Georgetown EIW - 2016

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elmar
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Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby elmar » Mon Jun 13, 2016 11:56 am

Is it too soon to get this cycle's EIW thread rolling? I met with a Career Counselor last week who told me that, despite what I thought was the conventional wisdom to bid conservatively, I should to be more not less aggressive in bidding firms where I was below median, both in DC and generally. Wished I'd had a EIW thread to share it in, so here we are.
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Georgetown 2014 EIW: viewtopic.php?t=230278

Georgetown 2015 EIW: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=249835
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Please Use Anonymous Handles

We all want to maintain some privacy during this process. That said, it is also nice to keep track of who is saying what. I’m going to recommend that everyone pick a handle to sign their anonymous posts with (you obviously don’t have to) so that we can keep track of one another.

Bidding

The basics of bidlist stuff should be straightforward even if you’re not Socrates: if you think other people are more likely to bid on a firm, you should bid it high. Firms that are less grade-selective or that have fewer interview spots are more competitive, so you should probably rank them higher.

Callbacks

Once we’re at least part way through the first rings of interviewing hell, people will get callbacks. In past years, people would post the firm name and the initials of the person who interviewed them when they received a callback so that people would know that callbacks had gone out.
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Good luck. If all else fails, just remember that you go to the best damn Law Center there is.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 13, 2016 12:01 pm

elmar wrote:Is it too soon to get this cycle's EIW thread rolling? I met with a Career Counselor last week who told me that, despite what I thought was the conventional wisdom to bid conservatively, I should to be more not less aggressive in bidding firms where I was below median, both in DC and generally. Wished I'd had a EIW thread to share it in


I can give specific transfer advice if anyone wants it (quote and I can PM).

A word of advice, our career center is pretty good at hustling to get you in front of interviewers. But I would STRONGY CAUTION their advice upon all other matters.

TLS wisdom provides a solid set of tips that should be followed, which are often contradictory to OCS advice.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 13, 2016 3:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
A word of advice, our career center is pretty good at hustling to get you in front of interviewers. But I would STRONGY CAUTION their advice upon all other matters.

TLS wisdom provides a solid set of tips that should be followed, which are often contradictory to OCS advice.


can you elaborate on this?

FC

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 13, 2016 3:46 pm

How are people tackling mass-mailing? Pre-bid lottery or post?

FC

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thelincolnlawyer
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby thelincolnlawyer » Mon Jun 13, 2016 4:07 pm

tag

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buckiguy_sucks
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby buckiguy_sucks » Mon Jun 13, 2016 4:22 pm

I have literally never had OCS tell me non-TLS mantra advice and I don't have the counsellor all the 2Ls tell me is best I think that OCS being bad is flame

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buckiguy_sucks
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby buckiguy_sucks » Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:36 pm

Anonymous User wrote:How are people tackling mass-mailing? Pre-bid lottery or post?

FC


my plan is to pre-bid mail the practice area in the market i want and post bid to do an actual mass mail with specific emphasis on the firms that i bid and didn't get

this is overly ambitious though and i'm sure steps two and three won't materialize

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EncyclopediaOrange
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby EncyclopediaOrange » Tue Jun 14, 2016 12:04 am

Anonymous User wrote:I can give specific transfer advice if anyone wants it (quote and I can PM).

A word of advice, our career center is pretty good at hustling to get you in front of interviewers. But I would STRONGY CAUTION their advice upon all other matters.

TLS wisdom provides a solid set of tips that should be followed, which are often contradictory to OCS advice.


Tag. Would love some specific transfer advice......

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:32 am

buckiguy_sucks wrote:my plan is to pre-bid mail the practice area in the market i want and post bid to do an actual mass mail with specific emphasis on the firms that i bid and didn't get


what is your expectation from pre-bid mailing? / is the process 1) email contact 2) send resume&transcript 3) expect early screener?
or given known contact 3) expect early "call back"?

is it possible to enter OCI with offers? (also posting this in the Ask GULC forum)

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Capitol_Idea
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Capitol_Idea » Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:35 am

buckiguy_sucks wrote:I have literally never had OCS tell me non-TLS mantra advice and I don't have the counsellor all the 2Ls tell me is best I think that OCS being bad is flame
OCS is very cautious - they want you to get A job but they don't necessarily care if you get the BEST job you can get. They'll do their best to help you think about angles you might not have otherwise considered (Maybe look into this or that secondary market, etc.) but I found their advice to be not well tailored to my own needs/desire nor to my particular grades/resume.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby buckiguy_sucks » Tue Jun 14, 2016 12:59 pm

Capitol_Idea wrote:
buckiguy_sucks wrote:I have literally never had OCS tell me non-TLS mantra advice and I don't have the counsellor all the 2Ls tell me is best I think that OCS being bad is flame
OCS is very cautious - they want you to get A job but they don't necessarily care if you get the BEST job you can get. They'll do their best to help you think about angles you might not have otherwise considered (Maybe look into this or that secondary market, etc.) but I found their advice to be not well tailored to my own needs/desire nor to my particular grades/resume.


yeah they are definitely cautious but given the ridiculous optimism it some of my peers it's pretty justified I think

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buckiguy_sucks
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby buckiguy_sucks » Tue Jun 14, 2016 1:00 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
buckiguy_sucks wrote:my plan is to pre-bid mail the practice area in the market i want and post bid to do an actual mass mail with specific emphasis on the firms that i bid and didn't get


what is your expectation from pre-bid mailing? / is the process 1) email contact 2) send resume&transcript 3) expect early screener?
or given known contact 3) expect early "call back"?

is it possible to enter OCI with offers? (also posting this in the Ask GULC forum)


Hoping to get early screener and it will mostly be through attorneys I've ~~networked with~~

Dunno about offers but certainly callbacks

WhiskeyAndCupcakes
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby WhiskeyAndCupcakes » Tue Jun 14, 2016 2:06 pm

.
Last edited by WhiskeyAndCupcakes on Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Capitol_Idea
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Capitol_Idea » Tue Jun 14, 2016 2:09 pm

WhiskeyAndCupcakes wrote:At what point would you consider a firm's median GPA from the spreadsheet a "reach"? Like if you are below it at all, even like .01? Or more once you are like .05 away from it? I want to limit reaches but don't know if being right at/marginally below a firm's median makes it an actual reach.
Anecdotal, but it seems to matter more for the more demanding firms than the lower. So if you're looking at WilmerHale's 3.8, your 3.75 ain't gonna cut it (I don't think it's an auto-ding, but you'd have to be exceptional or have connections to really work it, I think). If you're looking at Crowell (what are they, 3.5? let's just say 3.5), then your 3.45 isn't gonna make them blink.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 3:34 pm

Is there any danger in bidding more than two markets (DC, Ny, Chi, other) as long as you still bid smart based on grade data and stats? If it nets you the same number of interviews you're not in a worse position than if you cut one or two out yeah? Except in that NY has more SA spots per interview (? right?) so you're kind of reducing your chances by bidding a market other than NY in any case but if you do DC, Chi, NY, other you're in no different of a place than doing DC + NY or other + NY or Chi + NY right

-Max Scherzer

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 4:31 pm

I've heard two ways of bidding

1. reach (top choice)
2. at GPA (top choice in range)
3. safety (top choice in range)
4. reach (second choice)
5. at GPA (second choice in range)
5. safety (second choice in range)

and

1. reach (top choice)
2. reach (second choice)
3. reach (third choice)
4. at GPA (top choice in range)
5. at GPA (second choice in range)
6. at GPA (second choice in range)
7. safety (top choice in range)
8. safety (second choice in range)
9. safety (third choice in range)
..start over?

what is the best way to bid? do we all get our top 20 interviews or is it some algorithm?

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Capitol_Idea
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Capitol_Idea » Tue Jun 14, 2016 4:36 pm

All preselects by firms go through first. Then it's an algorithm. They randomize everybody and give each person their first choice unless it's unavailable then they go to that person's next choice. Then they do another pass for people's 2nd choice (or third, etc. depending on which they're on). So what matters more for bidding is number of bids for that firm rather than pure prestige. Below median kids ain't bidding WilmerHale or Williams & Connolly, but some like Arnold & Porter seem to always be wildly popular. OCS has this data online.

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elmar
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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby elmar » Tue Jun 14, 2016 4:59 pm

Is there any conventional wisdom about how firms choose pre-selects relative to the firm's historical median GPA? I can imagine firms trying to use the opportunity to get students with high GPAs above the firm's median because it's an opportunity to do so, but I also see the logic in pre-selecting students in upper part of the historical range because those students are more likely to actually accept an offer.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby buckiguy_sucks » Tue Jun 14, 2016 5:01 pm

elmar wrote:Is there any conventional wisdom about how firms choose pre-selects relative to the firm's historical median GPA? I can imagine firms trying to use the opportunity to get students with high GPAs above the firm's median because it's an opportunity to do so, but I also see the logic in pre-selecting students in upper part of the historical range because those students are more likely to actually accept an offer.


I think pre-selections are more about people with impressive resumes than people with impressive GPAs but I could be wrong

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 5:15 pm

C/O 2016, starting at firm in September

When I did EIW, I wanted a very particular market, and only 5ish firms from that market came to EIW. Other than bidding all of those firms/offices high, it wasn't an easy choice deciding how else to use my bids.

I think I underestimated my credentials a bit and I wound up with a pretty conservative list. I used several high bids on "safe" choices (big NYC classes with median GPAs more than a tenth of a point below mine). Several of those turned into callbacks which I ended up cancelling. I think there is a lot to be said for bidding conservatively, because by far the most important priority is coming away with a job, even if it's not the job, but I wound up getting an offer from a firm that I thought was a reach, and so did many of my friends, so there isn't necessarily anything wrong with bidding some firms that seem to be reaches as long as you make sure you get in front of plenty of good fits as well.

So much of this is specific to individual circumstances, so I don't think one-size-fits-all advice is all that useful, but some things are probably generally applicable.

First, if the process is still the same as it was for us, if you put a firm anywhere on your bid list, they can preselect you. You're probably not going to get the firms at the bottom of your list through the lottery, but if you use those spots for firms that aren't your top choice but for which you wouldn't mind getting a preselect screener, you can still get some yield from those spots.

Second, check when OCS makes open signups available. I added 4 screener interviews through open signups ( I think I had to do this over two days because there was a cap of 2 per 24 hours, but I don't remember the specifics). Lots of people drop interview slots, so you'd be surprised how many good ones are available if you are ready to take them in the first 30 seconds it opens up.

Good luck, everybody.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 5:24 pm

If you plan on bidding a secondary market with super high bid to interview ratios you can put those very low right

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:49 pm

don't listen to OCS, follow the threads on here for advice. 2016 grad here who who did well, all my friends did well -- that includes people way below median. Hustle, bid smart, bid NYC, Be prepared, this one is kinda vain but true-- look good? Be clean, professional, you've got a few months if you need to drop some pounds, get a decent fitting suit. You can't help your grades at this point but you can help the other parts. good luck everyone.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:56 pm

can an alum speak to how many bids turn into screeners? do most people get their top 20? or should we count on less?

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:57 pm

Anonymous User wrote:can an alum speak to how many bids turn into screeners? do most people get their top 20? or should we count on less?


I'm pretty sure I ended up with 21 when everything was settled.

Most people did not have that many.

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Re: Georgetown EIW - 2016

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:can an alum speak to how many bids turn into screeners? do most people get their top 20? or should we count on less?


I'm pretty sure I ended up with 21 when everything was settled.

Most people did not have that many.


are you the above poster who bid conservatively?




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