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby macattaq » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:19 pm

UVA1L wrote:
superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


My strategy was pretty much the exact opposite of this and I'm well above median so far (I have most of my grades back, but not all of them).

I focused on class notes, the casebook readings (not spending too much time on the useless facts of course), and only occasionally turned to supplements.

I almost exclusively used practice exams for hypo practice. I tried using E&Es a bit but found them redundant at best and misleading at worst.


Are you going to keep the same name when you are a 2L?

UVA1L
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby UVA1L » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:21 pm

macattaq wrote:
UVA1L wrote:
superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


My strategy was pretty much the exact opposite of this and I'm well above median so far (I have most of my grades back, but not all of them).

I focused on class notes, the casebook readings (not spending too much time on the useless facts of course), and only occasionally turned to supplements.

I almost exclusively used practice exams for hypo practice. I tried using E&Es a bit but found them redundant at best and misleading at worst.


Are you going to keep the same name when you are a 2L?


I won't be around then.

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Cavalier
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby Cavalier » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:23 pm

UVA1L wrote:
superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


My strategy was pretty much the exact opposite of this and I'm well above median so far (I have most of my grades back, but not all of them).

I focused on class notes, the casebook readings (not spending too much time on the useless facts of course), and only occasionally turned to supplements.

I almost exclusively used practice exams for hypo practice. I tried using E&Es a bit but found them redundant at best and misleading at worst.

Oooooh... another UVA poster on TLS. Well since you have most of your grades you are probably not in my section.

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apper123
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby apper123 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:29 pm

Cavalier wrote:
UVA1L wrote:
superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


My strategy was pretty much the exact opposite of this and I'm well above median so far (I have most of my grades back, but not all of them).

I focused on class notes, the casebook readings (not spending too much time on the useless facts of course), and only occasionally turned to supplements.

I almost exclusively used practice exams for hypo practice. I tried using E&Es a bit but found them redundant at best and misleading at worst.

Oooooh... another UVA poster on TLS. Well since you have most of your grades you are probably not in my section.


Or maybe they just withheld all your grades because they were too hot to handle.

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vanwinkle
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby vanwinkle » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:31 pm

superserial wrote:
apper123 wrote:
superserial wrote:keep not preparing for class (learn the BLL that isn't being taught in class), keep using the supplements, don't outline.


im not sure if you are joking or not (i think you're being serious), but this is what i did and will continue to do

although i do outline some classes where i think it makes sense (crim)


I'm actually serious. I used my class notes, supplements and other people's outlines instead of my own.

In my experience it's the process of making an outline that's the most useful. As you try to synthesize and condense the law you've studied into a compact and accurate form, you learn more and more about it. I didn't use my outlines very much on finals, but that's because I'd learned so much from actually writing them that I didn't need to touch them most of the time.

shanejamin
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby shanejamin » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:32 pm

tag

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Cavalier
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby Cavalier » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:37 pm

In my experience it's the process of making an outline that's the most useful. As you try to synthesize and condense the law you've studied into a compact and accurate form, you learn more and more about it. I didn't use my outlines very much on finals, but that's because I'd learned so much from actually writing them that I didn't need to touch them most of the time.

I agree with this. I think the outline itself, as a tool to use during exams, has little value. Time spent flipping through the outline is time that you could be using to write your answer and earn points. However, the process of turning an entire semester's worth of lecture and notes into a 20-30 page document that has just about everything that could possibly be necessary on an exam is valuable.

People learn in different ways though. I'm sure there are people who can read through another person's outline several times and have an understanding of the course equal to someone who spends hours creating an outline.

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superserial
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby superserial » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:52 pm

Cavalier wrote:
In my experience it's the process of making an outline that's the most useful. As you try to synthesize and condense the law you've studied into a compact and accurate form, you learn more and more about it. I didn't use my outlines very much on finals, but that's because I'd learned so much from actually writing them that I didn't need to touch them most of the time.

I agree with this. I think the outline itself, as a tool to use during exams, has little value. Time spent flipping through the outline is time that you could be using to write your answer and earn points. However, the process of turning an entire semester's worth of lecture and notes into a 20-30 page document that has just about everything that could possibly be necessary on an exam is valuable.

People learn in different ways though. I'm sure there are people who can read through another person's outline several times and have an understanding of the course equal to someone who spends hours creating an outline.


I have a pretty good memory, so I didn't think there was a ton I could gain from making an outline. I also started kind of late, so I decided it wouldn't be the most effective way of studying at that point. I might outline this semester and see if it makes a difference in my understanding of the law.

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apper123
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby apper123 » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:58 pm

wee class rank is up

first semester is now complete

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Cavalier
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby Cavalier » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:58 pm

I have a pretty good memory, so I didn't think there was a ton I could gain from making an outline. I also started kind of late, so I decided it wouldn't be the most effective way of studying at that point. I might outline this semester and see if it makes a difference in my understanding of the law.

Well, if you start late than outlining is probably not the way to go. Many people I know were still working on their outlines during finals period. IMO, if it's during finals period and you don't have an outline, you are much better off using another person's outline and doing practice tests in the little time you have left than working on finishing an outline.

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Cavalier
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Re: After Grades - What did we learn?

Postby Cavalier » Tue Jan 19, 2010 5:59 pm

apper123 wrote:wee class rank is up

first semester is now complete

After all your posts about grades I was expecting you to post your rank. It must not have been a single digit or else you would have posted it, I'm guessing.




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