Mass mailing is so frustrating

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Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 30, 2017 9:36 pm

Mass mailed to 50 firms or so. No response at all. Except the automatically generated "thank you for your application"

I'm not sure how effective is mass mailing. What is the chance you can get a screener? 1 out of 100? Really wanna get some extra screeners in addition to OCI.

(My background: mid-T13 + irrelevant WE + actively involved in law school + pretty confident with social and interview skills + (*cry) slightly below median grades, shoot for NYC-firms.)

varcom24

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby varcom24 » Fri Jun 30, 2017 9:45 pm

It's still early. I did some mass mailing last year to hit markets not within reach of my school's OCI. Started sending materials in early July, but didn't hear back until weeks later. It's important to realize that if you're mailing a standard biglaw firm with a summer program, the people who manage the firm's law school recruiting efforts are likely focusing most of their time/energy managing the current class of SAs right now. I was a SA last summer and I remember it wasn't until mid-July that the recruiting ppl starting asking us if we had anyone we wanted to recommend they look at for the this summer's class (not saying we had any pull whatsoever, but it does give an idea of when firms start shifting focus to the following summer).

From my experience, firms that participate in OCI will either hit up mass mail applicants right before OCI for a pre-OCI screener that will put you on schedule with their other OCI callbacks (should you get a callback), OR they will wait until very late in the OCI process to look through mass mail applications when they have an idea of how many spots they have left in their class to fill.

That being said, I had a lot of success with mass mailing by networking like hell in June (via email). After talking to anyone who I could get on the phone and asking questions, by mid-July I was able to convert those conversations into a direct channel to recruiting from someone already at the firm.

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jchiles

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby jchiles » Fri Jun 30, 2017 10:15 pm

It sucks but it only has to work once

grades??

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby grades?? » Fri Jun 30, 2017 10:30 pm

you should also be networking hard. Like emailing every possible alum at big firms to get coffee/ talk on the phone.

clshopeful

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby clshopeful » Fri Jun 30, 2017 10:53 pm

My SA is solely from landing a MM callback and getting an offer. Even if it is a .1% chance, you need to do it until you have an offer in hand

Anonymous User
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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:10 am

I sent ~250 and got about 5 screeners, 3 callbacks, and an offer.

Anonymous User
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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 01, 2017 4:15 am

I sent almost 400 emails out and got 1 offer from it.

100000% worth it.

Would do it all over again.


50 is nothing. Keep grinding.

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 01, 2017 10:26 am

Keep going, promise it will be worth it. Hustle hard.

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Dr. Nefario

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Dr. Nefario » Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Mass mailed to 50 firms or so. No response at all. Except the automatically generated "thank you for your application"

I'm not sure how effective is mass mailing. What is the chance you can get a screener? 1 out of 100? Really wanna get some extra screeners in addition to OCI.

(My background: mid-T13 + irrelevant WE + actively involved in law school + pretty confident with social and interview skills + (*cry) slightly below median grades, shoot for NYC-firms.)


over 700 apps last summer. roughly 3 interviews before I accepted an offer, then about 10 after I had already accepted one. It just takes time. Its only July 1st. chill out.

favabeansoup

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby favabeansoup » Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:36 pm

1% chance for $180k job. Definitely worth it. Especially when all that is really required for mass mailing is sending out a million emails.

For tons of people it doesn't work at all. However, it does work for some people, so always always do it.

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:15 pm

Are you emailing to recruiting or a hiring partner?

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abogadesq

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby abogadesq » Sat Jul 01, 2017 9:36 pm

Yeah, 50 is not a lot. At the same time, though, don't sell yourself out by applying for firms in areas of law or locations that you know you won't like. A desirable offer maybe right around the corner.

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Vincent Adultman

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Vincent Adultman » Sat Jul 01, 2017 11:53 pm

Unemployment is pretty frustrating too.

malibustacy

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby malibustacy » Sun Jul 02, 2017 12:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Mass mailed to 50 firms or so. No response at all. Except the automatically generated "thank you for your application"

I'm not sure how effective is mass mailing. What is the chance you can get a screener? 1 out of 100? Really wanna get some extra screeners in addition to OCI.

(My background: mid-T13 + irrelevant WE + actively involved in law school + pretty confident with social and interview skills + (*cry) slightly below median grades, shoot for NYC-firms.)


It takes time. You can't expect these firms to immediately offer you a callback with your numbers, especially when OCI hasn't even started.

What is happening at my firm is recruiting literally prints out dozens of these emails/resumes a day, and keep them in a folder. Someone will review them later, and contact you based on that.

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Big Red

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Big Red » Sun Jul 02, 2017 7:38 pm

Yes, now keep mailing

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 03, 2017 2:53 pm

How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 03, 2017 3:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote:How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.


I am also curious about this. I'm at one of HYS, if I had to guess, top 5-10%. I'd say I have below average work experience, and no law review or moot court. I'd really like D.C. I'm just swamped this summer (I leave for work at like 6 am and return 9 pm), and often don't have the energy to individually tailor each letter. Is it okay to just change the address bar, or is individualized information for each firm must-have?

BigZuck

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby BigZuck » Mon Jul 03, 2017 6:58 pm

Balance tailoring as much as possible with maximum blasting. Use your judgment.

GoneSouth

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby GoneSouth » Mon Jul 03, 2017 7:26 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.


I am also curious about this. I'm at one of HYS, if I had to guess, top 5-10%. I'd say I have below average work experience, and no law review or moot court. I'd really like D.C. I'm just swamped this summer (I leave for work at like 6 am and return 9 pm), and often don't have the energy to individually tailor each letter. Is it okay to just change the address bar, or is individualized information for each firm must-have?


Are you mailing to try to get pre-OCI interviews? Bc oh will get whatever you want at OCI.

But it's really not that hard to put one personalized sentence in your five-sentence cover letter. Do that. (And if you're sending long cover letters, you're doing it wrong)

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:57 pm

GoneSouth wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.


I am also curious about this. I'm at one of HYS, if I had to guess, top 5-10%. I'd say I have below average work experience, and no law review or moot court. I'd really like D.C. I'm just swamped this summer (I leave for work at like 6 am and return 9 pm), and often don't have the energy to individually tailor each letter. Is it okay to just change the address bar, or is individualized information for each firm must-have?


Are you mailing to try to get pre-OCI interviews? Bc oh will get whatever you want at OCI.

But it's really not that hard to put one personalized sentence in your five-sentence cover letter. Do that. (And if you're sending long cover letters, you're doing it wrong)


Thanks for the vote of confidence. I'm just trying to target some markets that do not really come to our OCI, and maybe some pre-OCI interviews at some that do. I'm not the best interviewer, as I can come on too strong, so I hope that maybe snagging an offer will help me calm down and not do that at the real thing.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 04, 2017 12:57 am

GoneSouth wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.


I am also curious about this. I'm at one of HYS, if I had to guess, top 5-10%. I'd say I have below average work experience, and no law review or moot court. I'd really like D.C. I'm just swamped this summer (I leave for work at like 6 am and return 9 pm), and often don't have the energy to individually tailor each letter. Is it okay to just change the address bar, or is individualized information for each firm must-have?


Are you mailing to try to get pre-OCI interviews? Bc oh will get whatever you want at OCI.

But it's really not that hard to put one personalized sentence in your five-sentence cover letter. Do that. (And if you're sending long cover letters, you're doing it wrong)


UCLA/USC anon here. Any chance you could provide a sample one sentence? Can it be something generic like, I'm impressed by your firm's diversity or pro bono focus or practice group? And when you say five-sentence cover letter, are you talking about the 2nd paragraph? My resume currently has 3 sentences in paragraph 1, 5-7 in 2, and 2 in 3. I just followed the generic formatting my law school gave me/what I found online.

Anonymous User
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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:20 am

I am sure your school has a mock interview program. Use it. You got this.

Anonymous User wrote:
GoneSouth wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.


I am also curious about this. I'm at one of HYS, if I had to guess, top 5-10%. I'd say I have below average work experience, and no law review or moot court. I'd really like D.C. I'm just swamped this summer (I leave for work at like 6 am and return 9 pm), and often don't have the energy to individually tailor each letter. Is it okay to just change the address bar, or is individualized information for each firm must-have?


Are you mailing to try to get pre-OCI interviews? Bc oh will get whatever you want at OCI.

But it's really not that hard to put one personalized sentence in your five-sentence cover letter. Do that. (And if you're sending long cover letters, you're doing it wrong)


Thanks for the vote of confidence. I'm just trying to target some markets that do not really come to our OCI, and maybe some pre-OCI interviews at some that do. I'm not the best interviewer, as I can come on too strong, so I hope that maybe snagging an offer will help me calm down and not do that at the real thing.

GoneSouth

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby GoneSouth » Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:21 am

Anonymous User wrote:
GoneSouth wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.


I am also curious about this. I'm at one of HYS, if I had to guess, top 5-10%. I'd say I have below average work experience, and no law review or moot court. I'd really like D.C. I'm just swamped this summer (I leave for work at like 6 am and return 9 pm), and often don't have the energy to individually tailor each letter. Is it okay to just change the address bar, or is individualized information for each firm must-have?


Are you mailing to try to get pre-OCI interviews? Bc oh will get whatever you want at OCI.

But it's really not that hard to put one personalized sentence in your five-sentence cover letter. Do that. (And if you're sending long cover letters, you're doing it wrong)


UCLA/USC anon here. Any chance you could provide a sample one sentence? Can it be something generic like, I'm impressed by your firm's diversity or pro bono focus or practice group? And when you say five-sentence cover letter, are you talking about the 2nd paragraph? My resume currently has 3 sentences in paragraph 1, 5-7 in 2, and 2 in 3. I just followed the generic formatting my law school gave me/what I found online.


Are you sending actual cover letters (as in attached PDFs)? If you're a strong candidate trying to get pre-OCI interviews, I don't think you have to do this. Just write a quick five-sentence note in the body of the email and attach your resume and transcript. A long cover letter is more useful if you really have to sell yourself beyond your grades/resume (maybe this is necessary from UCLA/USC? I have no idea, so perhaps trust your career services).

As far as the one sentence, something like I'm really impressed by and interested in your XX group, or, I met XX attorney at a reception and was impressed by what he had to say about XX. I wouldn't lead with pro bono unless it's somewhere like Arnold & Porter, but I think diversity is ok.

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tyrant_flycatcher

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Re: Mass mailing is so frustrating

Postby tyrant_flycatcher » Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:26 am

Anonymous User wrote:How much tailoring is involved in mass mailing? I doubt people who send in hundreds of apps have a chance to do in depth research and/or contact people at the firm. So would it be okay for me to send the exact same, generic cover letter to multiple firms?

I'm at UCLA/USC with a GPA .02 below the median, decent work experience (law firm, non-profit, externship), but no journals/moot court. I'd love to stay in LA, but should I also spam NY? Concerned because LA firms mostly have small classes, but I have no ties to NY.


I don't think the answer is to send the exact same cover letter. I also don't think the answer is to individually tailor every last application. I might try drafting a few different cover letters, each geared toward a different group of firms. When I MM'd, I had previous work experience that was ever so slightly related to an industry that some law firms are involved with. I then found a list of firms that are considered big players in that industry, and sent them virtually identical cover letters explaining my interest in that industry. I only sent out a handful of emails before an offer from OCI came in, but if I was going to MM again, I would find a different part of my background that was somehow connected to a practice group and rinse and repeat.



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