transfer from Indiana? Forum

[Should I Transfer??]

First semester grades are 3.86 at Indiana. Chances at University of Chicago Early Decision?

What do people think about giving up near full ride at Indiana for Chicago? What about transferring to Northwestern? I want to end up at any larger city in Midwest. Thoughts?

[Transferthrowaway]

First semester grades are 3.86 at Indiana. Chances at University of Chicago Early Decision?

What do people think about giving up near full ride at Indiana for Chicago? What about transferring to Northwestern? I want to end up any larger city in Midwest. Thoughts?

Current 2L transfer at UChicago.

1) I don't know your shots, but the vast majority of my transfer class consisted of ED applicants.
2) If you want to work in Chicago, I would take UChicago at sticker for two years over IU-B.
3) I don't think Northwestern is worth it, but that's just me.

[lawschoolgrapedme]

First semester grades are 3.86 at Indiana. Chances at University of Chicago Early Decision?

What do people think about giving up near full ride at Indiana for Chicago? What about transferring to Northwestern? I want to end up at any larger city in Midwest. Thoughts?

I transferred out of iub. I think you have a good shot at Chicago, though I'm not sure about Ed since I applied rd.

In regards to giving up the full ride: DO IT. Would you like to graduate debt free and jobless or in debt but making 160k? Job prospects at the t5 are vastly different than that at iu, and in my case I found employers to be very receptive to me at the ccn I transferred to. V5 summer. I have law review friends at iu who still don't have anything lined up.

[crazyblink653]

First semester grades are 3.86 at Indiana. Chances at University of Chicago Early Decision?

What do people think about giving up near full ride at Indiana for Chicago? What about transferring to Northwestern? I want to end up at any larger city in Midwest. Thoughts?

I transferred out of iub. I think you have a good shot at Chicago, though I'm not sure about Ed since I applied rd.

In regards to giving up the full ride: DO IT. Would you like to graduate debt free and jobless or in debt but making 160k? Job prospects at the t5 are vastly different than that at iu, and in my case I found employers to be very receptive to me at the ccn I transferred to. V5 summer. I have law review friends at iu who still don't have anything lined up.

it's not quite as simple as this. i transferred from IUB and am happy with the decision (though i still miss bloomington and the friends i still have there), but i wasn't motivated only by job prospects. if you're mainly trying to get big law, it's still possible out of IUB. i know people with V10 employment there. the only difference is that you have to hustle a lot more to land those jobs (like mass mailing every firm on july 1 and following up continuously) while from a school like chicago you'll (probably) be pretty safe relying only on their OCI (though i wouldn't recommend doing that). frankly, i would try to make an honest assessment about your interviewing skills. the importance of interviewing is incredibly underrated. if you think you're a below-average interviewer, it might be safer to transfer because you'll have more opportunities to overcome it, whereas at IUB the minuscule OCI won't leave you with much margin for error.

the other thing to consider is if you want a clerkship/academia. if that's your focus than transferring may be a good move.

i would try EDing to Chicago if that's where you really want to go, but you're also probably a virtual lock for northwestern with those grades. plus, IUB seems to send a lot of transfers to Northwestern (or at least they did this past year. i know of at least 4), so that may be something to keep in mind.

[CanadianWolf]

Northwestern & Chicago are in a different universe than IUB with respect to job placement. Transfer unless you are targeting Indianapolis or rural Indiana.

[RMstratosphere]

Crazyblink's post is TCR. I opted not to transfer from IUB with the same grades you have now. I'm happy to provide my perspective through PM if you'd like.

[Should I Transfer??]

Thank you everyone for the responses and PM's. I had a follow-up question regarding chances at HYS. I now know that transfer admissions are much harder to predict than regular admissions. People's thoughts on chances at one of these schools if my GPA second semester is similar or dips slightly?

Also, people's thoughts on applying Chicago ED, considering that an acceptance would eliminate any chance at HYS? I know that this is a more common question in this forum, and I have read through many of the discussions. However, any further comments would be most appreciated.

[20130312]

What class rank does a 3.86 put you at?

[Should I Transfer??]

No class rank is given until after second semester. Historically, at least top 2%.

[CanadianWolf]

Do you really think that you stand a chance at Yale ? I don't know the answer, but I think that the odds are so small that it should not deter you from applying ED to Chicago. However, your chances for Harvard are significant if you maintain a class rank well within the top 5%. Regardless, Chicago, if accepted, should be able to get you where you want to go in the legal world. Plus, class rank can change substantially from one semester to the next during the first year so you probably need to make a decision now as to whether or not you want Chicago, & the HYS concerns may be irrelevant if your class rank falls.

[Should I Transfer??]

I'd like to think I stand a small chance at Yale. My question would have been better phrased as, "What are the chances at one of HYS?" Regardless, thank you for your response!

[kings84_wr]

For what its worth: the class of 2011 #1 student got accepted to HLS but not SLS or YLS (If i recall correctly). In 2012 the #1 got into NYU but not HYSCC. Now the 2011 student had a higher GPA, so that may factor in the decision as well. Sounds like RMstratosphere was #1 in 2013, so he probably has more data as far as HYS.

[kings84_wr]

Northwestern & Chicago are in a different universe than IUB with respect to job placement. Transfer unless you are targeting Indianapolis or rural Indiana.

This is definitely true when considering an 0L who has no grades and better options. In that case the chances of finishing at the top of the class is very low. But the #1 student (or very very close to #1) will absolutely have much better job options then Indianapolis and rural indiana. The OP needs to weigh his career prospects and debt options.

[NotoriousIIED]

Congrats on stellar grades, that is quite an accomplishment. DID YOU ALSO GET THE COVETED HIGH PASS IN LRW?

Anyway, here is the story. I think it makes sense to go ED at UChicago in your situation. You cannot be certain that you will keep this torrid pace alive next semester and this gives you some decent insurance. I also don't think that HYS is a lock for anyone even if you are #1 which you may not be with those grades.

If you don't get in, you should be a lock at Northwestern as long as you stay in the top 10% or so.

Whether it is worth it or not is another question altogether. Depends on your goals. In a perverse way, if all you want in life is Chicago Biglaw, you might be just fine in staying at IU because, if you stay #1 and perhaps become Editor in Chief of the ILJ, someone like Tinder or Hamilton will almost assuredly offer you a clerkship which would likely lead to a big firm job in Chicago right out of the gate. Law Review is no guarantee at any transfer school and is even tougher at UChicago and HLS than anywhere else. Plus even though Chicago Biglaw doesnt visit IU for OCI (with the exception of Jones Day which isn't a Chicago "native"), IU kids will still be at Kirkland, Mayer Brown and Sidley this summer, I am sure. Jenner and Winston, I am not positive about.

PM me if you want more detailed thoughts.

[Transferthrowaway]

Congrats on stellar grades, that is quite an accomplishment. DID YOU ALSO GET THE COVETED HIGH PASS IN LRW?

Anyway, here is the story. I think it makes sense to go ED at UChicago in your situation. You cannot be certain that you will keep this torrid pace alive next semester and this gives you some decent insurance. I also don't think that HYS is a lock for anyone even if you are #1 which you may not be with those grades.

If you don't get in, you should be a lock at Northwestern as long as you stay in the top 10% or so.

Whether it is worth it or not is another question altogether. Depends on your goals. In a perverse way, if all you want in life is Chicago Biglaw, you might be just fine in staying at IU because, if you stay #1 and perhaps become Editor in Chief of the ILJ, someone like Tinder or Hamilton will almost assuredly offer you a clerkship which would likely lead to a big firm job in Chicago right out of the gate. Law Review is no guarantee at any transfer school and is even tougher at UChicago and HLS than anywhere else. Plus even though Chicago Biglaw doesnt visit IU for OCI (with the exception of Jones Day which isn't a Chicago "native"), IU kids will still be at Kirkland, Mayer Brown and Sidley this summer, I am sure. Jenner and Winston, I am not positive about.

PM me if you want more detailed thoughts.

To put this into perspective, there is exactly one student from IU-B going to one of the two Chicago firms this summer that account for ~50% of Chicago biglaw SA spots ITE.

[NotoriousIIED]

Yikes, was not aware of that

[Should I Transfer??]

Thanks again to people replying, most appreciated.

Notorious: no high pass for me

[lawschoolgrapedme]

Northwestern & Chicago are in a different universe than IUB with respect to job placement. Transfer unless you are targeting Indianapolis or rural Indiana.

This is definitely true when considering an 0L who has no grades and better options. In that case the chances of finishing at the top of the class is very low. But the #1 student (or very very close to #1) will absolutely have much better job options then Indianapolis and rural indiana. The OP needs to weigh his career prospects and debt options.

I didn't think IU-B had any HYS transfers in the class of 2013?

Edit: quoted the wrong person.

[kings84_wr]

Northwestern & Chicago are in a different universe than IUB with respect to job placement. Transfer unless you are targeting Indianapolis or rural Indiana.

This is definitely true when considering an 0L who has no grades and better options. In that case the chances of finishing at the top of the class is very low. But the #1 student (or very very close to #1) will absolutely have much better job options then Indianapolis and rural indiana. The OP needs to weigh his career prospects and debt options.

I didn't think IU-B had any HYS transfers in the class of 2013?

Edit: quoted the wrong person.

I think this was to my earlier post. I know nothing about 2013 (I was class of 2012). But there was an HLS transfer in 2011.

[RMstratosphere]

Congrats on stellar grades, that is quite an accomplishment. DID YOU ALSO GET THE COVETED HIGH PASS IN LRW?

Anyway, here is the story. I think it makes sense to go ED at UChicago in your situation. You cannot be certain that you will keep this torrid pace alive next semester and this gives you some decent insurance. I also don't think that HYS is a lock for anyone even if you are #1 which you may not be with those grades.

If you don't get in, you should be a lock at Northwestern as long as you stay in the top 10% or so.

Whether it is worth it or not is another question altogether. Depends on your goals. In a perverse way, if all you want in life is Chicago Biglaw, you might be just fine in staying at IU because, if you stay #1 and perhaps become Editor in Chief of the ILJ, someone like Tinder or Hamilton will almost assuredly offer you a clerkship which would likely lead to a big firm job in Chicago right out of the gate. Law Review is no guarantee at any transfer school and is even tougher at UChicago and HLS than anywhere else. Plus even though Chicago Biglaw doesnt visit IU for OCI (with the exception of Jones Day which isn't a Chicago "native"), IU kids will still be at Kirkland, Mayer Brown and Sidley this summer, I am sure. Jenner and Winston, I am not positive about.

PM me if you want more detailed thoughts.

To put this into perspective, there is exactly one student from IU-B going to one of the two Chicago firms this summer that account for ~50% of Chicago biglaw SA spots ITE.

There are two going to Mayer Brown and four going to Chapman and Cutler.

[RMstratosphere]

Northwestern & Chicago are in a different universe than IUB with respect to job placement. Transfer unless you are targeting Indianapolis or rural Indiana.

This is definitely true when considering an 0L who has no grades and better options. In that case the chances of finishing at the top of the class is very low. But the #1 student (or very very close to #1) will absolutely have much better job options then Indianapolis and rural indiana. The OP needs to weigh his career prospects and debt options.

I didn't think IU-B had any HYS transfers in the class of 2013?

Edit: quoted the wrong person.

I think this was to my earlier post. I know nothing about 2013 (I was class of 2012). But there was an HLS transfer in 2011.

No one from my class (2013) transferred to HYS. The highest transfer was to Columbia.

[eastcoast_iub]

RMStratosphere, Do you know the class rank of the person who xferred to Columbia?

I got a 3.73, which is top 5% based on last 2 years' numbers. Thinking of applying to Columbia, NYU, Penn, UVA, and Harvard (long shot).

What are my chances? And are all of these schools worth xferring to and leaving 40k on the table?

Goal is DC BigLaw...

[downstream]

You need to stop thinking about potential rankings and worry about owning second semester and it is a different beast than first semester. Legal Professions is a total black box and has the potential to really harm a GPA. Conlaw is very professor dependent and is a tough class, maybe the toughest class you will take all year. Property is basically Torts all over again.

The kid who xferred to Columbia was likely top 5%, nobody knows these things for sure. The Northwestern kids were all in the top 10%, some closer to top 5% and above. Transferring is never a guarantee. All you can do is work your butt off again but keep in mind that some kids will be pushing even harder second semester than first semester while others will have gotten their grades back and will quit trying.

Congrats on a hell of a good start.

EDIT: you'll only get UVA if you are a Virginia resident and HLS if you are #1 or #2 which will be a tough climb from where you currently are.

[RMstratosphere]

RMStratosphere, Do you know the class rank of the person who xferred to Columbia?

I got a 3.73, which is top 5% based on last 2 years' numbers. Thinking of applying to Columbia, NYU, Penn, UVA, and Harvard (long shot).

What are my chances? And are all of these schools worth xferring to and leaving 40k on the table?

Goal is DC BigLaw...

I don't know off-hand, but I do know that he is on TLS. I'll take a look around for his handle (I don't remember it) and send you a PM. At any rate, congratulations on the great start.

Your transfer chances are obviously dependent on your second semester performance. As has been said many time, second semester is challenging in different ways but you'll have to maintain or improve your grades to stay competitive. That disclaimer being said, I'd evaluate your chances, assuming that you are in the top 5% after second semester, as...

Harvard: Not accepted unless you are top 1%. If you do get accepted here you have a real decision on your hands. It will come down to your risk tolerance, desired career path, and access to capital.
UVA: Not accepted, but I wouldn't counsel leaving IU's money for UVA anyway. The DC market is intensely competitive (some say the most competitive market) and UVA students aren't doing tremendously well there as it is.
Penn: Probably accepted.
NYU: Maybe accepted, but again, I wouldn't suggest transferring to NYU instead of keeping your GPA and $ at IU.
Columbia: Maybe accepted. I think transferring to Columbia and leaving $40k/yr on the table can make sense in a lot of situations depending on your goals.

If you're set on DC Biglaw from IU your only two viable options are Jones Day and Arnold & Porter. IU has a strong relationship with both firm (JD's DC office). I would suggest you start talking with Dean Keller and the folks in OCPD about your goals in the near term.

[RMstratosphere]

You need to stop thinking about potential rankings and worry about owning second semester and it is a different beast than first semester. Legal Professions is a total black box and has the potential to really harm a GPA. Conlaw is very professor dependent and is a tough class, maybe the toughest class you will take all year. Property is basically Torts all over again.

The kid who xferred to Columbia was likely top 5%, nobody knows these things for sure. The Northwestern kids were all in the top 10%, some closer to top 5% and above. Transferring is never a guarantee. All you can do is work your butt off again but keep in mind that some kids will be pushing even harder second semester than first semester while others will have gotten their grades back and will quit trying.

Congrats on a hell of a good start.

EDIT: you'll only get UVA if you are a Virginia resident and HLS if you are #1 or #2 which will be a tough climb from where you currently are.

I agree with nearly all of the above.